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differences between shaolin and wing chun ?
by liangxiaoyu123
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differences between shaolin and wing chun ?
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#190773 - 10/03/05 02:23 PM Bruce Lee's fights
roniwankan Offline
Member

Registered: 08/31/05
Posts: 99
Loc: Brazil, Goias
I practice karate, and like you I am Bruce's fan.
I read everything about him as I can.
I just have curiosity about one thing: Bruce Lee trainned Wing Chun, Wun Chu, karate and lot of other MA and created a method of trainning called Jeet Kune Do.
What kind of MA Bruce Lee had trainned beyond what I listed?
_________________________
KARATE DO GA MUZUKASHII MICHI ARUKI NI DESSU, SHIKASHI YOI MONO WO YARI MASSU.

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#190774 - 10/03/05 06:42 PM Re: Bruce Lee's fights [Re: roniwankan]
SANCHIN31 Offline
Former Moderator

Registered: 12/26/04
Posts: 3783
Loc: Arkansas, U.S.
You list several arts he supposedly trained in,but for how long and from who? I believe his ego created his own style rather than sticking around long enough to get past the basics in any one.So far he was the only one good at his style and only on film.I'm more impressed with Chuck Norris,a true warrior and competition fighter.
I have much respect for Bruce Lee,but more respect for many oters. Just my opinion,flame on.
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Skinny,Bald,and Handsome! Fightingarts Warrior of the year

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#190775 - 10/04/05 11:59 AM Re: Bruce Lee's fights [Re: SANCHIN31]
dynacker Offline
Newbie

Registered: 04/15/05
Posts: 12
Loc: Sydney, NSW, Australia
You cannot really deny Bruce Lee's skill and speed however I only believe he has really mastered Wing Chun out of all the arts he says he has done. He has also claimed to have done hapkido too - and i'm more than certain he has grappling experience (saw in one of the doc).

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#190776 - 10/04/05 12:45 PM Re: Bruce Lee's fights [Re: SANCHIN31]
Neko456 Offline
Professional Poster

Registered: 01/18/05
Posts: 3260
Loc: Midwest City, Ok, USA
One thing I like about Master Chuck Norris is that he lost to and beat some of the best and toughest Karate/TKD people in the USA in his prime, in bare knuckle events.

As great as he was and is. He is not easily fooled and could tell true skill and masterful technique, Master Norris was impressed & studied with Sifu Lee as did these Iron men Delgado, Stone, Lewis, Sander, Insanto and Kelly just to name a few. These guys were not impressed with other Kung-fu styles enough to study them (mostly because they beat them when the sparred) but they were impressed by Bruce Lee. Most of these guys sparred around with Lee and he changed what and how they thought and moved, thats just how it was back then. Somebody got hit hard.
Bruce would work with what you have and not try to make you over compeltely. Most won't change what they know work for them.

Back to Master Norris he continued his study like the pepetual student he is, and has studied BJJ among other arts. Bruce was Real, weather he was the best fighter in the world, its doubtful. But did he change the way we think and train absolutely!

Bruce was not thought highly of by Kung-fu Master of his day, but Karate fighters that worked with him thought very highly him. And the certified instructor that I've trained with in seminars and meets are very good. Dan Inasanto is simply fantastic the list goes on and on. Dan says that Lee was a better technicain then he!!!Is that possible? Some say not as good a teacher.
Dan didn't say the teaching thing others senior students did. Lee liked to spar, good people he could hit hard, not intermed students.


Bruce studied Grappling from Judo great Gene Lebelle among others, Bruce was a preverbal sponge when it came to training Savate, Western Boxing, Fencing, & wrestling, anything to improve his skills. I hear he wasn't much on Chi training.

Personally I perferr JKD over WC, in overall versitilty. Just me, I'm not hating. WC good too.


