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#251555 - 05/07/06 07:16 AM King of swords, some questions.
Sten443 Offline
Newbie

Registered: 05/07/06
Posts: 5
http://www.kingofswords.com/

First, sorry if this isnt the right place for these questions!

Well im intreasted in knife throwing, so im going to buy my first Throwing knifes there.
Hevyer ones for longer distance throws, as ive heard heavyers are better at longer distance.
http://www.kingofswords.com/product_info.php/cPath/482_475_264/products_id/3013
And smaller ones, also cheaper ones, if somewhy i wont like the heavy ones or any other reason... and for less distance throws.
http://www.kingofswords.com/product_info.php/cPath/482_475_264/products_id/10680

The main question is, can i trust king of swords?
I really havent heard anything about them, only know them from website, and they dont have forum too, at least i havent found it..
Second, how long should they ship to estonia?

And if anyone really someone has proof, that they dont send items or anything like this :S
Is there any other places i can buy the Same knifes for same price and what also sends the items to estonia, and doesnt ask more than 30$ for shipping?

Thx!

Edit//
What kind of steel is 440K Stainless Steel?


Edited by Sten443 (05/07/06 07:26 AM)

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#251556 - 05/07/06 09:29 AM Re: King of swords, some questions. [Re: Sten443]
Charles Mahan Offline
Professional Poster

Registered: 06/14/04
Posts: 2502
Loc: Denton, Tx, USA
Well. You should probably read this thread:

http://www.fightingarts.com/ubbthreads/showflat.php/Cat/0/Number/15829186/an/0/page/0#15829186

I'd say the owner of King of Swords, didn't handle himself very well in that exchange. I know nothing about their knives but their swords should probably be avoided if your goal is to find something you can train with.

You might try this question over at http://www.e-budo.com/forum/forumdisplay.php?f=31

That might be a good forum for this query. At the very least someone there might be able to point you in the right direction.
_________________________
Iaido - Breaking down bad habits, and building new ones.

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#251557 - 05/07/06 12:04 PM Re: King of swords, some questions. [Re: Charles Mahan]
Sten443 Offline
Newbie

Registered: 05/07/06
Posts: 5
Thx,

Ive been posted this to some forums now, everyone tells me to go some other forum, and from other forums they send me to another again...

So if anyone knows do they send the items and everythig is ok, let me know, thx!

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#251558 - 05/08/06 09:03 PM Re: King of swords, some questions. [Re: Sten443]
whitedragon_48 Offline
Member

Registered: 09/29/04
Posts: 185
Loc: W. Phoenix, AZ US
[quoteWhat kind of steel is 440K Stainless Steel?




As far as my metallurgy goes, it doesn't exist. the 400 family of steels is comprised by:
420 Very low end stuff
420JC Low end stuff used for wall hangers
420HC Better that the above given the extra amoutn of carbon
440A Low end but better than 420's. Used on crappy knives
440B Better than 440A, more carbon
440C The best of the 440 family
Also, there is or used to be 440V (AKA S60V) which has Vanadium.

Either 440C or 440V makes a decent knife. 440K doesn't exist... yet.
_________________________
Yours in the Spirit of the Warrior-Scholar, Carlos M. Roman, Senior Instructor American Kenpo

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#251559 - 05/09/06 12:55 PM Re: King of swords, some questions. [Re: whitedragon_48]
Benjamin1986 Offline
Enthusiast

Registered: 10/17/04
Posts: 611
Loc: Republic of Texas
As WD said, 440V and C are best for knives. Higher end kitchen knives are generally made out of either 440 or one of the high charbon stainless (such as VG1). However, the amount of chromium in any stainless makes the steel quite brittle at decent harness. No stainless knife above about eight inches long should be used. Even with a french knife (what most people call a "chef" or "butcher" knife) be careful with it. Don't hack or try to slice with your arm.

About King of Swords, avoid them entirely. Don't even buy your wallhangers from them if you can avoid it. No one who advertises a "full tang" 440C katana as "battle ready" and safe deserves our money.
_________________________
Fencing Club at UH

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#251560 - 05/09/06 01:21 PM Re: King of swords, some questions. [Re: Benjamin1986]
Sten443 Offline
Newbie

Registered: 05/07/06
Posts: 5
Well... somewhy i dont trust king of swords anymore...
Also, i found a knifes what look quite nice to, i hate the looks of that kind of knives acctually, but they are with very dark color, and there very strong, at least they should be, and ive heard that they do good deal.

