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#217019 - 12/24/05 10:35 AM Hwa Rang Do
Prizewriter Offline
Professional Poster

Registered: 10/23/05
Posts: 2573
Hi. I have posted two similar subjects on different forums, and I haven't had a lot of response.

TKD aside, there is a dearth of Korean Martial arts in my area.

I may be moving next year though, and was hoping to travel to Korea for a while as well (that is the plan).

I am curious about Hwa Rang Do/Tae Soo Do though. I would like to hear from practitioners of Hwa Rang and Tae Soo. Specifically, positive experiences you have had as a result of these martial arts. I am aware of the debate surrounding Hwa Rang Doís origins, so I would rather just hear from people who have studied Hwa Rang Do and their experiences with the art and not have this topic turn into an argument about martial history.

Thanks for any response! Any questions for me re this post let me know.
_________________________
"Let your food be your medicine, and your medicine be your food" Hippocrates.

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#217020 - 12/24/05 02:21 PM Re: Hwa Rang Do [Re: Prizewriter]
Dudley32 Offline
master of disaster

Registered: 10/25/05
Posts: 482
Loc: Indiana
First of all, the Hwa Rang Do werent a style, they were a group of warriors. They were The warrior elite group who followed the famous five code honor system (Loyalty to Nation,Honor of parents,Fidelity amongst friends,Courage in battle,Forbidance of unessesarry violence). They studied a variety of martial arts and were the main reason that Korea was united.

Tang Soo Do, which is what I think you were referring to, is similar to Taekwondo, but tends to put more emphasis on forms and basically the softer side, but can be very effective also (correct me if I am wrong on that explanation). Chuck Norris does Tang Soo Do.

To tell you the truth, America is now the home of the martial arts. Although going to Korea would be great (I would also like to go). If you are going with the expectation that Korean Martial Art schools are going to be on every corner and you will come home a master, you are going to be disappointed. You're best bet is to find a local martial art school once you move.

I study Taekwondo which is closely related to Tang Soo Do, and would recomend it to anybody, just make sure you find a school that will accomadate what your future goals are in the are.
Good Luck

Matt
_________________________
Practice doesn't make perfect. Perfect Practice makes perfect.

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#217021 - 12/24/05 02:49 PM Re: Hwa Rang Do [Re: Prizewriter]
chakuy Offline
Member

Registered: 10/14/05
Posts: 124
Quote:

Hwa Rang Do/Tae Soo Do




are those TKD styles or a korean MA?? this is the first time i hear about em... can somebody drop me a line n tell me something about them...thanks
_________________________
"Nothing is so strong as gentleness and nothing is so gentle as real strength." -Ralph W. Sockman

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#217022 - 12/24/05 02:54 PM Re: Hwa Rang Do [Re: Dudley32]
Prizewriter Offline
Professional Poster

Registered: 10/23/05
Posts: 2573
Hi Matt, thanks for the response. I am under no illusions that Korea is choc-o-blocked full of martial art schools. Indeed, I concur that the USA is the epicentre of Martial arts, due to the variety of systems that are available in the country.

I should maybe have explained further (sorry!). I wish to explore all aspects of Korean culture, not just martial arts. Of course I plan a very limited stay, certainly not of a duration that would accommodate a long-term martial study. But I reason that any experience would be worthwhile.

Tang Soo Do and Tae Soo Do are separate martial arts. Tae Soo Do was a former title of the martial art that is now Tae Kwon Do (the modern manifestation of Tae Kwon Do at least), or so I believe (as I have always said I am open to being corrected). However, Tae Soo Do is currently the sporting aspect of Hwa Rang Do. I have a limited knowledge of Hwa Rang and am aware of their place within General Choi's 24 patterns, but their recognition in modern Korean martial arts does not cease there. Dr Joo Bang Lee, the founder of Hwa Rang Do, allegedly (I have never seen/heard any quotes from the man himself, hence the "allegedly") claims that he an his brother were taught the ancient fighting system used by the Hwa Rang, and this is the system that Dr. Lee taught.

As I alluded in my original post, I am aware of the controversy of Hwa Rang Do's origins. Presently I am very sceptical of its purported history.

I am sorry if my original post was vague in any way. Sincerest apologies.
_________________________
"Let your food be your medicine, and your medicine be your food" Hippocrates.

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#217023 - 12/24/05 03:00 PM Re: Hwa Rang Do [Re: Prizewriter]
Prizewriter Offline
Professional Poster

Registered: 10/23/05
Posts: 2573
That always happens! I ramble on during my responses and in that time someone else posts!

Chakuy, thanks for the response mate. Hwa Rang Do is a Korean martial art, not dissimilar from a technical point of view to Hapkido.

It doesn't seem to be too widely spread across the world. I know that we here in Europe have less than ten dojangs across the entire continent.