Edited by Neko456 (10/04/05 12:58 PM)
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#190777 - 10/04/05 04:22 PM Re: Bruce Lee's fights [Re: roniwankan]
jkdwarrior Offline
Member

Registered: 04/17/05
Posts: 341
Loc: belfast, Antrim, Ireland
What a lot of people don't understand is that jkd isn't a style of martial arts. Bruce did take certain parts of other forms, but in the end he was just expressing his body to its greatest potential. Bruce, like myself, did not believe in styles. There is no such thing when you're talking about street fighting. There are no rules, so in order to be the best you can possibly be, you need to fight using all the weapons and tactics to their greatest potential. Many people who study other styles are already doing this, so even though they don't conciously know it, they are doing jkd. If you've taken what your instructor has taught you, and done it a different way that is more effective, then you too are doing jkd. If you can make yourself better, then do it. It doesn't matter if you've been taught differently. Jkd is just a name. There shouldn't be a name for it. It is simply an attempt to make you a faster, stronger, more powerful, more efficient and more effective fighter. We are encouraged to change what we've learned if we think there is a better way. To tell the truth, for those who truly understand what jkd is, and want to get the most out of their body in terms of fighting, there is no other way.
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Sticks n stones'll break my bones, but if I land the first one, you're in trouble!

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#190778 - 10/04/05 05:21 PM Re: Bruce Lee's fights [Re: dynacker]
Neko456 Offline
Professional Poster

Registered: 01/18/05
Posts: 3260
Loc: Midwest City, Ok, USA
Actually its said that Bruce was not a certified instructor of Wing Chun, he was barely equalivant to a Shodan in a belt rank system. But he did undestand its entire basic concept and built upon that, you use to see a lot of trapping in JKD then it was more hiiting as you trap, now it seems to be more Kalia or Kickboxing movement.
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#190779 - 10/04/05 05:26 PM Re: Bruce Lee's fights [Re: roniwankan]
Toryu88 Offline
Stranger

Registered: 10/04/05
Posts: 1
Just some observations. The name, Jeet Kune Do or Way of the Intercepting Fist. Interesting that. What does it mean? I study Aikido. One of the more non traditional styles of Aikido. One of our primary tenets is to intercept our opponent as he begins his attack and pre-empt him or catch him when he is most vunerable. Lee encorporated much the same in JKD. It is interesting that he chose to use the Japanese phrase Do or Way in his style.
You can easily see what he meant by "intercept". Look at a clip of him stoping an opponent with a side kick, he closes on the opponent adding 2-3 times times the power (M*V=P)of his mass alone and much more than could be generated by his quadracepts muscle alone. These are principles easily demonstrated by an Aikidoka. I have effortlessly turned a would be opponent on his head before he or this two buddies got withing punching distance by intercepting him with Shomen-ate.

My son who studies Kenpo was skeptical until I showed him that it was impossible for him to land a kick or a punch before I was inside both and had broken his balance.

Lee cherry picked what he saw was best in a variety of arts.

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#190780 - 10/08/05 10:53 AM Re: Bruce Lee's fights [Re: SANCHIN31]
foreverrocker Offline
Member

Registered: 10/07/05
Posts: 55
I agree that Bruce's ego helped him to create his type of martial art. I also agree that Norris is a great fighter, in the ring. Bruce was a real world fighter, unconfined from the restrictions of "ring" fighting. Bruce would eat Chuck up in a street fight and Chuck might win in the ring. Both of these greats brought us sooo much and I am thankful.

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#190781 - 11/16/05 11:24 AM Re: Bruce Lee's fights [Re: foreverrocker]
mike_p Offline
Newbie

Registered: 11/16/05
Posts: 17
Bruce was first and foremost a street fighter. His first students included skilled judo men, boxers, and street fighters. According to them, he could tie them up and hit them at will. At a Seattle YMCA, he severely pounded a karate man who had repeatedly provoked him. Years later, karate competitors came to him to increase their effectiveness. He also did very well against hand picked gung fu man Wong Jack Man in Oakland. It is true that Bruce did not complete the entire Yip Man wing chun style in Hong Kong, but he developed speed, power, intensity, and his own technique to a level that few would be capable of dealing with. Ask the guys who trained with him.

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#190782 - 11/17/05 06:03 PM Re: Bruce Lee's fights [Re: mike_p]
mike_p Offline
Newbie

Registered: 11/16/05
Posts: 17
In regard to the original question on this thread, Bruce studied some tai chi and hung gar gung fu previous to switching to his core art of Yip Man wing chun. He picked up pointers from senior wing chun fighters William Cheung and Wong Shun Leung. He also did some western boxing and learned some other gung fu forms before coming to the US. After coming here, he learned some preying mantis gung fu, red boat wing chun, and absorbed some judo and boxing from his first US students. He later picked up some fencing concepts from his brother, and absorbed pieces of other arts from students and friends. He never formally studied any other arts (karate, hapkido, tae kwon do, kali, etc) but exhibited great ability at seeing someone do technique, then later coming back and doing it better than them.

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