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#260293 - 06/07/06 07:17 PM Re: Return to the Source [Re: harlan]
SpeedyGonzales Offline
Member

Registered: 08/16/05
Posts: 320
^ Yup. And even if someone told you who/what the source was, you probably wouldn't believe them or care until you discover it on your own.

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#260294 - 06/08/06 12:59 PM Re: Return to the Source [Re: SpeedyGonzales]
Stormdragon Offline
Who Dares Wins
Professional Poster

Registered: 08/05/04
Posts: 3409
Loc: Salem, OR
Quote:

I take it as a half-truth/half-lie. There are definitely some things which are better when we were in the "beginner's mind". Especially physically and in MA.

But morally, I disagree. Kid's aren't taught to lie. They figure it out themselves. I'm sure everyone remembers an early day that they "decided" to lie realizing that a lie could prevent punishment. Kids are amazingly violent too.

And everyone has their own "natural" issue they struggle with. Basically, every soul has some vulnerability. That is where "changing the source" comes into play.




So does this mean that people are naturally flawed and "evil" for lack of a better word, and lean more towards selfishness, greed, and other bad traits, or is it a product of our culture?
_________________________
Member of DaJoGen MMA school under Dave Hagen and Team Chaos fight team under Denver Mangiyatan and Chris Toquero, ran out of Zanshin Martial Arts in Salem Oregon: http://www.zanshinarts.org/Home.aspx,

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#260295 - 06/08/06 04:05 PM Re: Return to the Source [Re: Stormdragon]
trevek Offline
Professional Poster

Registered: 05/15/05
Posts: 3337
Loc: Poland
Yes they are, because what is good and bad is a moral code set by society.

Survival, getting the most food etc, are natural tendencies which society can teach us to supress or develop.

The thing is that people, like other animals, also have a natural endency to seek out company and be nice to each other too.
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#260296 - 06/08/06 05:21 PM Re: Return to the Source [Re: trevek]
Kosh Offline
Member

Registered: 03/04/05
Posts: 302
Loc: Novo mesto, Slovenia
When people see things as beautiful,
ugliness is created.
When people see things as good,
evil is created.

Anyways, the meaning of returning to the source depends on the context. If I see just the words, "returning to the source", and there is no context, my meaning for it is perhaps more spiritual. For me it is returning to the beginning. Beginning of what? Everything. And/Or maybe realizing the source...

Harlan, did you have any specific context in mind?
_________________________
Peter ...Understanding is a three-edged sword...

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#260297 - 06/08/06 08:22 PM Re: Return to the Source [Re: Kosh]
harlan Offline
Professional Poster

Registered: 07/31/04
Posts: 6664
Loc: Amherst, MA
Nope. Just what it means to me...something to think about.

Quote:

Harlan, did you have any specific context in mind?



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#260298 - 06/08/06 11:01 PM Re: Return to the Source [Re: harlan]
Mr_Heretik Offline
Veteran

Registered: 05/20/05
Posts: 1074
Loc: Bronx NY, USA
The Source?

The Matrix, duh..


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#260299 - 06/08/06 11:16 PM Re: Return to the Source [Re: Mr_Heretik]
Stormdragon Offline
Who Dares Wins
Professional Poster

Registered: 08/05/04
Posts: 3409
Loc: Salem, OR
So without the imprint and indoctrination of society we are clean slates that are not good or bad, but just, are?
_________________________
Member of DaJoGen MMA school under Dave Hagen and Team Chaos fight team under Denver Mangiyatan and Chris Toquero, ran out of Zanshin Martial Arts in Salem Oregon: http://www.zanshinarts.org/Home.aspx,

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#260300 - 06/09/06 12:08 AM Re: Return to the Source [Re: Stormdragon]
SpeedyGonzales Offline
Member

Registered: 08/16/05
Posts: 320
who ever said we are clean slates? Which one of us has not sinned? (I can already see someone saying ME sarcastically lol...)

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#260301 - 06/09/06 07:13 AM Re: Return to the Source [Re: SpeedyGonzales]
Kosh Offline
Member

Registered: 03/04/05
Posts: 302
Loc: Novo mesto, Slovenia
When people see things as beautiful,
ugliness is created.
When people see things as good,
evil is created.

Sin is defined/created by society. Like Trevek said, what is good and bad is a moral code set by society. If no one judges, there is no good or bad.
_________________________
Peter ...Understanding is a three-edged sword...

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#260302 - 06/09/06 08:43 PM Re: Return to the Source [Re: Kosh]
Stormdragon Offline
Who Dares Wins
Professional Poster

Registered: 08/05/04
Posts: 3409
Loc: Salem, OR
So then, an extension of that is, why were laws and rules created or sent to us in the first place? And what about the laws of nature which allow our species and at htis poit, all other species to continue to survive?
Only kill other creatures or people in self defense or the defense of your family, innocent people, territory or food supplies, etc., or, in the case of animal life, for needed food.

3. Only take the amount of resources form the world that you actually need, never too much or too little; you may take more than you need only if everyone in your community has had their fair share and agree to allow you to have extra and if that extra is non-perishable.

4. Use everything you take from the world and nature. Never waste anything.

5. Allow all other creatures access to food supplies and needed physical resources. Never deny them of what they need, except when hunting them for needed food.

6. Everyone in the community has to do their share of work for the community. Everyone has a job or place within the community.

7. Never take anything that has been rightfully claimed by another person or animal.
_________________________
Member of DaJoGen MMA school under Dave Hagen and Team Chaos fight team under Denver Mangiyatan and Chris Toquero, ran out of Zanshin Martial Arts in Salem Oregon: http://www.zanshinarts.org/Home.aspx,

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