Well, there Cold Steel knives.
http://www.coldsteel.com/80tkseries.html
Sure flight ones. I would buy 3 of them.

But i didnt find ansver, what payments do they accept, or what would the shipping cost, to bring these to Estonia.

So how do these knives look?
Ive heard that All Cold Steel Knives are Very sharp, strong and do good deals, and the prices dont look so expencive either.

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#251561 - 05/09/06 04:41 PM Re: King of swords, some questions. [Re: Sten443]
pgsmith Offline
Member

Registered: 04/12/05
Posts: 275
Loc: Texas
Cold steel generally makes very good knives. For your other questions, why don't you email them and ask? Seems to me that this would be the best way to get accurate information.
_________________________
Paul

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#251562 - 05/09/06 05:18 PM Re: King of swords, some questions. [Re: pgsmith]
Sten443 Offline
Newbie

Registered: 05/07/06
Posts: 5
Forgot to say ive already sent an email :P
About 26hours ago, hope to get ansver soon =)

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#251563 - 05/09/06 07:59 PM Re: King of swords, some questions. [Re: Benjamin1986]
whitedragon_48 Offline
Member

Registered: 09/29/04
Posts: 185
Loc: W. Phoenix, AZ US
Quote:

About King of Swords, avoid them entirely. Don't even buy your wallhangers from them if you can avoid it. No one who advertises a "full tang" 440C katana as "battle ready" and safe deserves our money.




I totally agree with above, except that the "full tang" katanas he advertises are 440K which we established must be a mithycal new allow conjured by the King's sorcerers hence the "K" Anyways, those sword-like items are most likely 440A. How do you know? Easy. If the blade is stamped 440A or if it is stamped 440 alone. If a manufacturer makes a blade out of the more expensive 440C or 440V he'll want to advertise it by clearly stamping the blade so.

About the King, well... I really cannot say nothing good about him. He makes me really angry Just dont buy from him. There are better sites out there for cutlery.
_________________________
Yours in the Spirit of the Warrior-Scholar, Carlos M. Roman, Senior Instructor American Kenpo

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#251564 - 05/12/06 06:24 PM Re: King of swords, some questions. [Re: whitedragon_48]
Sten443 Offline
Newbie

Registered: 05/07/06
Posts: 5
Well... I just did my order for Cold Steel Sure flight throwers, 3 of these.
As ive looked the videos of other items they offer, im pretty sure these must be great too..

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#251565 - 05/18/06 07:50 PM Re: King of swords, some questions. [Re: Sten443]
Benjamin1986 Offline
Enthusiast

Registered: 10/17/04
Posts: 611
Loc: Republic of Texas
Sten, be careful about Cold Steel Videos. Their knives are good, but their sword videos are simply deceptive.

Crushing a cinder block is not proof of a good sword. It is proof of a sword's ability to act like a crowbar. But, you do not want a crowbar, you want a sword.

Their cutting demonstrations are even worse. Their target aren't standard tatami mats, but loosely rolled beach mats with a gaping hole in the center. I estimate their strength run about 1/8th of a standard tamashighiri target. However, unless you pause the video at the correct instant, you would never know this. For that reason alone, I will not buy from them. Ever.

It is one thing to exaggerate your claims slightly, but open deception cannot be tolerated in a free market.
_________________________
Fencing Club at UH

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#251566 - 05/18/06 11:58 PM Re: King of swords, some questions. [Re: Benjamin1986]
mercierarmory Offline
Member

Registered: 09/26/05
Posts: 44
Loc: Lincoln, Nebraska
Exactly. They are "claiming" you get this wonderful "free" DVD showing their products, but what they are really doing is sending you a commercial trying to show off their products so you are compelled to buy more. I like Cold Steel for their knives, but I have never handled their replica swords in person. I am still curious.

Mike

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#251567 - 05/19/06 11:09 AM Re: King of swords, some questions. [Re: mercierarmory]
pgsmith Offline
Member

Registered: 04/12/05
Posts: 275
Loc: Texas
Quote:

I like Cold Steel for their knives, but I have never handled their replica swords in person. I am still curious.



