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#193606 - 10/12/05 11:08 PM Kosa-dachi (cross-step stance)
hedkikr Offline
Professional Poster

Registered: 02/28/05
Posts: 2827
Loc: Southern California, USA
When I 1st learned Kosa-dachi, I never questioned it. I just thought it looked cool.

A few years after I began teaching karate, a student asked me what it was for & I didn't know. With my reputation & ego @ stake, I made up an explanation, "If you lose your balance, you can catch yourself & continue fighting." (sounded OK).

A while back I began to think about Kosa-dachi as it is applied in Pinan Godan (Shito-ryu version) when it hit me. No one had ever explained the "Statue of Liberty" pose to my satisfaction but now it seemed so natural.

(Disclaimer: I'm not claiming that this is the only, correct or best application)

Movement:
Empi-uchi (elbow strike) followed by Uraken (back-fist) in Kosa-dachi. Pivot w/ L fist below R vertical forearm ("Statue of Liberty" for my kids).

Bunkai: Shoulder throw.
Explanation: Launch R elbow to the ribs w/ an immediate R backfist to the nose. Your L hand is grabbing his R arm/sleeve. Your R arm then slides below his R arm pit as you pivot. You are now in position to execute a shoulder throw by pulling his R arm down as you "bow" & lift w/ your legs/hip.

Q: "But what about the next Kosa-dachi w/ Juji-uke (downward X-block)?"
A: "It's not a piece of the previous bunkai. Anyway some perform it w/ a jump, others don't."

The pivoting (unwinding) action is also relavent in the opening move of Bassai-dai. (if you don't get it, I'll tell you later...this is too long already)

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#193607 - 10/12/05 11:15 PM Re: Kosa-dachi (cross-step stance) [Re: hedkikr]
SANCHIN31 Offline
Former Moderator

Registered: 12/26/04
Posts: 3783
Loc: Arkansas, U.S.
I use the cross-step as a kick to opponents leg application while lock is applied.
_________________________
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#193608 - 10/13/05 04:13 AM Re: Kosa-dachi (cross-step stance) [Re: hedkikr]
sumrandom Offline
Member

Registered: 07/14/05
Posts: 52
Loc: Western Australia
Nice bit of bunkai hedkikr I'd never considered a shoulder throw.

Your discalimer applies to my post from here on.
"(Disclaimer: I'm not claiming that this is the only, correct or best application)"

The thought occurs to me that this particular sequence in heian godan I'm not going to call it pinan in case the version I've been taught as heian is different) could also be a leg lift.

I've always thought of the uraken as a strike, but what if it's actually getting someone's leg into the crook of your elbow (whether you're 'catching' a kick or not) and then standing up. I would draw a parallel between the 'liberty' pose you make reference to and the leg catch in Bassai-dai.

IMO kosa-dachi could be used here to allow you to get low and under a leg and then lift it with a straight back.

Oh, and I totally see what you're getting at with the opening move of Bassai too.

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#193609 - 10/13/05 01:19 PM Re: Kosa-dachi (cross-step stance) [Re: hedkikr]
Ogoun Offline
Member

Registered: 03/22/04
Posts: 96
Loc: Fort Myers, FL
Does anyone see a grappling technique on the ground like an arm-bar or a lock?

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#193610 - 10/13/05 02:21 PM Re: Kosa-dachi (cross-step stance) [Re: hedkikr]
medulanet Offline
Professional Poster

Registered: 09/03/03
Posts: 2142
Loc: Phoenix, Arizona USA
Good application, the shoulder throw is pretty much the accepted realistic application of that tehcnique in classical karate, but when you think of the uraken and kosa dachi think of unbalancing and entering in to clinching range. In karate before any throw there is an unbalancing. The strike unbalances as the kick/sweep to the leg does. The sweep is the back leg in the kosa dachi. The jump that some perform is a misinterpretation. After the sweep there is a big step to step over the leg and to get momentum for the throw. And yes, on the ground you do lock up the arm similar to a Kimura. However, this is a bit different from Passai.

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#193611 - 10/13/05 06:29 PM Re: Kosa-dachi (cross-step stance) [Re: Ogoun]
SANCHIN31 Offline
Former Moderator

Registered: 12/26/04
Posts: 3783
Loc: Arkansas, U.S.
Quote:

Does anyone see a grappling technique on the ground like an arm-bar or a lock?




Not me.
_________________________
Skinny,Bald,and Handsome! Fightingarts Warrior of the year

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#193612 - 10/13/05 08:00 PM Re: Kosa-dachi (cross-step stance) [Re: SANCHIN31]
medulanet Offline
Professional Poster

Registered: 09/03/03
Posts: 2142
Loc: Phoenix, Arizona USA
One key in understanding kata is to realize that stacked hands/crossed arms can signify a lock/grappling. Don't imagine only the hands grasping, but your opponent's arms intertwined with your own. But this is more advanced level bunkai to kata which is hard to explain on the net if one has not trained in it. Think about it kneeling down on top of your opponent your just threw on the ground. You keep the arm your used to throw and work a lock.

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#193613 - 10/14/05 05:34 PM Re: Kosa-dachi (cross-step stance) [Re: hedkikr]
shoshinkan Offline
Professional Poster

Registered: 05/10/05
Posts: 2662
Loc: UK
kosa dachi, i currently use it fo 2 main things -

1. wind up/prep for throw/takedown

2. cross step with srike

I find it a very useful 'sinking' position to maximise power from the ground up
_________________________
Jim Neeter

www.shoshinkanuk.blogspot.com

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#193614 - 10/17/05 08:07 AM Re: Kosa-dachi (cross-step stance) [Re: shoshinkan]
eyrie Offline
Professional Poster

Registered: 12/28/04
Posts: 3106
Loc: QLD, Australia
It's also the first stepping movement in Naihanchi.
It can be used as a leg jam/strike, leg grapple, prelude to a 180 pivot, a way to shift the body off the line, or to make a grapple work.

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#193615 - 10/17/05 10:25 AM Re: Kosa-dachi (cross-step stance) [Re: eyrie]
shoshinkan Offline
Professional Poster

Registered: 05/10/05
Posts: 2662
Loc: UK
I agree with all those things, im also slowing down and spell checking my posts from now on !

Its a very usefull position IMO, however it must be used as a pass through, like all stances otherwise its application uses are poor, static stances dont work to well in many cases.

In fact fluidity seems to be karates biggest application problem, ie karate that isnt fluid.
_________________________
Jim Neeter

www.shoshinkanuk.blogspot.com

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#193616 - 10/17/05 11:54 AM Re: Kosa-dachi (cross-step stance) [Re: shoshinkan]
medulanet Offline
Professional Poster

Registered: 09/03/03
Posts: 2142
Loc: Phoenix, Arizona USA
Karate performed incorrectly is not fluid.

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#193617 - 10/17/05 06:08 PM Re: Kosa-dachi (cross-step stance) [Re: medulanet]
shoshinkan Offline
Professional Poster

Registered: 05/10/05
Posts: 2662
Loc: UK
sounds like another post Medulanet, feel free to do the honours as you have a wealth of expierience

and to avoid confusion, im on the side that correct karate is most certainly fluid, with a nice dash of explosiveness.
_________________________
Jim Neeter

www.shoshinkanuk.blogspot.com

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