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#189508 - 03/24/08 12:36 PM Re: sport tkd vs street tkd [Re: ITFunity]
mangoman Offline
Newbie

Registered: 01/31/08
Posts: 19
My daughter's school teaches only sport TKD, no forms, no self defense, no bowing to any "superior intellect" or stupid symbols. She show's up. She puts on her gear. She practices Olympic Style TKD. A couple hours later she takes off her gear and goes home. She repeats the next day.

Could she hold her own in a street fight. Hopefully we will never find out. Should the situation happen, she has clear instructions to not even bother with trying her TKD skills. Kick to the crotch, bite, spit, scratch, pi$$ on, throw dirt in the eyes, scream, what ever it takes to get a few feet of distance from the bad guy(s) and at your first opportunity, run like hell to the nearest person for assistance.

Any of you clowns that think that your (insert martial arts skill here) will save your ass in a street fight so you go out trying to find one needs to know that there is always someone out there that knows more or doesn't play by your same rules.


Edited by mangoman (03/24/08 12:38 PM)
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#189509 - 03/24/08 01:24 PM Re: sport tkd vs street tkd [Re: mangoman]
Dereck Offline
Prolific

Registered: 10/04/04
Posts: 10413
Loc: Great White North
A little bit of anger there mangoman however I will give you my opinion for what it is worth.

It sounds like you understand that your school is only about sport sparring and there is nothing wrong with that ... not what so ever. Many children/teens/adults join sports to compete and that is what sport sparring is. If you school doesn't sugar coat it and tell the students they are learning self defense then I see no problem.

Now I want to state for the record, unless you train to fight and unless you test those skills through competition then you won't have a clue of what a real fight can entail and even as a trained martial artist you may meet somebody tougher, you may meet somebody equally as skilled, you may have an emotional dump or a multitude of many other things happen that your training won't help you one bit.

Completion is the safest way to test your skills and getting used to the resistance of a person trying to win. This isn't street fighting as you have rules and you have a ref to step in however this is the closest you will get to actually fighting. I've been told this time and time again and I have found this out for myself as well through personal experience.

Remember, knowing a martial art doesn't make you a fighter. You may know more then the average person but being able to use that is a whole different thing. Without resistance training and testing of these skills then you truly haven't explored enough to be as effective as you could be. And just because you martial arts train doesn't mean you won't have your butt handed to you but somebody with no skill.

When it comes to the streets and especially in todays age, get out of there as soon as possible without fighting if possible. Do what is necessary as required and trust me, it won't look pretty even if you are trained. If the school your daughter is in explains it like you said then that is all good in my books.
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#189510 - 03/24/08 02:52 PM Re: sport tkd vs street tkd [Re: Dereck]
von1 Offline
Member

Registered: 02/04/08
Posts: 260
Quote:



Any of you clowns that think that your (insert martial arts skill here) will save your ass in a street fight so you go out trying to find one needs to know that there is always someone out there that knows more or doesn't play by your same rules.







Hey!

that is not nice you are cheating and not playing by the discussion rules.

You are street talking and I did not train for this!


Edited by Supremor (03/24/08 03:16 PM)

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#189511 - 03/24/08 03:15 PM Re: sport tkd vs street tkd [Re: mangoman]
Supremor Offline
Professional Poster

Registered: 07/22/04
Posts: 2510
Loc: UK
Quote:


Any of you clowns that think that your (insert martial arts skill here) will save your ass in a street fight so you go out trying to find one needs to know that there is always someone out there that knows more or doesn't play by your same rules.




I think you have misunderstood the aim of a SD based martial art. The goal is not to become a match for the toughest guys in the world- that is to say, who goes to a basketball club expecting to be able to beat NBA players? The hope of MAists who train this way is to raise the odds somewhat should they ever get into such a situation.

Now, personally I think it would be folly to argue that any skill will gaurantee success in something. Your daughter may train all day every day, but one day she may well compete against someone in competition that beats her. Likewise, one can train hard for self defense, but there are some things you just can't deal with- the advantage of SD is that such situations are much rarer, and there is plenty of chance to de-escalate the violence and walk away- all skills that a martial artists training for SD will learn.

