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#216935 - 12/24/05 09:00 AM Why geniuses are never REALLY happy!
its_only_a_name Offline
Newbie

Registered: 12/14/05
Posts: 23
This question was asked in another thread. Many answers were given but the root wasn't touched.

The basic thing to be understood is first the ego. The ego survives on attention. Attention is its food. And the ego creates separation - if there is "me", then there is "you". The two polarities of oneness.

Once ego is understood it's not hard to see why most geniuses arn't happy. Quite simply, man has an investment in misery. The average ego-clinger soaks in misery because misery strengthens his ego. When your suffering, you become the centre of attention. When your unhappy, you are the centre of attention. We learn this as children...we fall and hurt ourselves then mom comes and cuddles us. She makes us feel happy and loved. Maybe not this particular example, but something like this, either good or bad. This carries on unconsciously throughout life, unless of course you come to recognise it happening within you on an unconscious level.

Geniuses more so tend to be martyrs. They are smart and cunning enough to know they are smart. But they can only show off these qualities amongst their worshipping crowd. Naturally, martyrdom becomes there form of attention seeking from the crowd. They display their wonderful intellect in front of this crowd who are immensely impressed; they too are a crowd of egos. And just like magic, their ego satisfaction has been filled with the geniuses marvelous display.

Unless one can recognise their own attachment to their image or ego, then one can never transcend it. Many will tell you the ego is good, that it protects you. But this is false. The ego may protect you from others, but it cannot protect you from yourself. It is just a location. An identity. But the root word of identity is "entity". The word entity means entire. Identity is only a part of the entire, the whole. So naturally an egotistic man can never be whole; can never be HOLY.

So this is basically why geniuses are never happy. There are also other levels to their misery, but this is the basic root.

Just remember love is the only motive which can bring awareness. "The only criterion of truth is joy. Whatsoever makes you joy, delighted, blissful etc is truth."
_________________________
From Dark to Light - Phrost & Shiv-R

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#216936 - 12/24/05 03:29 PM Re: Why geniuses are never REALLY happy! [Re: its_only_a_name]
JoelM Offline
Professional Poster

Registered: 07/26/04
Posts: 6355
Loc: Georgia, USA
That's nice and all, but couldn't you have just put it in the other thread?
Or was it ego that made you want to start a whole new thread of your own?
_________________________
We should all take ourselves seriously...and then crumple that image up and toss it out the window.

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#216937 - 12/24/05 11:26 PM Re: Why geniuses are never REALLY happy! [Re: JoelM]
ButterflyPalm Offline
Enigma

Registered: 08/26/04
Posts: 2637
Loc: Malaysia
What ego? he/she/it doesn't even have a name; how egoless can you get?
_________________________
I'll rather be happy than right, anytime.

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#216938 - 12/25/05 01:23 AM Re: Why geniuses are never REALLY happy! [Re: ButterflyPalm]
JoelM Offline
Professional Poster

Registered: 07/26/04
Posts: 6355
Loc: Georgia, USA
It does have a name, but it's only a name.
_________________________
We should all take ourselves seriously...and then crumple that image up and toss it out the window.

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#216939 - 12/25/05 02:01 AM Re: Why geniuses are never REALLY happy! [Re: its_only_a_name]
Ed_Morris Offline
Professional Poster

Registered: 11/04/05
Posts: 6768
How many geniuses have you known? or are you just falsely stereotyping? (not a very HOLY thing to do)

I have met a few people who could be considered a genius...although socially, you'd never know it. The few I've met tend to be shy, antisocial and stay away from the spotlight. My roomate in college was a genius (IQ slightly above 140). I remember 3 things that I learned from him:

* How to make an awesome beverage if you only have beer, orange juice and ice in your fridge.
* How an internet worm virus works in all it's geeky detail. (rare knowledge in 1989)
* He said if he ever invents anything useful, he's going to give it away for free....it's the challenge of the work, not the glory of it's completion that makes him happy. If his only ego was in finding solutions and defeating a problem with the spirit of a lion and mind of a genius - thats not a bad kind of ego to have...wouldn't you agree?

you've got it dead wrong. It's not ego that sometimes causes unhappiness for such people...it's either lack of challange or fear of success.

