FightingArts Estore
Pressure Points
From a medical professional, straight facts on where and how to hit that can save your life.
Stretching
Limber or not, anyone can add height and speed to their kicks with this method.
Calligraphy
For yourself or as a gift, calligraphy is special, unique and lasting.
Karate Uniforms
Look your best. Max snap. low cost & superior crafted: “Peak Performance Gold” 16 oz uniforms.

MOTOBU
Classic book translation. Hard to find. Not in stores.
Who's Online
0 registered (), 29 Guests and 5 Spiders online.
Key: Admin, Global Mod, Mod
Newest Members
SenseiGregT, sagat, JFawkes, pluckysaga39, sgtdemeo
22911 Registered Users
Top Posters (30 Days)
Dobbersky 6
AndyLA 5
Ed_Morris 4
futsaowingchun 3
VDJ 2
August
Su M Tu W Th F Sa
1 2
3 4 5 6 7 8 9
10 11 12 13 14 15 16
17 18 19 20 21 22 23
24 25 26 27 28 29 30
31
New Topics
Biu Tzu- Snake hand strike
by futsaowingchun
08/27/14 09:02 PM
Chum Kiu 2nd section applications
by futsaowingchun
08/20/14 09:54 PM
2013 World Championship Rio: The Gallery (HD)
by ergees
08/19/14 05:22 AM
Chi Sao demonstration
by futsaowingchun
08/14/14 10:57 PM
Decent Fight channel
by FrankyFruits
08/07/14 09:19 PM
2014 European Championships Cadets Athens: Videos
by ergees
08/07/14 10:00 AM
Life goes on....
by Dobbersky
08/07/14 05:59 AM
An open letter to bunkai researchers...
by Bartfast
08/05/14 04:18 PM
ITF TaeKwonDo or Shotokan Karate????
by Dobbersky
07/10/14 07:14 AM
The Karate punch
by Matakiant
10/30/13 07:41 AM
Recent Posts
** Introduce Yourself! **
by Zombie Zero
Yesterday at 10:50 PM
mindfullness meditation
by log1call
08/28/14 02:39 AM
Biu Tzu- Snake hand strike
by futsaowingchun
08/27/14 09:02 PM
An open letter to bunkai researchers...
by Ed_Morris
08/26/14 09:58 PM
The Karate punch
by Ed_Morris
08/26/14 09:27 PM
Chum Kiu 2nd section applications
by futsaowingchun
08/20/14 09:54 PM
2013 World Championship Rio: The Gallery (HD)
by ergees
08/19/14 05:22 AM
attacked from behind
by AndyLA
08/16/14 04:59 PM
ITF TaeKwonDo or Shotokan Karate????
by VDJ
08/15/14 05:46 PM
Chi Sao demonstration
by futsaowingchun
08/14/14 10:57 PM
Forum Stats
22911 Members
36 Forums
35572 Topics
432483 Posts

Max Online: 424 @ 09/24/13 10:38 PM
Page 2 of 4 < 1 2 3 4 >
Topic Options
#213990 - 12/12/05 04:29 PM Re: Workouts in class? [Re: BrianS]
MattJ Offline
Free Rhinoplasty!
Prolific

Registered: 11/25/04
Posts: 15634
Loc: York PA. USA
I guess I am a bit confused by this.

The class itself should be a workout, no? I agree with a warmup, and of course some of the class will be dedicated to low intensity learning drills, but the majority of it should be partner resistance drills or sparring/rolling.

Just my opinion, but I prefer to do workouts that more closely resemble how I would be actually using my skills.

Pierre -

In all of the AKK rank tests I have been involved in, excercises were not part of the test. Higher rank tests in particular, were plenty long enough without excercises.
_________________________
"In case you ever wondered what it's like to be knocked out, it's like waking up from a nightmare only to discover it wasn't a dream." -Forrest Griffin

Top
#213991 - 12/12/05 04:42 PM Re: Workouts in class? [Re: PierrePressure]
Neko456 Offline
Professional Poster

Registered: 01/18/05
Posts: 3260
Loc: Midwest City, Ok, USA
We don't do any exercise at test, If you ain't got it together by then its too late. I want even ask a student to test if I know hes not ready physically or mentally.