You need anymore info let me know, will share my (limited admittedly) knowledge with you. Or enter a Hwa Rang Do search into Wikipedia.

P.S. Tae Soo Do, as mentioned, is the sport part of HRD.
_________________________
"Let your food be your medicine, and your medicine be your food" Hippocrates.

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#217024 - 12/24/05 03:48 PM Re: Hwa Rang Do [Re: Prizewriter]
chakuy Offline
Member

Registered: 10/14/05
Posts: 124
Sounds interesting, but I canít see anything has to do with flowers
_________________________
"Nothing is so strong as gentleness and nothing is so gentle as real strength." -Ralph W. Sockman

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#217025 - 12/25/05 10:05 AM Re: Hwa Rang Do [Re: chakuy]
Prizewriter Offline
Professional Poster

Registered: 10/23/05
Posts: 2573
Ha ha! According to those who practice, Hwa Rang Do exponents "flower" in terms of their own personnel development.

Thanks for all the responses and happy holidays to all.
_________________________
"Let your food be your medicine, and your medicine be your food" Hippocrates.

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#217026 - 12/25/05 07:11 PM Re: Hwa Rang Do [Re: Prizewriter]
TeK9 Offline
Professional Poster

Registered: 12/22/05
Posts: 2257
Loc: Northern California, USA
Hello your in a bit of a slump here and I figure the best I can do is spill the beans on what I know or read on Hwa Rang Do.
Lets see it seems we all have the same info on Dr. whats his name. who actually seems to be the only authrority on Hwa rang bo. I suppose we've all red his magazine intervies from Black Belt and those other mags, and I suppose we've all seen his sons particularly the one in that Martial Arts documentary video from the Discovery Channel.

So here's what I know. From my readings on Tae Kwon Do and Hapkido. They mention these Hwa rang warriors (way of flowering manhood) I dont want to get into it with anyone, but I doubt these flower boys existed nor do I rally care. That was a joke by the way "flower boys"

From what I can tell Hwa rand do seems to be the combination of Tae kwon do (kicks) with Hapikido (join locks, circular manipulations).

As far as this Tae So Do sport version of Hwa rang do, I believe one of the sons from the Dr whats his name, admitted that its a new sport created for young martial artist. To me it seemed like a gimic so they can attract more practicioners to thier art. Because it looked exactly like modern sports taekwondo.

Wait it just hit me, isn't this guys name is Dr Bong something? I dont mean to insult your arts master, I just cant remember his name. From what I have read this arts is not just about combat but about healing, herbal medicine, spiritual meditation, flowering, basically its a slice of korean/japanese culture. I was curious about this art however I remember what really turned me off to it was the price they charge to learn it. Oh and I'm not to keen on those fancy uniforms, I mean the black one is cool but those bright colored ones...no thanks not for me.

Well I hope my research helped you and I hope you didnt get offended by my sad attempt at humor. I to tend to babble.

"Do or do not...there is no try" -Yoda
_________________________
"Poor is the pupil who
does not surpass his
master" - Leonardo Da
Vinci

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#217027 - 12/25/05 10:34 PM Re: Hwa Rang Do [Re: Prizewriter]
VDJ Offline
Veteran

Registered: 05/09/05
Posts: 1674
May I suggest contacting Sabunim C.M. Griffin, columnist for Tae Kwon Do Times magazine (he writes the column "The last word", usually found on the last page of the magazine). He is a Hwa Rang Do practioner and operates a HRD dojang in Cinncinati,OH. His e-mail address is cmgriffin@taekwondotimes.com . He is very knowledgable of martial arts in general and is very respected. Could help you with alot og your questions. Hope this helps.

TK
VDJ

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#217028 - 12/26/05 05:52 AM Re: Hwa Rang Do [Re: TeK9]
Prizewriter Offline
Professional Poster

Registered: 10/23/05
Posts: 2573
Quote:


Well I hope my research helped you and I hope you didnt get offended by my sad attempt at humor. I to tend to babble.






No offence taken. I too have seen and read a lot of HRD that makes me unsure of the art. For instance, HRD HQ offers one of those "Learn from your own home" programs for Tae Soo Do.

I don't practice HRD, so I can't really get upset about anyone expressing their opinion on it. I am just curious about it.

To VDJ, thanks for the help! I have sent Mr. Griffin and e-mail. I will keep you all posted.
_________________________
"Let your food be your medicine, and your medicine be your food" Hippocrates.

