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#234948 - 02/28/06 11:52 AM Re: Kickboxing Styles! [Re: Taison]
Cord Offline
Prolific

Registered: 01/13/05
Posts: 11399
Loc: Cambridge UK.
Further info re. Savate.

In competition savate, or 'Boxe Francaise', there are two tiers of scoring, aggression and accuracy, and also style and control. This means that if a fighter uses only basic strikes, but they land effectivley, they may only draw the round if their oponent attempts imaginative and challenging attacks/combos, even if at the expense of successful clean contact.
All kicks must be landed with the boot/foot as the striking body part. Any kicks that impact using the shin do not score, and if deemed to be on purpose, can result in point deduction.
There is no clinching or trapping/catching of the legs allowed whatsoever.

'Savate Defence' is still also taught. This is close to the root of Savate and includes kicking with the shins (more powerfull), use of the knees/elbows/head, and clinch and throw work.
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Don't let the door hit ya' where the good lord split ya'
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#234949 - 02/28/06 12:32 PM Re: Kickboxing Styles! *DELETED* [Re: Taison]
Tower_Bloodthorn Offline
Member

Registered: 08/27/05
Posts: 67
Post deleted by Taison

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#234950 - 02/28/06 12:39 PM Re: Kickboxing Styles! [Re: Tower_Bloodthorn]
MattJ Offline
Free Rhinoplasty!
Prolific

Registered: 11/25/04
Posts: 15634
Loc: York PA. USA
Tower_Bloodthorn -

Use PM for personal questions, please.
_________________________
"In case you ever wondered what it's like to be knocked out, it's like waking up from a nightmare only to discover it wasn't a dream." -Forrest Griffin

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#234951 - 03/01/06 03:32 AM Re: Kickboxing Styles! *DELETED* [Re: Tower_Bloodthorn]
Taison Offline
The Forum Dragon
Professional Poster

Registered: 09/06/05
Posts: 3629
Loc: BKK, Thailand
My bad, I'm stupid and I have to apoligize to Bloodtower_thorn. Please try to contribute information in this thread and if you have any queries, please post them in the boxing forum. If you have any personal information that you want to know, please use PM.
Thank you very much, and my deepest apology to Thorn for being a bit harsh on him. My excuse is insignificant [I haven't slept in 2 days].

-Taison out


Edited by Taison (03/03/06 03:09 AM)
_________________________
I got two fists.. Don't make me use my head as well!

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#234952 - 03/02/06 01:08 AM Re: Kickboxing Styles! [Re: Taison]
Taison Offline
The Forum Dragon
Professional Poster

Registered: 09/06/05
Posts: 3629
Loc: BKK, Thailand
Pankration
Pankration was an ancient sport introduced in the Greek Olympic games in 648 BC. Many historians believe that although Pankration was not one of the first Olympic sports, it was likely the most popular. Some also argue it to be the first all-encompassing fighting system in human history. This is of course a heavily debated issue in the academic community.

The term comes from the Ancient Greek words "pan" (meaning "all") and "kratos" (meaning "[bodily] strength/power"). The term is also used to describe the sport's modern varieties.

Pankration, as practiced in the ancient world, combined elements of both boxing (pygme/pygmachia) and wrestling (pale) to create broad fighting sport similar to today's mixed martial arts. A match was won by submission of the opponent or if the opponent was incapacitated. A contestant could signal submission by raising his hand, but sometimes the only form of submission was unconciousness or death. Joint locks and choke holds were common techniques of accomplishing this. In fact, there were only two rules: contestants were not allowed to gouge eyes or to bite. Grave, even permanent injuries were common, as an accepted means of disabling the adversary: mainly breaking limbs, fingers or even the neck. Pankration bouts were quite brutal and sometimes life-threatening to the competitors. Rules were minimal in number. In addition, there were no weight divisions and no time limits. The fighting arena or "ring" was nomore than twelve to fourteen-feet square to encourage close-quarter action. Referees were armed with stout rods or switches to enforce the rules against biting and gouging. The rules, however, were often broken by some participants who, realizing they were outclassed by a heavier and stronger foe, would resort to such measures to escape being seriously maimed. The contest itself continued uninterrupted until one of the combatants either surrendered, suffered unconsciousness, or, of course, was killed. Although knockouts were common, most pankration battles were decided on the ground where both striking and submission techniques would freely come into play. Pankratiasts were highly-skilled grapplers and were extremely effective in applying a variety of takedowns, chokes, and punishing joint locks. Strangulation was most feared during ground combat, and was the leading cause of death in matches. A fighter would immediately raise his arm in defeat once his opponent's forearm had secured a firm grip across the windpipe or carotid artery.

The ancient Olympics also had a less violent pankration contest for young boys. If there was no winner by sunset, each could in turn take a full-force swing at the opponent who was not allowed to dodge from the position chosen by the striking adversary.

Ancient sculptures and pottery paintings depicting naked pankration fighters show blade-like hands and crouches reminiscent of modern fighting systems

NOTE: README! !
I posted Pankration as it seems to be the first sport event that utilized the fist as a weapon. You are able to talk about the stand-up fighting of Pankration but if you go into grappling, I will move it to the MMA forum ASAP. I posted it here as a reference for people who seeks more knowledge. Thus, obey the rule and avoid whacks from my whacking stick. Oh, I just changed the stick to a bamboo stick, it'll hurt more now.