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#189512 - 03/25/08 12:05 PM Re: sport tkd vs street tkd [Re: Supremor]
dicen Offline
Member

Registered: 02/04/06
Posts: 57
Self defense does not equal fighting plain and simple. You want to learn how to fight join the military where they show you how to kill. Self defense is that one split second where the agressor, who thinks you're weak, trys to surprise you with an attack. SD martial arts are geared to react to that initial action and counter immediately. If the SD martial artist isn't able to end the situation at that moment then it becomes a fight and thats an entirely different animal because now the agressor now knows what you're capable of.

A sports TKD practitioner will have the same chance as a sports boxer, they're both trained to react to a person coming at them. Furthermore since the TKD practioner has the advantage of attacking of ending the fight before the other guy can close distance and make it a ruff and tumble fight.

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#189513 - 03/27/08 09:23 PM Re: sport tkd vs street tkd [Re: Supremor]
Huhmasta Offline
Got sent to the corn field
Member

Registered: 03/27/08
Posts: 31
Listen TKDFighter89, I don't think I can agree with you on an olympic medalist surviving a street fight. I mean unless he was also taught self defense portion of tae kwon do, then he's pretty much dead. If he only knew sport tae kwon do, I guess he would have the upper hand in terms of striking and against one on one. But self defense requires SOO much more than just one on one combat and striking. He would probably die if the attacker had a gun, a knife, came with 5 guys, etc.

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#189514 - 03/28/08 02:21 AM Re: sport tkd vs street tkd [Re: Huhmasta]
Novum Offline
Member

Registered: 02/25/08
Posts: 58
Loc: New England
Lucky for all of us that learning martial arts also includes learning discipline and responsibility for your own actions. Kind of like the same discipline and responsibility that people use to avoid violence by staying aware, keeping your ego in check, and looking out for the best interests of the people who depend on your continued health. I'd wager that this hypothetical olympic tae kwon do fighter would have the good sense and judgment to know that his kids can't eat if he's too maimed or dead to put food on their table. Peace is the truth behind martial arts as far as I'm concerned. Someone correct me if I'm out of line in saying so.
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#189515 - 03/28/08 08:54 AM Re: sport tkd vs street tkd [Re: Novum]
von1 Offline
Member

Registered: 02/04/08
Posts: 260
quote
He would probably die if the attacker had a gun, a knife, came with 5 guys, etc.

end quote

silly, silly, siiiiilly statement!

And so would you!

and anyone else, unless there is a good amount of luck involved, I don"t give a crap how good one thinks they are or what type of martial arts one practices. This is not the movies. Yes, if you were to luck out and get some duff-us holding the gun/knife one could possibly defend, probably not unscathed though, I hope I never have to find out, by the way hahmasta, most every WTF affiliated school trains SD as you do so don"t kid yourself about sport fighters, their chances of surviving are as good as any one who trains TKD.

ooops, replied to the wrong person, my reply is to hahmasta"s post.


Edited by von1 (03/28/08 09:24 AM)

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#189516 - 03/28/08 11:36 AM Re: sport tkd vs street tkd [Re: von1]
Dereck Offline
Prolific

Registered: 10/04/04
Posts: 10413
Loc: Great White North
I was going to submit something similar Von but you beat me to it. Totally agree.

I do agree that those that only train sport are missing out on a lot of good information however those that do train sport understand distance, movements of their opponent, have great cardio and can attack and avoid quickly. Plus competition is a great means of testing yourself under pressure and understand being hit ... those are great benefits and "can" give them an edge over unskilled and unsuspecting assailants. But as Von pointed out, these people are most likely getting self defense training as well that increases their chances on the street.

In my opinion those that train self defense and also train to compete are farther ahead in the game then those that only train self defense. Those that only train self defense and don't test those skills will never understand the pressure or the skill needed to deal with somebody trying to defeat them.
_________________________
"IF I COME ... I'M BRINGING THE PAIN WITH ME"

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#189517 - 03/28/08 03:46 PM Re: sport tkd vs street tkd [Re: Dereck]
von1 Offline
Member

Registered: 02/04/08
Posts: 260


quote
In my opinion those that train self defense and also train to compete are farther ahead in the game then those that only train self defense. Those that only train self defense and don't test those skills will never understand the pressure or the skill needed to deal with somebody trying to defeat them.
end quote




Bingo!

And that does not mean straining against the same old people you train with day in and day out, it means testing your skills against the unknown under stress.

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