They aren't too bad, but there are better options out there. They aren't very hard, so they tend not to keep an edge too long. The handles all tend to be a bit on the thin side, so they take adjustment to hold correctly. THe wrap has improved from their earlier stuff, but it still has a tenency to loosen and shift (bad news!). There are other companies that make better Japanese style swords, so I don't generally recommend those from Cold Steel.
_________________________
Paul

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#251568 - 08/31/06 02:53 AM Re: King of swords, some questions. [Re: pgsmith]
Sol Offline
Stranger

Registered: 08/31/06
Posts: 3
where do u guys advise i buy a quality sword, even better how about a replica sword- and if there are no quality replicas then where can i find a katana around 68in (masamune)

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#251569 - 08/31/06 09:39 AM Re: King of swords, some questions. [Re: Sol]
Charles Mahan Offline
Professional Poster

Registered: 06/14/04
Posts: 2502
Loc: Denton, Tx, USA
Quote:

where do u guys advise i buy a quality sword




To be used how? Is it just for show? Do you want to be able to actually join a dojo and train with it? Will you just be hacking up the bushes in you're back yard?

Quote:


, even better how about a replica sword- and if there are no quality replicas then where can i find a katana around 68in (masamune)




Whether or not there are any "quality" replicas, goes back to the previous questions. Quality in what regards? Most of the wallhangers I've seen have been usuited to anything but well, wallhanging. Actually most aren't suited to that as they are utterly hideous.

What in the world do you want with a 68 inch sword? Can I assume you mean total overall length and not blade lenght(which is the usual method of measurement). A applying the 1/3rd rule which states that the tsuka should be roughly 1/3rd the total length of the blade, then a 68" overall length sword would have a 17" handle. Excessive by most measures. There are only a bare handful of schools left which use a sword anywhere near those proportions. None in the US to my knowledge.

Could you're proportions be off? The overall length on most katana used in modern practice are within a two or three inches of 40.

As I mentioned before, usually katana are measured based on the distance between the mune machi and the kissaki.

If I'm using words you don't know, head over to Richard Stein's Japanese Sword Index (Google it) and there are a couple of glossary's and an awful lot of other really good articles to read.
_________________________
Iaido - Breaking down bad habits, and building new ones.

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#251570 - 08/31/06 02:27 PM Re: King of swords, some questions. [Re: Sol]
splice Offline
Member

Registered: 01/24/05
Posts: 230
Loc: Ottawa, ON
Quote:

where can i find a katana around 68in (masamune)




Masamune was a swordsmith, not a type of a sword. A good start would be to get your information about japanese swords in books about japanese swords, not video games about mega corporations that suck the lifeblood of an imaginary planet.

If you want to learn japanese swordsmanship, then feel free to ask questions about that or where you can find a sensei. If you want to have sephiroth's sword, do a google search and ask on anime discussion boards.

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#251571 - 08/31/06 02:32 PM Re: King of swords, some questions. [Re: Sol]
Benjamin1986 Offline
Enthusiast

Registered: 10/17/04
Posts: 611
Loc: Republic of Texas
Sorry, but the only Japanese style sword I know of that length has has already sold (search that page for "Warlord"). They don't make them that long for a very obvious reason; they are very hard to handle. The only reason that 11 lb behemoth was wieldable was due to the 2 1/2 foot grip. It was designed as the ultimate cutting sword, and it does that beautifully, but your arms tire to uselessness after less than five minutes of use.

You refer to the super-long katana as a "masamune", so that tells me one very important thing. You are not Sephiroth; Sephiroth's sword never existed, and Masamune is a legendary swordsmith who forged regular katana, not the name of a specific sword type.

The style is called Odachi, temple sword. The only such blades of that length (or longer) were forged for dedication to a temple as an offering to the heavens and as a display of the smith's skill. A katana of that length is not wide enough to support the stresses of the blade, turning an already fragile weapon (due to the differential temper) into a useless one. Before you ask, no, the Buster sword is not real either.

For good traditional katana, go to Bugei or Swordstore. For less traditional ones, go to Angelsword. For cheaper ones that aren't bad, go to Angus Trim. Avoid anything that says stainless, stay clear of the Paul Chen Practical series, and read the rest of the posts in this thread.
_________________________
Fencing Club at UH

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#251572 - 08/31/06 02:53 PM Re: King of swords, some questions. [Re: Charles Mahan]
splice Offline
Member

Registered: 01/24/05
Posts: 230
Loc: Ottawa, ON
Quote:

[
What in the world do you want with a 68 inch sword? Can I assume you mean total overall length and not blade lenght(which is the usual method of measurement). A applying the 1/3rd rule which states that the tsuka should be roughly 1/3rd the total length of the blade, then a 68" overall length sword would have a 17" handle. Excessive by most measures. There are only a bare handful of schools left which use a sword anywhere near those proportions. None in the US to my knowledge.





Charles, we aren't talking about anything remotely related to japanese swordsmanship or schools thereof. The so-called masamune is a sword from the playstation game "Final Fantasy 7". I don't know where the size comes from, but seeing that pretty much every replica quotes it, it must be from a databook on the game.

