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#229284 - 02/12/06 04:57 AM Re: "traditional" & "modern" TKD ... ? [Re: Mike_L]
Dereck Offline
Prolific

Registered: 10/04/04
Posts: 10413
Loc: Great White North
Round and round we go, when it will stop nobody knows. Anybody else what to get their two cents in?
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#229285 - 02/15/06 03:24 PM Re: "traditional" & "modern" TKD ... ? [Re: Dereck]
TeK9 Offline
Professional Poster

Registered: 12/22/05
Posts: 2257
Loc: Northern California, USA
That is not true, I would just like to point out that Modern tkd is very standardized, when you see a kid perform a few kicking combinations you can see whether they are traditional tkd or modern.

You can go to an open tournament with dozens of styles including traditional tkd and modern tkd. Traditional style looks no differnt than the karate styles you see, while the modern tkd would look completely different. And I am not reffering to uniforms. The way kicking combinations are performed in Modern TKD are completely unique to any other style.

If you go to a sports orientated school you will see all the students practicing the exact same movements, working on the exact same kicks. Sparring methods are very similar in almost all schools who focus on Olympic style sparring.

Infact this is the real difference, there really is only 2 styles of TKD. All those other "styles" which supposevely are different because of the forms/patterns "poomse/hyungs" are the exact same thing, only the solo practiced forms are different.

However,the modern form of tkd executes techniques different. And this is the difference in style. The execution of technique and the emphasis from self defense to sparring.
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#229286 - 02/15/06 03:34 PM Re: "traditional" & "modern" TKD ... ? [Re: TeK9]
TimBlack Offline
Exalted

Registered: 05/10/05
Posts: 1403
Loc: UK, Brighton
Right, I'm gonna try and put a stop to this once and for all... and fail miserably

The distinction between 'modern' and 'traditional' is fundamentally flawed. All Martial Arts have evolved over a period of time, and TKD is no different. 'sports' TKD, as many people would call it, is no newer than what you call 'traditional' TKD, both are descended from much older arts, and both split up to a degree at a certain point down the road.

I don't understand why people consider Kung Fu or Muay Thai to be 'ancient' arts, when they've both responded to changes in thinking, and influences from other arts for centuries, every bit as long as TKD has been evolving. You simply cannot claim that any art is not 'modern', unless by that you mean that it is no longer practised.

So, basically, this whole discussion is based on a false premise - that there is trully a difference between 'traditional' and 'modern' Martial Arts. Now shut up everyone, 'coz I'm right
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#229287 - 02/15/06 03:37 PM Re: "traditional" & "modern" TKD ... ? [Re: TimBlack]
trevek Offline
Professional Poster

Registered: 05/15/05
Posts: 3337
Loc: Poland
A good point to say MODS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
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#229288 - 02/15/06 03:55 PM Re: "traditional" & "modern" TKD ... ? [Re: TimBlack]
TeK9 Offline
Professional Poster

Registered: 12/22/05
Posts: 2257
Loc: Northern California, USA
Hey man I thought we were an unarmed martial art, why are you holding a bat...luckly my MODERN TKD teaches me a special technique for people holding bats. It's called RUNNING AWAY, why do you some TKD students practice with TKD shoes on ^^
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"Poor is the pupil who
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#229289 - 02/15/06 04:30 PM Re: "traditional" & "modern" TKD ... ? [Re: trevek]
Dereck Offline
Prolific

Registered: 10/04/04
Posts: 10413
Loc: Great White North
Quote:

A good point to say MODS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!




Does this mean you are asking for help?

I know this will go round and round but if I shut it down then some may think premature. It is a forum for discussion even if the same stuff gets recycled. If some feel it is time to close it down then let me know and I will or Razorfoot will. If you want to keep it going then feel free but play nice.
_________________________
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#229290 - 02/15/06 05:56 PM Re: "traditional" & "modern" TKD ... ? [Re: Dereck]
TeK9 Offline
Professional Poster

Registered: 12/22/05
Posts: 2257
Loc: Northern California, USA
Are you kidding I love the title of this thread. Besides lately not many people have been posting, just the familiar few. Besides just because one person thinks it's a waist of time yet takes the time to actually post it's a waist of time say he feels its a pointless discussion, doesn't mean it's pointless. Especially since he posted just how pointless it is. PADOW!

Try and figure that one out Dereck LoL.

I say keep the thread going. But then again your the head honcho. Mnes is just a humble request and not a direct order. Oh mighty one.
_________________________
"Poor is the pupil who
does not surpass his
master" - Leonardo Da
Vinci

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#229291 - 02/15/06 06:02 PM Re: "traditional" & "modern" TKD ... ? [Re: TeK9]
TeK9 Offline
Professional Poster

Registered: 12/22/05
Posts: 2257
Loc: Northern California, USA
Dereck

after reading Sjons post, definetly not, please do not end this thread, he came up with some interesting points, which I would lke to think about and address. Further I think othes should re-read his post and make direct comments on it. Rather than just making comments on the Title of the thread. Sjon has some good ideas it looks like. Stuff that probably wouldn't apply to TKD but definetly to okinawan forms. Sjon I get back to you, real good stuff though.
_________________________
"Poor is the pupil who
does not surpass his
master" - Leonardo Da
Vinci

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#229292 - 02/16/06 01:29 AM Re: "traditional" & "modern" TKD ... ? [Re: sjon]
TeK9 Offline
Professional Poster

Registered: 12/22/05
Posts: 2257
Loc: Northern California, USA
Perhaps Modern TKD can best be understood or defined by look at other arts in similar situations.

Jujitsu and judo: These two are the same art with different emphasis. One was practiced solely for self defense and fighting. However, the other one took out potentially lethal techniques and created randori (free sparring) using these limited ammount of techniques.

What I would like to point out about this is that before judo, noone knew the importance of sweeps and throws and their effectiveness in combat. Thanks to Jigaro Kano now we all know how effective they are in self defense. Before this the main aspects of jujitsu were bone breaking and submission (rough play) there was no effective way of isolating the techniues and practicing them. Now everyone knows that judo became a form of practice to educate kids in school and that because of the popularity the practice of randori became a sport.

Jujitsu and Bjj : Brazillian jujitsu emphasises ground work over stand up. Although when teaching basic self defense techniques BJJ is essentially stand up jujitsu, however, they discovered that just because the defener is on the ground he is not useless, and through this theory they crated a new style of jujitsu one that focus's on ground fighting. However, they still adhere to basic stand up self defense. HOwever, thier sport of grappling and self defense has changed through knowledge of ground techniques.

Traditional TKD and Modern TKD:
_________________________
"Poor is the pupil who
does not surpass his
master" - Leonardo Da
Vinci

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#229293 - 02/16/06 02:31 AM Re: "traditional" & "modern" TKD ... ? [Re: TeK9]
sjon Offline
Smiter of the smited

Registered: 10/14/05
Posts: 186
Loc: Spain
Quote:

after reading Sjons post, definetly not, please do not end this thread, he came up with some interesting points, which I would lke to think about and address. Further I think othes should re-read his post and make direct comments on it. Rather than just making comments on the Title of the thread.




Thank you Tek. Exactly. The thread was originally an attempt to clarify what people are actually talking about when they say things like "traditional" or "modern", and to comment on which aspect of the art the different versions focus on and how. The idea of one being in some way better than the other was never intended to be an issue, since this would certainly have been "shollow" .
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