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#216940 - 12/25/05 08:10 AM Re: Why geniuses are never REALLY happy! [Re: Ed_Morris]
ButterflyPalm Offline
Enigma

Registered: 08/26/04
Posts: 2637
Loc: Malaysia
Tell us something about his room-mate
_________________________
I'll rather be happy than right, anytime.

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#216941 - 12/25/05 08:42 AM Re: Why geniuses are never REALLY happy! [Re: Ed_Morris]
its_only_a_name Offline
Newbie

Registered: 12/14/05
Posts: 23
Forget me forever. Just listen to the words and forget me. I do not wish to offend anyone, but its inevitable. For that, I apologise.

Humbleness is an ego. Ego can be good or bad, loud or shy. All it wants is appraisal; good appraisal or bad appraisal does not matter. It wants to be recognised, because that very recognition supports you. It supports your location. And that's all ego is, a location. There is a deep fear in the unknown, and when you meet that unknown in meditation, there is no location, there is no "I" as such. You are dead alone. So we cling to our location because it gives us purpose; support. Deep down we are afraid of our aloneness and so cling to the ego. The ego is not your creation. It begins at birth. We are named. We have an address. We then become school students. Then we obtain job titles. Then the degrees, masters, honours, phd and so forth. 10th dan black belt, master. You are not these titles. If you are living by yourself on an island, what is the need of these titles? There is nobody to communicate with. The ego is just for the purpose of communication. Identification with the ego causes unhappiness.

Even humble people are appraised by those like yourself. They state "if {I} ever invent anything useful, {I'm) going to give it away for free"...and now you think, "oh this man is great, very humble, yes he is a great man". But that too is appraisal. It is food for the ego. I'm not saying he is a bad person at all. There is a good intent. Good heart.

As for "holier-than-thou" people, that too is an ego. We appraise these other humbles for being humble. But you haven't heard the words. I did not say I was humble or holy. It was interpreted by your offended ego:

"How many geniuses have YOU known? or are YOU just falsely stereotyping? (not a very HOLY thing to do)"

I've come across many intellects or what are called geniuses. But the real geniuses, I've never met, only read about. As for me, I do not care about being known. Truth is my only motive. Understanding is the first requirement of truth.

"...it's either lack of challange or fear of success".

Through challenge, man becomes great. Solving complexities strengthens mans ego. "Yes, I have solved this very complex and challenging equation; one which only a genius could solve!" This is internal dialogue from such achievements.

A man who fears success is more cunning. He has an ego of low self esteem. He does not like the spotlight. The spotlight puts pressure on his image, and if this image buckles under pressure he will be exposed. So it is much safer for this type of man to remain in his humble ego, where there is greater protection from such pressures, and greater appraisal for his hidden image.

Ego is an illusion to the true self. It is neccessary for communication purposes but the root cause of suffering. It coincides with the mind. The mind and the ego are two sides of the same coin.

Also, misers never wish to be happy. When you are happy you become irrelevant to people. The trees, animals, flowers, birds, they are all happy and we barely notice them. We may look at them but never notice them or pay close attention. When you are happy there is no need for anyone else to help you. You are content, happy. What is the need of anyone to come along and try to cheer you up? There is none. When truly happy you are so content, there is no need. And your happiness makes others angry. It reflects their lack of peace of mind. They will pick at you. Deep down they smile at you because they do not want you looking down on them, down on their egos. But it is a forced smile, a supported smile. It is to save face. Deep down they may be very angry with you; angry with their anger. It is reflected by your happiness.

And misers dont want happiness, they want recognition. This may bring a moments satisfaction. But only a moment, it will not last because no one can be bothered to keep their attention on you for the rest of their life. Their minds are too full with thoughts to focus on you for more than a moment. Impossible! And you will go on trying to get their attention with different feats.

By the way, the other thread had too many posts on it. Better to forget the old and bring the new.

