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#221238 - 01/13/06 06:41 AM Re: Kenpo (Ed Parker's...) [Re: MattJ]
TeK9 Offline
Professional Poster

Registered: 12/22/05
Posts: 2257
Loc: Northern California, USA
Hey matt thanks for the outline. Sounds like a decent BB test. At my old kosho ryu kenpo school they had about 150 techniques, like 10 techniques in 5 different catagories (grabs, stand ups, covers, batton, take downs) and it was like 10 techniques each belt level or something to similar. Anyways they like to brag that it was 300 techniques for BB test. But I think they kind of cheat because basically they are taking the 150 techniques they learn on thier right side and times it twice withthe left side. And I come from a TKD style which practices techniques on both sides so we canbe proficient from the get go. When you said you did around all those techniques did you mean left and right? did you count them twice?
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#221239 - 01/13/06 06:57 AM Re: Kenpo (Ed Parker's...) [Re: TeK9]
Bushi_no_ki Offline
Veteran

Registered: 05/03/05
Posts: 1667
Loc: POM, Monterey CA
Tek, Kosho Ryu and AKK are related styles.

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#221240 - 01/13/06 10:57 AM Re: Kenpo (Ed Parker's...) [Re: TeK9]
MattJ Offline
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Registered: 11/25/04
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Loc: York PA. USA
Tek9 -

No, those techniques are not mirror images, they are all different. Although some are what's called "extensions", which are continuations added on to the "base" techniques learned earlier. They are different from the "base" moves, however.
_________________________
"In case you ever wondered what it's like to be knocked out, it's like waking up from a nightmare only to discover it wasn't a dream." -Forrest Griffin

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#221241 - 01/13/06 09:07 PM Re: Kenpo (Ed Parker's...) [Re: MattJ]
TeK9 Offline
Professional Poster

Registered: 12/22/05
Posts: 2257
Loc: Northern California, USA
Hey guys dont forget to go to my thread and answer some of my newb questions there aswell. I appreciate it.

Matt 400 techniques, thats insane, thats quite an arsenal you've got there.
_________________________
"Poor is the pupil who
does not surpass his
master" - Leonardo Da
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#221242 - 01/14/06 12:41 AM Re: Kenpo (Ed Parker's...) [Re: MattJ]
Ronin1966 Offline
Professional Poster

Registered: 04/26/02
Posts: 3113
Loc: East Coast, United States
Hello MattJ:

I genuinely appreciate your thoughtful response, thank you!The contact aspect I too understand... it is the UNANSWERED aspect of the ritual which leaves me ~agape~....

~....Sure, kick anything you want, and though I do not know you personally, may never have trained with you, may know nothing about you....please feel free to kick/hit me and I MAY NOT respond, react to those potent techniques.... and am compelled by ritual to take them... until X number of dan ranked people are finished...~



<<There is indeed a fudamental danger to the practice of martial arts, yes?

Inherent danger in practicing, yes... conceeded. Inherent danger in defacto duct-taping my hands and feet so that an unknown number of strangers can strike me so hard to take me off my feet... I would respectfully offer that is not martial practice but potentially dangerous masochism <sp.?> I would propose.

As an outsider, probably because I am an outsider to the AKK, and though surely a lessor scale (???) it feels, looks and tastes like the demonstration with the live blade and the watermelon... (in context) to me....?

I trust implicitly any number of the people with whom I train. But, even so, I would never give them the type of shot as described so elliquently repeatedly so many times... I would rightfully be afraid I would be harmed. And I know and love (generic) many of these men & women friends, classmates, fellow techers, students... despite that love they would be dumb to do nothing to prevent me from giving them such a "gift"... and the same would be true in reverse!

Respectfully perplexed (believing he must be missing something critical....),

<<It sounds a lot worse than it is.

Read the book "Journey" (?) interviewing 24 Senior Practitioners of the lineage of Mr. Parker who all describe this particular event???