In other words, "where can I find the best wallhanger replica from this game", not "where can I find a real japanese sword that's 68 inches long".

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#251573 - 08/31/06 03:07 PM Re: King of swords, some questions. [Re: splice]
Zombie Zero Offline
Compliance & Liability
Veteran

Registered: 06/17/05
Posts: 1993
Loc: Lorton, VA
Quote:

The so-called masamune is a sword from the playstation game "Final Fantasy 7".




Also 'SoulEdge', as wielded by Mitsurugi.

Why, yes, I am a geek. Thank you for noticing!

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#251574 - 08/31/06 04:43 PM Re: King of swords, some questions. [Re: splice]
cxt Offline
Professional Poster

Registered: 09/11/03
Posts: 5823
Loc: USA
Splice

That being the case---then perhaps the poster should have been a bit more specific and actually mentioned the game itself.

I'm kinda freaked that anyone would assume that "I" would just kinda "know" what he was getting at from an obscure game reference.

(I may well be a geek, but I'm not a geek of the "gamer" species-I'm a different phyli altogahter )

I have a couple of nephews that are glued to their playstations morning noon and night---and I was not sure what he was asking either.

For all I know the guy just figured that the Game used actual ie "real" blades as models.

Don't think Charles was "off" in his response at all.

We live we learn


Edited by cxt (08/31/06 04:47 PM)
_________________________
I did battle with ignorance today.......and ignorance won. Huey.

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#251575 - 09/01/06 01:21 AM Re: King of swords, some questions. [Re: cxt]
Sol Offline
Stranger

Registered: 08/31/06
Posts: 3
sorry for the retardation of my question...

-i was completely absent minded at the time and didn't state that i ment of "masamune" quality (please dont say something like thats impossible, it's just a refernce)

-- the reason i want a sword of that length is that its a gift for my big brother= he's 7' 3", 300 pounds so holding a normal sized katana makes him look rediculus but he seriously wants one and he deserves it so i'm trying to find somthing his size he can swing at the bamboo around his house.

- i'm also sorry i put the total length instead of the blade length; the blade length of the replica is 50" of 68"

sorry 4 any trouble i cause with my a.d.d. state of mind- reading my message i feel stupid (don't agree with that last part)

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#251576 - 09/01/06 09:18 AM Re: King of swords, some questions. [Re: Sol]
Charles Mahan Offline
Professional Poster

Registered: 06/14/04
Posts: 2502
Loc: Denton, Tx, USA
This isn't really the proper forum if you are searching for anime/manga/video game related replicas. You would be better off searching a forum dedicated to that kind of stuff and not a martial arts related forum.

If you're brother were to walk into our dojo, I imagine he would eventually be asked to order something in the range of a 2-7-0, which is about a 34 inch blade with somehting in the neighborhood of an 11 inch tsuka. That length of blade would be proportional to his height based on the stylistic preferences of Muso Jikiden Eishin Ryu.
_________________________
Iaido - Breaking down bad habits, and building new ones.

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#251577 - 09/01/06 12:10 PM Re: King of swords, some questions. [Re: Benjamin1986]
pgsmith Offline
Member

Registered: 04/12/05
Posts: 275
Loc: Texas
Quote:

The style is called Odachi, temple sword. The only such blades of that length (or longer) were forged for dedication to a temple as an offering to the heavens and as a display of the smith's skill. A katana of that length is not wide enough to support the stresses of the blade, turning an already fragile weapon (due to the differential temper) into a useless one.



Hey Ben,
That's not entirely true. However, I know of only one school that still teaches the use of very long swords, and it is almost to the point of dying out itself. Please see this link for more information on the Kage ryu ... http://www.hyoho.com/Nkage1.html

The picture comparing the swords used in the school to an ordinary sized katana is pretty impressive!
_________________________
Paul

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#251578 - 09/01/06 01:15 PM Re: King of swords, some questions. [Re: Charles Mahan]
Sol Offline
Stranger

Registered: 08/31/06
Posts: 3
Quote:

If you're brother were to walk into our dojo, I imagine he would eventually be asked to order something in the range of a 2-7-0, which is about a 34 inch blade with somehting in the neighborhood of an 11 inch tsuka. That length of blade would be proportional to his height based on the stylistic preferences of Muso Jikiden Eishin Ryu.





thank you- i'll tell him that ;;;;; with that info i no longer have a reason to participate in this forum or even spend time trying to find an over length sword= BYE

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