I don't test endurance with exercise in test. I test it with drills and mental dilgence not getting their butt whipped, by remembering truth and controlling anger. If they perform like they have in class its a exhilarating exam, if they start doing stupid stuff like staying in the middle in 2-3 on 1 (paper sticks everybody armed) or multiple unarmed defense they can get beat down. Someone hits you and you concentrate on just him/her. You fall down you got to fight your way up. You can't let them take you out of your game plan, you have to accept that you will get hit sometimes. It ain't your show.
_________________________
DBAckerson

Top
#213992 - 12/12/05 04:55 PM Re: Workouts in class? [Re: MattJ]
Ed_Morris Offline
Professional Poster

Registered: 11/04/05
Posts: 6772
A matter of efficiency Matt. Which is a more efficient method of increasing speed...1 hour of sparring, or 30 min sparring and 30 min leg strengthening exercises.
I'd go with the leg strengthening routine.

I don't think anyone could learn proper form/strength in techniques by constantly practicing sparring. or can they?

Top
#213993 - 12/12/05 04:57 PM Re: Workouts in class? [Re: BrianS]
Gino Offline
Member

Registered: 01/10/05
Posts: 410
Loc: New York State
Once again, I'm in the minority. I agree that a good, vigorous workout, in whatever form it takes, is an important prerequisite for any class. If you want to do push-ups as part of that warm-up, fine, but don't spend alot of time on them. I have our students stretch and drill in basics mostly as a warm-up. There is just to much material in the curriculum to spend alot of time on calesthenics. If we do pushups or crunches or any of the bazillion variations of them, I use them to demonstrate to the students proper form and the importance of exercise in the martial arts. I remind the students that a well-conditioned martial artist is better able to survive a violent encounter, but it is up to them to do the majority of their conditioning on their own time.
_________________________
Gino has left the building.

Top
#213994 - 12/12/05 05:48 PM Re: Workouts in class? [Re: Ed_Morris]
MattJ Offline
Free Rhinoplasty!
Prolific

Registered: 11/25/04
Posts: 15634
Loc: York PA. USA
Quote:

A matter of efficiency Matt. Which is a more efficient method of increasing speed...1 hour of sparring, or 30 min sparring and 30 min leg strengthening exercises.
I'd go with the leg strengthening routine.

I don't think anyone could learn proper form/strength in techniques by constantly practicing sparring. or can they?




I think they can, if their instructors make it understood that good form = good efficiency. To use your example of "leg strengthening routine", I don't see how that could possibly increase your speed better than sparring.

Something about that getting hit factor that tends to bring out heretofore untapped reserves of speed that I did not know about....

And how would doing X amount of leg lifts (or whatever) change your kicking (for example) form? What if you do 100 crappy leg lifts? Or 1000? I don't see the efficiency relationship there, I guess.

Again for me, practicing skills in context has worked best. I would say that the type of sparring you do will determine how well you will learn strength and form.
_________________________
"In case you ever wondered what it's like to be knocked out, it's like waking up from a nightmare only to discover it wasn't a dream." -Forrest Griffin

Top
#213995 - 12/12/05 07:40 PM Re: Workouts in class? [Re: MattJ]
srv Offline
The OTHER forum Doctor

Registered: 11/16/05
Posts: 139
Loc: SA, Australia
For us generally the class is a tough workout in itself. We do do a lot of push ups and sit ups as well as squat kicks or traditional punches in horse stance. This stuff definitely makes you knackered. Also doing lots of bag work /mit work is hard work if you're doing strong hard techniques. Kata is hard work if you put everything into it. We may incorporate sprints and push ups / sit ups into exercises involving bag work ie sprint from 1 side of dojo to the other, do 20 round kicks of each leg, sprint back, 20 push ups 20 sit ups and keep doing that for 2 minutes etc. And sparring or grappling is really hard work. So basically while everything is predominantly focussed on techniques, the class is a workout in intself.

Top
#213996 - 12/12/05 09:45 PM Re: Workouts in class? [Re: MattJ]
Ed_Morris Offline
Professional Poster

Registered: 11/04/05
Posts: 6772
After a certain point in sparring too, technique goes out the window and it becomes a trade of sloppy wet noodles. the only training involved at that point is taking yourself to your limit of physical exhastion...there are other, and safer ways to train that.

besides, I'm not talking about 100's of reps of calestetics during class...that would be too time consuming.