I take your point concerning locks, and throws. I do not decend simply to be nice, liking them, or because she is beautiful, or I do not want to hurt their feelings. I go because I do not want to BE hurt, and go down IF the technique is executed correctly, resistance is dangerous and not the point at the beginning.

<<Really depends on how you look at it.

Understood... (still wishing it had been mythic hyperpole...)

Jeff

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#221243 - 02/04/06 09:06 PM Re: Kenpo (Ed Parker's...) [Re: Ronin1966]
madeku Offline
Stranger

Registered: 02/04/06
Posts: 2
the concept is any knowledge worth having is worth suffering for to my understanding (im an Orange belt in the AKKI) and at least in my school Yellow is more of a push than a punch, Orange is an actual punch.. Purple and Blue are a push kick for the most part, and Green/Brown/Black are an actual snap kick..

its not like its just out of the blue.. you get in a training horse stance, the teacher has you breathe and tense and basically prepair for the hit (knowing when to fully exhail, just like bodying for a technique).. and theres usually someone behind you to catch you if you fall.

if your teacher has good control it shouldn't "hurt" for more than a little while.. even durring training if you get hit on the back or chest or stomach or arm it should only hurt for a minute at most so you have some idea of what the hit is like, even if its just controlled.

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#221244 - 02/04/06 09:15 PM Re: Kenpo (Ed Parker's...) [Re: madeku]
MattJ Offline
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Registered: 11/25/04
Posts: 15634
Loc: York PA. USA
Hi Madeku, welcome to the forums. My experience matches what you wrote pretty well. The hits at low ranks are very well controlled, and by the time you are receiving full power strikes, you should be quite prepared for them.

I do concede to Jeff on the "morality" point.....but nonetheless, it is an accepted ritual in AKK.
_________________________
"In case you ever wondered what it's like to be knocked out, it's like waking up from a nightmare only to discover it wasn't a dream." -Forrest Griffin

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#221245 - 02/05/06 10:45 AM Re: Kenpo (Ed Parker's...) [Re: MattJ]
Gino Offline
Member

Registered: 01/10/05
Posts: 410
Loc: New York State
Matt-Ronin has articulated my position on the "birth kick" quite well, so I won't be redundant. I am not familiar with AKK nor any of it's practitioners, but I deeply respect all legitimate MA styles. However, I would like to point out that your judo anaolgy is incorrect, IMHO. You compared the birth kick to being thrown in judo as a congratulatory form of recognition, and that there is an inherent risk for injury in both (ie, in judo, risk of neck injury from the throw). However, it is standard practice for a judoka (as uke) to passively accept a throw from tori, to better assist the latter in learning the mechanics of the throw. Judoka learn ukemi well before they learn to throw ("You must learn how to lose before you learn how to win"), and therefore the ability to fall safely is almost second-nature to the student. To be similarly thrown in a promotion ceremony, as acceptance of a congratulatory gesture, is not beyond the realm of one's routine training. Unless it is standard practice for the karateka to passively accept a kick to the midsection, I don't believe this rite of passage has a place in the promotion ceremony. Just my opinion.
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#423299 - 11/01/09 10:31 AM Re: Kenpo (Ed Parker's...) [Re: Gino]
MattJ Offline
Free Rhinoplasty!
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Registered: 11/25/04
Posts: 15634
Loc: York PA. USA
Lo, these many years later, I have finally uploaded the video! Here I am getting the "pain of birth" kick as I get promoted to black belt back in 1993:

http://www.youtube.com/user/skeen267#p/u/2/g8bZRpAzMNc

_________________________
"In case you ever wondered what it's like to be knocked out, it's like waking up from a nightmare only to discover it wasn't a dream." -Forrest Griffin

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#423300 - 11/01/09 11:25 AM Re: Kenpo (Ed Parker's...) [Re: MattJ]
Prizewriter Offline
Professional Poster

Registered: 10/23/05
Posts: 2573
Whoa, he really went for it! Thanks for showing us.
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