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#217029 - 12/26/05 12:25 PM Re: Hwa Rang Do [Re: Prizewriter]
JCM Offline
Newbie

Registered: 12/26/05
Posts: 17
Just to clarify Tang Soo Do is very similar to TKD in many ways. The differances are that TSD is a "traditional art" with focus on philosophy, self improvement, self defense, forms etc. TSD generally does have tourneys and sport sparring but it is of a lower priority while TKD alot of times is at the top. I have trained for a number of years in both and this has been my experience. I have also done some hapkido. IMO in all of the above arts the hand and foot tecniques are essentially the same. Of course these statements are genralizations that will have exceptions to the rule but are my observations.

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#217030 - 12/27/05 07:18 AM Re: Hwa Rang Do [Re: JCM]
Prizewriter Offline
Professional Poster

Registered: 10/23/05
Posts: 2573
Just an update for all. I e-mailed Mr Griffin, and he sent back a very nice and helpful response.

The gist of it relates to the common truth in any martial art really, i.e. itís not the art, itís the artist.

He also stated for a more in-depth discussion on Tae Soo Do, the sporting aspect of Hwa Rang Do, it is best to contact the West Coast Hwa Rang Do dojangs.

Just as a further point, I notice quite a few people also talking about Tang Soo Do, which I am happy to hear about. If anyone else wants any further info on this, I also have another post in MA Teaching & Learning relating to Tang Soo Do. I have had some excellent responses there as well. Below is the link:

http://www.fightingarts.com/ubbthreads/showflat.php/Cat/0/Number/15813596/an/0/page/0#15813596

Thanks to everyone who has replied in both posts.
_________________________
"Let your food be your medicine, and your medicine be your food" Hippocrates.

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#217031 - 01/06/06 01:46 PM Re: Hwa Rang Do [Re: Prizewriter]
Prizewriter Offline
Professional Poster

Registered: 10/23/05
Posts: 2573
Just an update:

No response yet from HRD HQ, save and polite acknowledgement. But what with the holidays and all, they are probably just catching up.

This has been posted before, but for anyone who has not yet seen it: http://www.hwarangdo.com/videoclips.htm

Go to the clip entitled "7th Dan Promotion". It shows HRD in action. Please note, the above clip was not choreographed in the slighest way
_________________________
"Let your food be your medicine, and your medicine be your food" Hippocrates.

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#217032 - 01/06/06 04:10 PM Re: Hwa Rang Do [Re: Prizewriter]
Dereck Offline
Prolific

Registered: 10/04/04
Posts: 10413
Loc: Great White North
I actually can appreciate this. Sometimes I was expecting Jackie Chan to show up but I have had the opportunity of seeing something like this up close. Even at my level we do something similar with partners but nothing so extravagant. I have not doubt about this guys abilities.

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#217033 - 01/07/06 12:10 PM Re: Hwa Rang Do [Re: Dereck]
Prizewriter Offline
Professional Poster

Registered: 10/23/05
Posts: 2573
Have to agree with you there Dereck, the guy certainly has a high skill level.
_________________________
"Let your food be your medicine, and your medicine be your food" Hippocrates.

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#217034 - 01/07/06 01:46 PM Re: Hwa Rang Do [Re: Prizewriter]
Intrepidinv1 Offline
Member

Registered: 04/20/05
Posts: 308
Loc: NC, USA
I would recommend reading Black Belt's "Hwa Rang Do" by Taejoon Lee. He is the son of the founder Dr. Joo Bang Lee. He explains the history of the art.
I too am interested in this art. I was first exposed to it from the books by Michael Echanis (rip.) He has three books that are based on HRD that address knife fighting, stick fighting and unarmed against the knife. I have all three of these books. What impressed me about HWD is that it seems to incorporate a lot of arts into one. It has an Aikido flavor (this is explained in the book) and it incorporates elements of other Korean striking arts as well as chokes, throws, etc. I would like to study the art but I was not able to locate any schools in my area. From what I can tell it would appear to be a well rounded method and would offer the practitioner a life time of study if a suitable instructor was available.

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#217035 - 01/07/06 02:07 PM Re: Hwa Rang Do [Re: Prizewriter]
Intrepidinv1 Offline
Member

Registered: 04/20/05
Posts: 308
Loc: NC, USA
I just watched some of these videos and I have a few comments;

Although the demos were highly choreographed and relied on a well trained partner, the speed, intensity, angles of attacks, counter attacks, methods of attack and defense spell one thing to me, COMBAT EFFECTIVE.

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#217036 - 01/07/06 03:12 PM Re: Hwa Rang Do [Re: Intrepidinv1]
Prizewriter Offline
Professional Poster

Registered: 10/23/05
Posts: 2573
Thanks Intrepid, I will check out the literature.

I understand your frustration and not being able to find somewhere to train. There are very few dojangs located around the world. I think this may be due to the strick control the HRD HQ excercise over there art (such as TM'ing the name Hwa Rang Do, so as to stop an phoney dojangs from opening up)
_________________________
"Let your food be your medicine, and your medicine be your food" Hippocrates.

