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#193870 - 10/20/05 11:03 AM Re: Have any of you tried to add "Ninjutsu" to JKD [Re: HATT0R1_HANZ0]
paradoxbox Offline
Enthusiast

Registered: 09/15/04
Posts: 590
I haven't personally trained with Tanemura sensei yet but I do train in the genbukan. I am moving to saitama prefecture (Japan) in a few months to train at the source of the genbukan.

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#193871 - 10/20/05 11:19 AM Re: Have any of you tried to add "Ninjutsu" to JKD [Re: paradoxbox]
HATT0R1_HANZ0 Offline
Newbie

Registered: 10/18/05
Posts: 9
LMAO.....................


im about to do a very similar thing...

i will soon be moving to japan to live and train...

it will be an honour to train under Hatsumi Soke, ive trained under shihan like pedro fleitas 15th Dan and few other uk shihan but its not the same...

need it from the horses mouth... from Soke himself!

did you train in the bujinkan and then switch or what?

how did you get involved im curious...

would like to hear your opinion on the 3 organisations

peace...bujinkan student

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#193872 - 10/20/05 11:23 AM Re: Have any of you tried to add "Ninjutsu" to JKD [Re: HATT0R1_HANZ0]
MattJ Offline
Free Rhinoplasty!
Prolific

Registered: 11/25/04
Posts: 15634
Loc: York PA. USA
Guys, remember that this is a JKD forum. Please take the personal questions to PM, that is what it's for.
_________________________
"In case you ever wondered what it's like to be knocked out, it's like waking up from a nightmare only to discover it wasn't a dream." -Forrest Griffin

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#193873 - 10/20/05 11:29 AM Re: Have any of you tried to add "Ninjutsu" to JKD [Re: MattJ]
HATT0R1_HANZ0 Offline
Newbie

Registered: 10/18/05
Posts: 9
sorry im new to this board... getting carried away

wont happen again...

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#193874 - 10/20/05 02:52 PM Re: Have any of you tried to add "Ninjutsu" to JKD [Re: HATT0R1_HANZ0]
foreverrocker Offline
Member

Registered: 10/07/05
Posts: 55
It is nice to hear some real info on this topic. I have not trained under any form of Ninjutsu, but I find it very intriguing. I am not sure if it is for me or not, but I will look into it.

Thanks very much for your input.

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#193875 - 10/20/05 06:23 PM Re: Have any of you tried to add "Ninjutsu" to JKD [Re: foreverrocker]
JKogas Offline
Prolific

Registered: 01/25/03
Posts: 10818
Loc: North Carolina
Quote:

JKogas, I don't know what to say to you, I have a word though...pathetic.

I am just interested in new things, thats it.




Great. Fantastic. Wonderful! Knock yourself out. I never told you to not do something you want to do.

Quote:


To come on to my post with no knowledge of anything being discussed (see smoke bombs and climbing spikes) and bash the art which in turn is to make me look stupid for having interest in it.






Was somewhat joking about the smoke bombs and climbing spikes……..

Otherwise, grow some skin.


Quote:


I want you to tell me what gives your words any backing.




Absolutely NOTHING gives my words any backing because this is an INTERNET FORUM. You don’t know me from Adam nor I you. This forum is about nothing other than opinions which is EXACTLY what I gave this thread. You’re welcome to your OWN! You also have the right to NOT read any of the opinions expressed herein.


Quote:


Please do not say 20 years of JKD training, if so. Find a different teacher, that one sucks.





See? That’s another OPINION. Just like my own (which differs from yours). However, I’m not here to prove the validity of my coach’s training methods, nor my own ability. It doesn’t really matter to me what you or anyone else on here thinks. K?


Quote:


p.s. JKD is derived from other Martial Arts.




I agree. And it’s about rejecting the useless. Useless for me means NNJUTSU (there, I spelled it better for you).


Quote:

First of all I'm going to state I think you should be banned from these forums for being so ignorant JKogas. I'm not going to say anything more about this on that matter.





Bro – First, Look at my post count…… Do you really think I’m going to be banned? Second, as I have already mentioned on this thread several times – I’m giving my OPINION here man and wasn’t really bashing your beloved crappy art (my opinion) until YOU got your panties in a wad. So go sit down before you hurt yourself.