Remember, clinch and throws are the only grappling techniques that can be discussed here if it's allowed in a sport even like MT, KB, Boxing, Xan Da, Savate, etc.

-Taison out
_________________________
I got two fists.. Don't make me use my head as well!

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#234953 - 03/13/06 11:25 PM Re: Kickboxing Styles! [Re: TwistingKick]
OneInchPunchMaster Offline
Member

Registered: 03/03/05
Posts: 101
Loc: England
Muay Boran
__________________________________
The predecessor to Muay Thai. Muay Boran emphasizes the usage of extremely powerful elbow and knee techniques, and combinations thereof, always thrown at full force and speed, with the intent to overcome one's adversary as quickly as possible, because another one might already be coming close or attacking. Tony Jaa does Muay Boran, and he uses it in his Ong Bak movie.You could say that Muay Boran is Muay Thai with locks.

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#234954 - 03/14/06 06:49 AM Re: Kickboxing Styles! [Re: OneInchPunchMaster]
Taison Offline
The Forum Dragon
Professional Poster

Registered: 09/06/05
Posts: 3629
Loc: BKK, Thailand
Quote:

The predecessor to Muay Thai. Muay Boran emphasizes the usage of extremely powerful elbow and knee techniques, and combinations thereof, always thrown at full force and speed, with the intent to overcome one's adversary as quickly as possible, because another one might already be coming close or attacking.



Wrong. . The use of the knees wasn't popularized since 1920's due to the fact when you went for the clinch people could scrape your knees with their bound fists which would leave your knees gushing. The elbows were only effective when unarmed.

Quote:

The predecessor to Muay Thai.


Wrong. Muay Lopburi is the predecessor. Muay Boran is just as vague as saying "Kung Fu".

Quote:

always thrown at full force and speed, with the intent to overcome one's adversary as quickly as possible, because another one might already be coming close or attacking.


Wrong. The use of MB was to overbalance your opponent so you wouldn't have to face multiple opponent simultaneously. The main weapon of MB was the thrust kick and elbows. Full force? I can't say that, it's usually only to make people fall over and then stab them with the sword.

Quote:

Tony Jaa does Muay Boran, and he uses it in his Ong Bak movie.


Tony Jaa does MT in OngBak. He uses Muay Boran in "Tom Yam Goong". OngBak = Tae Kwon Do + Stylish Muay Thai.

Quote:

You could say that Muay Boran is Muay Thai with locks.


If that was true then I could say Goju-ryu karate is Jujutsu with punch & kicks

Sorry, wasn't good enough. I'm still working on mine so don't worry, I'll post it in a week or so. I thought about opening a new thread on it cuz MB is huge and really detailed. Better luck next time and don't believe in the Thai media.

-Taison out
_________________________
I got two fists.. Don't make me use my head as well!

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#234955 - 03/14/06 01:03 PM Re: Kickboxing Styles! [Re: Cord]
OneInchPunchMaster Offline
Member

Registered: 03/03/05
Posts: 101
Loc: England
I took all that info from wiki.I dont know where your getting your info from, unless you do MB.
Look here:
http://www.tonyjaa.org/muaythai.shtml
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Muay_Boran
http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0368909/

Tony Jaa trained extensively in Muay Boran for his Ong Bak movie.
Is that all wrong? Where did you get your info from?

Peace


Edited by OneInchPunchMaster (03/14/06 01:29 PM)

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#234956 - 03/14/06 01:44 PM Re: Kickboxing Styles! [Re: OneInchPunchMaster]
Cord Offline
Prolific

Registered: 01/13/05
Posts: 11399
Loc: Cambridge UK.
1"PM, Taison is from Thailand, lives and trains there, in the very arts that you are attempting to soundbite. They are part of his culture and history, and he has a keen interest in them. His posts on the topics have been cosistently informative and accurate- thats why he is the mod of this forum.
Since you have got your info off the net I presume you do not study MT/MB yourself, or you would have had an instructor to ask, not an online encyclopedia to read.

There was much 'fact' printed about chinese MA in the wake of Bruce Lee's movie stardom, most of it utter nonsense, and the same will happen as Jaa's popularity increases and MT proliferates even more in western culture.
Here in the UK we are fortunate in that McDojo culture has not hit our MT schools hard yet, and good no frills knowledgeable training is available in many places. Better to start there than wilkepedia.
_________________________
Don't let the door hit ya' where the good lord split ya'
http://cord.mybrute.com

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#234957 - 03/14/06 02:11 PM Re: Kickboxing Styles! [Re: Cord]
OneInchPunchMaster Offline
Member

Registered: 03/03/05
Posts: 101
Loc: England
I respect Taison or anyone else here. Ive read in other forums about MB and what i said to be relative, and this was by MT guys. I was never even sure what MB was until just a week ago. I also checked a Muay Thai dojo site, and checked the history of MB, they said the same thing. I guess after checking the MB dojo site, i got convinced that it was that.

Seems to me i got the info off a mcDojo site.

Anyway, Taison, I look forward to your description of MB; I'll hopefully learn something new about MA when you do


Edited by OneInchPunchMaster (03/14/06 02:16 PM)

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