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#217037 - 01/07/06 03:31 PM Re: Hwa Rang Do [Re: Prizewriter]
JCM Offline
Newbie

Registered: 12/26/05
Posts: 17
Hey Prize have you recieved any correspondance from the Hwa Rang Do association as of yet? Just curious.

I seen a demo by Chief Master Taejoon Lee and I was very impressed. He is one of the finest if not the finest Martial Artist I have seen. Was a humbaling and great experience.


Edited by JCM (01/07/06 03:50 PM)

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#217038 - 01/07/06 04:10 PM Re: Hwa Rang Do [Re: JCM]
Prizewriter Offline
Professional Poster

Registered: 10/23/05
Posts: 2573
Quote:

Hey Prize have you recieved any correspondance from the Hwa Rang Do association as of yet? Just curious.

I seen a demo by Chief Master Taejoon Lee and I was very impressed. He is one of the finest if not the finest Martial Artist I have seen. Was a humbaling and great experience.




JCM

Nothing yet! I enrolled on the HRD forum (forgive me Oldman!!!) to ask a few questions about HRD/TSD.

I had an automated e-mail (you know the kind "Thank you for your enquiry...Will look at it...get back to you asap...")

I then recieved a slightly unusual e-mail. Unusual in that I had never been asked such questions before being allowed to join a forum . The e-mail said I would be able to activate myself on the HRD forum when I sent back my response to the following questions:

How did I find out about HRD?

How did I find out about the HRD forum?

Please list your previous martial arts experience.

Now this all seemed harmless enough. I have a strong spam filter on, so I doubt anything non-HRD related will get through on my e-mail. So I sent an e-mail back, answering their questions.

As of yet I have had no response to my last e-mail. But I will keep you all posted.
_________________________
"Let your food be your medicine, and your medicine be your food" Hippocrates.

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#217039 - 01/07/06 05:43 PM Re: Hwa Rang Do [Re: Dudley32]
Sushi Offline
Member

Registered: 11/23/05
Posts: 93
Loc: Germany
Quote:

To tell you the truth, America is now the home of the martial arts. Although going to Korea would be great (I would also like to go). If you are going with the expectation that Korean Martial Art schools are going to be on every corner and you will come home a master, you are going to be disappointed.





Well Matt, sorry to disappoint you, but to tell you the truth, you have some really fantastic taekwondoin in the US national-team, Steven Lopez, Mark Lopez, Diana Lopez, Antony Graf, and a few more, but in Korea it is quite different.
Studying Taekwnodo in Korea means beginning at the age of five and training under exterme conditions for many years.
I visited Korea twice. I took part at three tournaments I was practising with a professional team, trained by a double world-champioan- for two weeks- 96 degree in the shade and we had to give full power for 4 hours a day.
Please donīt you compare that with a taekwondo school you will find around the corner in USA.
As I know the Lopezī are based in Texas and work a lot in the basic camp in Colorado and you will find a lot of good martial arts schools in the US, but do me a favour, just go out in the world, go to Iran, go to Korea, go to Europe before throwing words like you did.

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#217040 - 01/08/06 03:35 AM Re: Hwa Rang Do [Re: Sushi]
Daniele Offline
Newbie

Registered: 01/06/06
Posts: 15
Quote:

Quote:





Please donīt you compare that with a taekwondo school you will find around the corner in USA.




Rude words! There are many many of them and I would also say the US are one of the leading nations in martial arts.

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#217041 - 01/12/06 01:31 PM Re: Hwa Rang Do [Re: Daniele]
Prizewriter Offline
Professional Poster

Registered: 10/23/05
Posts: 2573
** UPDATE **

For all those interested, Chief Master Taejoon Lee got back in contact with me (about Tae Soo Do competitions at least).

The below link is for the rules of Tae Soo Do comps if anyone is interest. It is a good insight to what goes on in sparring/fighting in Tae Soo Do, as well as other events.


http://www.hwarangdo.com/mastersrules.htm
_________________________
"Let your food be your medicine, and your medicine be your food" Hippocrates.

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#217042 - 01/14/06 11:50 AM Re: Hwa Rang Do [Re: Prizewriter]
Prizewriter Offline
Professional Poster

Registered: 10/23/05
Posts: 2573
** UPDATE **

Master Taejoon Lee's full response can be found on the other forum I have about this topic, located here: http://www.fightingarts.com/ubbthreads/s...2c#Post15820941

I have not received permission to post the link on the above thread on the TKD forum so far. Therefore, out of courtesy, I have not done so. I did receive permission to do so on another FA forum (see above link).

Master Lee discusses Tae Soo Do, and how it fits into HRD as a whole
_________________________
"Let your food be your medicine, and your medicine be your food" Hippocrates.

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