Quote:


>>>Why don’t I like it? Because NINJUTSU SUCKS!!! Because it’s a CRAP program, with CRAP training methods (I mean, come on – SMOKE BOMBS and CLIMBING SPIKES???!!!) and worst of all, all of the “Ninjas” I’VE ever known couldn’t fight themselves out of wet tissue paper. Is that enough?<<<


We don't use smoke bombs in dojo training. 'Climbing spikes' are not used for climbing, they're used for catching swords which is a skill practiced in muto dori. You can see a video of that demonstrated here. This is a skill that is part of one of the schools we learn. It is a traditional art, we learn traditional techniques. I'd like to see you put on a pair and catch one.





Dude, why catch a sword when I can simply pop a cap in the ass of the swordsman? Wouldn’t that seem like a more intelligent thing to do? Does to me. YOU go catch swords, lol.


Quote:


Just because you think the particular skill is useless does not make the art bad or inneffective. If you tried to do this you'd get your fingers chopped off. They're also used for slashing the face and in assisting grappling techniques.





Listen junior – I gave you my opinion. If you think that Ninjutsu is the greatest thing since sliced bread – have AT it! Just go to TOWN learning how to catch swords and all that implies. Be your very best at it because I really don’t care either way. I have you my opinion. This thread about whether anyone added Ninjutsu to their JKD and I have replied. That’s what the forums are for. Opinions are going to vary. Deal with it.


Quote:



http://www.ninpo.org/ninpotechniques/shuko.html

I would also recommend you take a look at some of the other techniques. They are not demonstrated in free form as to prevent unknowledgeable people from being able to use the techniques without training.

http://www.ninpo.org/Genbukan/ryuha.htm

Based on the horribly innacurate and sweeping generalizations you've made now and in the past, I'm lead to believe you are either outright lying or you have never ever actually met with a ninjutsu practicioner. We do not practice ashida kim, frank dux arts or any of that trash. These are real martial arts with sound techniques.






Can’t get a single link to open up that you provided. Not that I really care as I’m MORE than quite certain (seeing as how I’ve seen a LOT of similar links lately) that it isn’t going to sway my opinion. I mean hey, my opinion is what it is for a reason. Internet video clips, etc, aren’t going to change that. Show me personally and I might give you the benefit of a doubt. Till then, not happening.


Quote:


>Good for you. I hope everything went ok for you in highschool (where did it happen, SHOP CLASS? That’s where you nerds usually get beat up….)<

Actually no, it was in my own home against a robber who tried to come in through the window to rob me. I wound up slicing his arm open with a sword. But thanks for the respect. What have you done recently Mr. Armchair Quarterback?






Well since you asked……..

I was on my way to work (after thwarting a car jacking by beating the bad guy up) and I saw a building on fire. I went in and rescued a baby. I put the fire out, came down the building and was immediately surrounded by a gang of Mexican car thieves trying to break into my car. I beat them ALL up with my nunchaku in one hand and the baby in the other. It was incredible.

Turns out that by my solo apprehension of this gang, I put an end to a HUGE crime ring that had been in place in the city. The mayor recognized this and gave me a reward for saving the baby and fighting crime. I was given the key to the city and a day honored in my name. All that happened before lunch.

And no, I don’t believe YOUR story either so we’re even there……..


Quote:


>>>’m always interested in watching a fight. Sure, posts links and whatever you have.<<<

I don't know of any online clips of that fight. If you'd like a VHS of it why not email Ralph Severe and ask him for one, I'm 100% positive he'll send you a copy probably just for the price of shipping. They recorded all the fights including those between students as well as the 2 instructors themselves. I believe his website is www.artofcombat.com. Send Ralph an email and ask.





Perhaps I will. Perhaps if I get some extra time, I will try and research this out a little.


Quote:


>>>I really don’t CARE about maai<<<


This is why you would get your @$$ handed to you in a fight by anyone trained in real ninjutsu.





Yep….I’m sure of it. I’m quite certain a “real ninja” is going to appear out of a cloud of smoke and hand me my ass on a platter. Yep.

I’m shaking.


Quote:


Ma ai means distancing and positioning. If you really don't care about these things (and you've been training in JKD all those years) and still have no clue about them, well, I don't know what to say. But good luck to you standing there like a bonehead when someone comes into pound you, remember, you don't care about positioning!