Just be, just watch and let life happen. Truth is all.
_________________________
From Dark to Light - Phrost & Shiv-R

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#216942 - 12/25/05 10:22 AM Re: Why geniuses are never REALLY happy! [Re: its_only_a_name]
harlan Offline
Professional Poster

Registered: 07/31/04
Posts: 6664
Loc: Amherst, MA
Sorry...nothing personal...but the whole topic is based on a generalization. I have it on firm authority, the lovely guys at FA.com ( ) that I am a genius ...and I am happy.

So there. Both threads demolished.

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#216943 - 12/25/05 11:00 AM Re: Why geniuses are never REALLY happy! [Re: its_only_a_name]
Ed_Morris Offline
Professional Poster

Registered: 11/04/05
Posts: 6768
wasn't offended in the least...we all get things wrong sometimes. Words may sometimes come across offensive...but when we read them without involving our ego, we may find some good wisdom and food for thought in self-evaluation.

you've changed your tone and widened your view a bit on evaluating geniuses. In fact, you've changed gears a bit and instead of keeping with why geniuses (and a 'genius' is just a title meaning IQ:140+) are unhappy, now it's 'people' in general:
"Identification with the ego causes unhappiness."
- like the term 'genius' for instance? who is giving them that title? you? or is it an arbitrary and relative ranking test by institutions?

"holier-than-thou people" - not necessarily geniuses.

"intellects" - another arbitrary title subjectively given by people comparing people to themselves. one may be an intellect, but no genius.

"internal dialogue" -you can evaluate people's internal dialogue? or are you comparing what you feel based on what you suppose others might? you'd need to consult your ego in order to do that.

"By the way, the other thread had too many posts on it. Better to forget the old and bring the new." so the perfect thread would be one in which only your 'voice' is heard? I think a thread is most useful when as many people who have something to say chime in...

I'm not picking on you, but just wanted to point out that for every reason you give why geniuses are not happy, there could be an equal reason why someone of the general population is not happy. - so it's as pointless to stereotype geniuses' happiness as it is to stereotype your own.

your thread "Why geniuses are never REALLY happy!"
It takes ego to consider people a genius or not.
It takes ego to consider people happy or not.
It takes ego to make a statement "!" as oppossed to a question "?"

consider the title of a thread and compare:
"Why geniuses are never REALLY happy!"
to
"Is there a connection between IQ and happiness?"

which would you say is ego-based?

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#216944 - 12/25/05 11:49 AM Re: Why geniuses are never REALLY happy! [Re: Ed_Morris]
Bushi_no_ki Offline
Veteran

Registered: 05/03/05
Posts: 1667
Loc: POM, Monterey CA
Ed hit this one pretty well on target. The lack of happiness a genius experiences is not so much a matter of ego, it's either a lack of challenge, or having the challenge before him/her and being so caught up in it that the rest of the world does not matter.

My problem in life has been lack of a suitable challenge/opportunity. There has been nothing in my hometown for me, and I've been unable to leave, until recently. Ego had nothing to do with it. Lack of suitable challenge and mental stimulation has everything to do with it. Ego is self value. My lack of happiness in life isn't because I value myself too little or too much, it's simply that everything there is to do around me is BORING. I go to school, to sit in a class room and fly paper planes because everyone else takes twice as long to learn something. I get a job, and it's either fast food or unskilled labor, so I'm so bored at work that all I want to do is go home. There are only a handfull of people who can strike up a stimulating conversation with me here.

Ego has absolutely nothing to do with it. I find people who have an ego problem are the ones who regard themselves as "intellectuals", which I am finding to be more and more true to mean "self-aggrandizing naive idealist".

IQ relates to happiness in that IQ is basically the "speed" at which a person learns, and therefore being unable to learn as fast as I can makes me bored and therefore unhappy. IQ also relates to happiness in that the more you know, the more there is to learn and do, and with that comes the knowledge that even should I live forever, I will never learn it all or do it all.

There are so many factors that influence our level of happiness in life. I never claimed to be completely unhappy with my life, but that I was lacking in happiness. I'm somewhat in the middle. But there have been "great" men in the past who have been completely unhappy in their lives. And all they lived for was their area of "genius". Part of it was the things that happened to them, but part of it was being consumed with the next "big thing".

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