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#200137 - 11/03/05 10:22 AM Re: Evil Buddha? [Re: harlan]
Kintama Offline
Professional Poster

Registered: 04/17/05
Posts: 2724
Loc: Massachusetts
I think I get it. putting some points in CAPS helped keep my attention...lol thanks.

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#200138 - 11/03/05 10:26 AM Re: Evil Buddha? [Re: WuXing]
harlan Offline
Professional Poster

Registered: 07/31/04
Posts: 6664
Loc: Amherst, MA
"Practice some meditation, walk through nature, and practice martial arts and decide how it makes you feel."

Thank you for that teaching.

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#200139 - 11/03/05 10:29 AM Re: Evil Buddha? [Re: WuXing]
Kintama Offline
Professional Poster

Registered: 04/17/05
Posts: 2724
Loc: Massachusetts
I appreciate everyone's input to the thread. I'm now a slightly more informed Secular Humanist.

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#200140 - 11/03/05 10:35 AM Re: Evil Buddha? [Re: ButterflyPalm]
butterfly Offline
Professional Poster

Registered: 08/25/04
Posts: 3012
Loc: Torrance, CA
Butterflypalm,

BTW, I am not extolling Christianity or Buddhism. Just thought I'd share some ideas. And I know the original focus is on Evil Buddha...but, I think some comparative stuff might be necessary so that the western side of us has reference.

So, I hope no one minds if I put a few thoughts forward.

Quote:

If ultimately it comes down to "choice" being the conscious determinator of ones action within the context of behaving 'good' or 'bad', then wouldn't the particular action that one chooses to take be already a pre-determined one issuing out of God's grace?





Possibly...and a very Calvinist presentation...but what you have is that a choice...and thus understanding is presented. Therefore the actions of the individual are not necessarily preordained, but are allowed to flow from independent choice, even though an omniscient being would know the outcome...a choice has to be allowed. Fate or probability?

Quote:

Or as Satan would say, God made me do it? because without an antithetical point of reference or, if you like, an "evil" element, a "good" God becomes redundant? In other words God HAS to create evil to justify His own existence?





The above is acknowledged in certain Muslim traditions where Satan is accepted in higher appreciation as being a tool for God. However, Satan, had a choice...then it can be reasoned that an Omniscient/ Omnipotent being could use that choice and change it to have benefit. Again, evil in can be presented as the lack of God, or the rejection of him and the consequences of actions without this understanding.

Quote:

If Adam & Eve had not behaved badly, there would have been no good & evil big bang?






Well, the understanding of Adam and Eve's fall from grace can be interpretted by some as the "Fortunate Fall" whereby your existence could not be without it. Choice was granted to you by this act.

In the garden, then, the Devil was allowed access. How could an omniscient being not know what was happening? Why?
To present a choice. An example would be something akin to keeping lab rats in a cage where health would equal "goodness." You give them all the best things, all the best vitamin rich foods and the rats grow strong. However, if you throw a hunk of chocolate cake in there and some soda pop...well, now its the rat's turn to choose what would be healthy or not. The problem with the cage and the provision of all things good...is that it allows only good without the active participation of the individual.

Christians believe in the resurection...thus the hope of redemption. I am not necessarily a Christian, but just thought I'd share some ideas that I have pondered. I am not religious, particularly.

And, BTW, a beer and some conversation would be welcome any time.

Sorry for the digression, but sometimes it's easier for my half western brain to grasp things in the format I am more familiar with. And by the way...my mom is a Buddhist...my father Luthern. I am neither. Go figure.

-B

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#200141 - 11/03/05 10:43 AM Re: Evil Buddha? [Re: WuXing]
butterfly Offline
Professional Poster

Registered: 08/25/04
Posts: 3012
Loc: Torrance, CA
WuXing,

Thank you very much. And all on this thread, it was very pleasurable for me to read and try to wrap my noggin around a few concepts. Later, I'll be joining Kintama in the Secular Humanist lounge. I'll be the one with the beer.

-B

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#200142 - 11/03/05 10:53 AM Re: Evil Buddha? [Re: butterfly]
Kintama Offline
Professional Poster

Registered: 04/17/05
Posts: 2724
Loc: Massachusetts
I'll be the one with the duality complex trying to decide between root beer and ginger ale.

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#200143 - 11/03/05 10:55 AM Re: Evil Buddha? [Re: butterfly]
ButterflyPalm Offline
Enigma

Registered: 08/26/04
Posts: 2637
Loc: Malaysia
The Thread is saved by two insects and a secular humanist?

There is Zen right there.

Thanks.
_________________________
I'll rather be happy than right, anytime.

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#200144 - 11/03/05 10:57 AM Re: Evil Buddha? [Re: ButterflyPalm]
harlan Offline
Professional Poster

Registered: 07/31/04
Posts: 6664
Loc: Amherst, MA
There is no-thing to be saved.

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#200145 - 11/03/05 10:59 AM Re: Evil Buddha? [Re: ButterflyPalm]
oldman Offline
Professional Poster

Registered: 07/28/04
Posts: 5884
And a Christian lay minister, administraitor, practicing Wu wei.


Edited by oldman (11/03/05 11:01 AM)

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#200146 - 11/03/05 11:04 AM Re: Evil Buddha? [Re: oldman]
ButterflyPalm Offline
Enigma

Registered: 08/26/04
Posts: 2637
Loc: Malaysia

Amen.
_________________________
I'll rather be happy than right, anytime.

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