Listen guy – I don’t use foreign terminology. I know DO know a little about distance and positioning. But this is merely keyboard pecking BS. Typing words doesn’t prove a thing and personally, I don’t care what you think about my “ability” that you have “somehow” ascertained across an internet forum. You’re a real smart fellow there to be able to figure THAT out (which really explains a lot from your end of things……).


Quote:


>Why haven’t they?<

Because they don't want to.





And YOU speak for “all” of them. Wow. “They” made YOU their representative. Actually man, “because they don’t want to” is the greatest cop-out excuse of them ALL!


Quote:


Most of them have better things to do than look tough, oil themselves up and wrestle with other men in speedos in front of 30,000 people.





You know something about those guys that DO choose to fight man? They at LEAST get into the cage bro. Don’t take that away from them. It’s more than your guys in black pajamas apparently do.


Quote:


>>>Who CARES!<<<


You pollute this forum and are not worthy of learning real martial arts. You lack the kind of respect and level headedness a martial artist should possess.





And that is your opinion. Opinions vary. And the feeling is mutual by the way.

I was merely giving this thread an opinion that you apparently couldn’t handle. From that point on I decided to home in on you simply BECAUSE of that. YOUR name has been spoken of quite often on the administrators forum pal. If I were you, I wouldn’t be throwing stones while living in a glass house. Instead of wanting MY ass banned, I’d be worrying about your OWN! Kapeche?!

And you think you “know me” from a few posts on an internet forum….sheesh.



Quote:


As far as I'm concerned you are an armchair quarterback. Stop lying about your experiences with ninjutsu, you've never come in contact with it in your life.

You absolutely do not deserve to be a moderator here. You consistently break every rule these forums have listed and you do it without regard to any of your fellow posters. This community is better without you here.






And that’s another opinion. This forum is FULL of them isn’t it? That’s the thing about the internet. You’d better get used to it.

As to whether I’m an “armchair quarterback”…..bro, I really don’t care what you think. So lets just run with that for a while. I’m nothing. I have no skill. I’m a complete beginner. I know nothing about nothing. All I have is my opinion – just like everyone else’s.

So what does it really matter? Not much at all. Go train with ninjas man because you have that right. Just like I have the right to my opinion. Isn’t that great about this place?


-John



ps: I was able to finally open those links. You can probably guess that my opinion hasn't really changed a whole lot.


Edited by JKogas (10/20/05 06:26 PM)

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#193876 - 10/20/05 07:53 PM Re: Have any of you tried to add "Ninjutsu" to JKD [Re: HATT0R1_HANZ0]
JKogas Offline
Prolific

Registered: 01/25/03
Posts: 10818
Loc: North Carolina
One more thing….

Quote:

well you really went to work on that guy...lol

im a student of the bujinkan,student of hatsumi soke,the grandmaster of the nine schools of the bujinkan...3 of which are ninpo.

im not here to defend the art or give you cheek or anything...

but... im eager to know why you think its a crap program as you put it,with crap training methods.





Actually I was saying most of that just to badger Paradoxbox for badgering me because I gave my views regarding JKD. It wasn’t style bashing so much as it was about the notion that JKD is about being “style free”. I don’t personally believe in ‘styles’, per se’. However Paradoxbox began needling me and I just let him have it.

For the record, a schools ability to turn out good fighters is completely dependent how two things: How the school trains its students and, the students own abilities themselves. Not “every” ninjutsu school in the world is likely to be bad but there are quite a few that are – just like everything else.

I’m loudmouthed and opinionated. Above all, I don’t take all of this quite as seriously as so many appear to either. Take the bad things I say with a grain of salt is all I can tell you.


Quote:


also... the reason for no student of the bujinkan competing in events like ufc/pride/vale tudo etc is... as i said in my post b4...

budo is not a sport!... Soke Hatsumi " budo is simply the study of the best ways to kill..."





I understand your point. But if a person is capable and functional, why shouldn't he be able to perform well in a "sport"? Do you not spar? Is that not sport?

Quote:


and when your talking about using metsubishi(smoke bombs etc) and shuko(spikes hooks for climbing)... this is not a part of the teaching in the bujinkan...

proper ninjutsu has not been taught for over twenty years(unless you trained with Stephen K Hayes in 80s)

peace ... bujinkan student





I know....I was just being obnoxious for the sake of being obnoxious.

