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#194534 - 10/16/05 07:59 PM Fists and Elbows
zanshi Offline
Newbie

Registered: 05/10/05
Posts: 21
I was just wondering if anyone could tell me what the advantages and disadvantages of using elbows over fists are if any. I know that several "self-defense" courses don't advocate the use of the fist because it is something that "takes years to perfect" and you risk injury to yourself while hitting your opponent. An elbow seems like a logical alternative, and I'm told they have a lot more power than most punching techniques taught in "traditional" MAs. Any imput is welcome; I was also wondering if any of you practice a MA that emphasizes elbows over the fist? What is the basic reasoning behind the preferance for the elbow?

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#194535 - 10/16/05 10:15 PM Re: Fists and Elbows [Re: zanshi]
Leapordsknowbest Offline
Member

Registered: 11/24/04
Posts: 100
Loc: Nashville,Tenneessee
Muy Thai empizies on useing joints to strike.(elbows, knees, shins) Why so well test this. Have some punch you in the face;then elbow you in the face. You will know which hurts 100% more. Also fist break lot easier than elbow or shin do.

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#194536 - 10/16/05 10:35 PM Re: Fists and Elbows [Re: Leapordsknowbest]
Mike_L Offline
Member

Registered: 10/08/05
Posts: 420
Loc: Rio Rancho NM/Louisville KY (U...
Its spelled Muay thai! And the elbow is a harder target but has a shorter range than a punch. You should use both punches/kicks at long range and elbows/knees at close range.
_________________________
"There is no such thing as Perfection... Only excellence"

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#194537 - 10/17/05 12:45 AM Re: Fists and Elbows [Re: Mike_L]
h2whoa Offline
Member

Registered: 10/16/05
Posts: 427
Loc: Fiji
Elbows are my weapons of choice, using elbows makes your opponent lack power in his kicks and punches because you are to close for him to gather momentum!!

Not alot of people know how to fight in close. Unfortunately a lot of SD teaches you to "catch" strikes at the end of its arc!!

Good self defense is also jumping inside the range and smashing a good elow to the chin,cheek bone,collarbone etc etc.
_________________________
No matter how fashionable it is on Krypton, I will not wear my underwear on the outside of my Gi!!

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#194538 - 12/24/05 07:20 PM Re: Fists and Elbows [Re: h2whoa]
mantraman Offline
Newbie

Registered: 05/12/05
Posts: 20
The elbows are used extremely well in bare knuckle muay thai. You can also see the additional use of the vertical fist punch, check here:

www.ancientmuay.com

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#194539 - 01/20/06 11:06 AM Re: Fists and Elbows [Re: zanshi]
RavenG4 Offline
Member

Registered: 01/06/06
Posts: 34
Loc: New Jersey, USA
The other thing isif you are in too close for an effective punch or kick the next available weapon would be your elbow or knees depending on where you were hitting. You need to use the right tool for the job.
_________________________
"Evil is Powerless if the good are unafraid."- Ronald Reagan

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#194540 - 01/21/06 05:27 AM Re: Fists and Elbows [Re: zanshi]
Subedei Offline
Member

Registered: 12/23/04
Posts: 479
Range, pretty much. Hands also have a significant speed and repetition advantage.

Joints have excellent solidity and mass, but you've got to set them up. Anything that can get your hands behind your opponents kneck, for instance, sets you up for pulling his head down to meet a rising knee. Double knife hands to the temples for instance for quite well. In this instance his head isn't only accelerating towards your knee, your hands brace it.

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#194541 - 01/21/06 06:02 AM Re: Fists and Elbows [Re: zanshi]
Taison Offline
The Forum Dragon
Professional Poster

Registered: 09/06/05
Posts: 3629
Loc: BKK, Thailand
Now the thing you have to understand is that punches should travel in a straight line [with the exception of hooks], when it does and your wrist is not in the same line, it could bend at impact and break. The thing that is good with punches is that they generate power all the way into the center of the target. I recommend that you hit with your knuckles squarely on your target.

Now, elbows needs torque. Elbows lack the penetrating power of the fists but is more powerful and is a lot sharper than fists. Don't hit squarely with an elbow and you can draw blood from your opponent.

The reason why many believe elbow hits harder than a punch; It doesn't hurt as much doing an elbow when compared to punch. Try punching a wall, it hurts. Now do the elbow, it doesn't hurt as much. It's actually quite all about physics. The longer the tip of the object, the more powerful will the impact be. Now why does elbow hit so hard? The turning motion of the body, shoulder, elbow and hips. That turning movement is a lot more powerful when doing the elbow then when doing a punch. That's the reason why elbows hit hard. The human body is a complex piece of machinery and sometimes, when things looks obvious, it isn't. It doesn't hurt as much when hitting hard with an elbow, so many can concentrate a lot of force behind it and smash away while with your fists, it will hurt and thus you won't put much power into it.

Elbow and fists can hit just as hard, it just requires training.

Now, why would you use elbows over fists? Range. Already explained.

-Taison out
_________________________
I got two fists.. Don't make me use my head as well!

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#194542 - 02/08/06 07:21 PM Re: Fists and Elbows [Re: zanshi]
swift Offline
Newbie

Registered: 02/02/06
Posts: 10
- I beleive the best weapon is the one that will be the most effective. Balance is essential. Balance in the sense of being able to fight from all ranges.
- If faced with an opponent who is skilled and quick and knows how to evade attacks from someone who prefers to fight at close range then what...?
- Attacking with a elbow will not be very effective unless you know how to intercept punches and kicks and use your elbows then.
- Elbows are great to add to your arsenal..and use when effective

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#194543 - 03/27/06 05:41 AM Re: Fists and Elbows [Re: swift]
MikeChaff Offline
Member

Registered: 04/06/05
Posts: 175
Loc: England
There's another side to this, though. Elbows are also very effective against opponents who try to close distance on you. What if he lowers his head and barrels into you? No room for your fancy kicks! But you can still connect a good solid elbow.
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~Mike

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