I'm talking about variety with a principal theme each class: doing 25 reps of squat kicks, then kicking a pad or bag for another 25, then practice a step to the side parry kick combo kumite (or something found in kata) focusing on speed and accuracy, and then perhaps apply in non-pre arrainged drills. and repeat with variation of technique. In another class, power generation might be stressed...etc until the student eventually learns to put the principals together and without thinking.
I don't see how all principals can be trained all at once. raw muscle power needs building (exercises), coordination needs isolated drill practice (hiting a focus pad), proper technique needs understanding (repetition while being body aware), thats not to mention all of the internal training...breathing, hara, kime, etc

runners don't only run to train for speed.
boxers don't only box when training. so why should an MA class be ONLY sparring/fighting/SD? When exclusively sparring, bad habits are much harder for the student to recognize and harder for the instructor to point out. the back foot's heel coming up while kicking is one such bad habit that comes to mind.

I guess it depends what the style stresses as well. scoring points or trying to drop someone with one or two techniques are two very different philosophies and are trained for differently. one is not better than the other, just a different set of goals.

Top
#213997 - 12/12/05 10:09 PM Re: Workouts in class? [Re: Ed_Morris]
MattJ Offline
Free Rhinoplasty!
Prolific

Registered: 11/25/04
Posts: 15634
Loc: York PA. USA
Quote by MattJ -

Quote:

The class itself should be a workout, no? I agree with a warmup, and of course some of the class will be dedicated to low intensity learning drills, but the majority of it should be partner resistance drills or sparring/rolling.




*stealthily swaps Ed's regular coffee for decaf*

Quote by Ed Morris -

Quote:

boxers don't only box when training. so why should an MA class be ONLY sparring/fighting/SD? When exclusively sparring, bad habits are much harder for the student to recognize and harder for the instructor to point out.




I am not disagreeing. I never even said classes should be ONLY sparring - there are other types of resistant partner drills. But I do feel that these should be the majority, as these give a really good workout, in a properly MA context.

It's just my opinion on an internet forum. But feel free to shoot me.

Quote by Ed Morris -

Quote:

one is not better than the other, just a different set of goals.




Fair enough! I like some of your examples, too. I did think you were talking about 1000 calisthenics.

Slides into home plate, and he's SAFE!!

*hugs Ed, possibly inappropriate groping*
_________________________
"In case you ever wondered what it's like to be knocked out, it's like waking up from a nightmare only to discover it wasn't a dream." -Forrest Griffin

Top
#213998 - 12/12/05 10:46 PM Re: Workouts in class? [Re: MattJ]
Ed_Morris Offline
Professional Poster

Registered: 11/04/05
Posts: 6772
c'mon matt...whats wrong with a little verbal sparring between friends? you know we'll hug and laugh about it later...{changes back to macho tone with a throat clearing ahem}
...and then later go out and pick up on women.

Top
#213999 - 12/14/05 08:40 AM Re: Workouts in class? [Re: Ed_Morris]
AshiharaStudent Offline
Member

Registered: 07/01/05
Posts: 121
Loc: Edinburgh, Scotland
Quote:

After a certain point in sparring too, technique goes out the window and it becomes a trade of sloppy wet noodles.




Ha Ha...How true!
_________________________
All martial arts are equal.... it's just that some are more equal than others!

Top
Page 2 of 4 < 1 2 3 4 >


Moderator:  Ames, Cord, MattJ, Reiki, Ronin1966 




Action Ads
1.5 Million Plus Page Views
Monthly
Only $89
Details

Ryukyu Art
Artifacts from the Ryukyu Kingdom missing since WWII. Visit www.ShisaLion.Org to view pictures

Best Stun Guns
Self Defense Products-stun guns, pepper spray, tasers and more

Surveillance 4U
Complete surveillance systems for covert operations or secure installation security

Asylum Images
Book presents photo tour of the Trans-Allegany Lunatic Asylum. A must if you're going to take a ghost tour!

 



Unbreakable Unbrella

krav maga