With all of this having been said, I would still be surprised if 98% of the Ninjutsu schools in the world weren't garbage. I can't know that, but as I've said before, it's just my opinion.


Cheers!


-John

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#193877 - 10/20/05 08:26 PM Re: Have any of you tried to add "Ninjutsu" to JKD [Re: JKogas]
foreverrocker Offline
Member

Registered: 10/07/05
Posts: 55
It turns out this thread was a bad idea and this is insane.

Thanks for your "opinons" Jkogas, I feel enlightend.

yuck....

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#193878 - 10/20/05 09:24 PM Re: Have any of you tried to add "Ninjutsu" to JKD [Re: foreverrocker]
paradoxbox Offline
Enthusiast

Registered: 09/15/04
Posts: 590
Forreverrocker the best idea is to just put him on your mental ignore list like most other forumites here have done. Since he abuses his moderator privileges and cannot be ignored via the forum functions it's the best you can do.
The littlest people usually talk trash the most and this guy talks enough trash to make a new york landfill look microscopic. Anything JKogas here has said about ninjutsu is false so definately do not rely on a person like that for your info.

Jkogas I have nothing to prove to you, and I don't give a damn whether or not you think I defended myself or not. I know the truth and I know the concequences of my actions and that is good enough for me.

I think you're probably a sub par martial artist though judging by the way you talk (actually I know you are, a good martial artist doesn't talk so much trash) and I look forward to meeting you some day in the future at a throwdown to see if you are as good as you say you are. Yeah you will see me at one. Despite your regular claims of 22 years of experience I wonder how inflated that figure is or if you were too busy eying yourself in the mirror all those years or abusing your fellow students to actually improve your skills. Your personality obviously hasn't gotten better from your MA practice. But whatever. Your post count proves nothing more than the fact that you spend more time talking trash about other peoples training than you actually do training yourself.

Other than that, you've been added to my personal ignore list permanently.

It's really disgraceful that you are a moderator on this site.

foreverrocker if you'd like some accurate info regarding ninjutsu contact me via pm and I'll hook you up with what I can.

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#193879 - 10/20/05 10:49 PM Re: Have any of you tried to add "Ninjutsu" to JKD [Re: paradoxbox]
JKogas Offline
Prolific

Registered: 01/25/03
Posts: 10818
Loc: North Carolina
Quote:


Jkogas I have nothing to prove to you, and I don't give a damn whether or not you think I defended myself or not. I know the truth and I know the concequences of my actions and that is good enough for me.




Cool. All I know is that you could have made the whole thing up. I wouldn’t be the least bit surprised if you had made it up. People do these things all the time and I’m just not easily swayed by yet another “real life internet story”. My bad for being jaded and cynical. I’ll lose no sleep over it, I’ll say that much.


Quote:


I think you're probably a sub par martial artist though judging by the way you talk (actually I know you are, a good martial artist doesn't talk so much trash)




Just like good basketball players don’t talk trash when they play, right? Pray that you outgrow your naiveté at some point.


Quote:


and I look forward to meeting you some day in the future at a throwdown to see if you are as good as you say you are.




Save time and come my way bro. We can have one anytime you’d like. Want the address? Email me and will set something up!

Quote:


Yeah you will see me at one. Despite your regular claims of 22 years of experience I wonder how inflated that figure is or if you were too busy eying yourself in the mirror all those years or abusing your fellow students to actually improve your skills.




22 years of experience isn’t all that hard to come by considering that I’m 40 years old. I’ve been studying martial arts since I was 13. Of course, the real way to find out is to come and experience my skill or lack thereof for yourself. Bring your smoke bombs.


Quote:


Your personality obviously hasn't gotten better from your MA practice. But whatever.





Dude, you do NOT know me or, know what my personality is like. LOL at YOU for thinking you can determine this over an INTERNET FORUM! YOU are an IDIOT!


Quote:


Your post count proves nothing more than the fact that you spend more time talking trash about other peoples training than you actually do training yourself.




Man, your post count is going up by the minute.

Quote:

Other than that, you've been added to my personal ignore list permanently.




Why didn’t you just do that from the get go? All of this could have been avoided?

Quote:

It's really disgraceful that you are a moderator on this site.




Thanks for your OPINION! Those vary.


Have a nice day!


-John

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