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#177742 - 08/18/05 10:32 AM Re: I wear snivel-gear!!! [Re: SANCHIN31]
Galen Offline
Member

Registered: 11/07/04
Posts: 381
Quote:

Maybe we should take a poll.?




Wouldnt do any good. A thousand votes to one, the issue is still one of opionion. The right thing is still the right thing, even if only one person does it, and the wrong thing is still the wrong thing, even if a thousand people do it.

Quote:

IMO means in my opinion,how is an opinion a generalization?




I can say all that all martial artists are mornons. That is an opinion, and it is a generalization. Almost EVERYTHING on these forums is opinion. There is (virtually) no hard fact. That doesnt change the fact the the comment, opinion or otherwise, is a generalization.

Quote:

You actually have people that sign up for martial arts and are glad they won't be learning self defense? Who are you kidding here? I have known numerous amounts of martial artist and have been to several schools,this is a first.




Ah, not everyone wants to, and more to the point, needs to learn how to fight. There is a very wide range of people who seek artistic and personal ends in their training, over and above being able to fight. Do you really think that the 45 year old business man, and 30 year old mother of two wake up one fine morning and say 'wow...I need to learn how to how to defend myself!' Most people have NO practical need to learn how to defend themselves, simply because their life style doesnt require it. I tell them that the things they will learn will extend far above mere and simple delf defense. From my perspective, learning how to defend yourself may be a part of what I teach, but it is the most unimportant aspect of that learning.

Quote:

That may be. I have a hard time communicating in words without being blunt which can seen offensive,sorry. To each his own. I'm sure you are doing your best at your school and if you and your students are happy with it more power to you,friend.




I know! Its so hard to communicate the tone and intent of what you are thinking without face to face communication. I know I come off as brusque and critical, when I really dont intend that.

I think in the end it comes down to realizing that there are as many reasons for training as there are people who train.

Learning to fight, or to defend yourself, or whatever euphamism you want to throw in there, is only one.

Galen
_________________________
Nothing imperfect is the measure of anything!

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#177743 - 08/18/05 11:19 AM Re: I wear snivel-gear!!! [Re: Galen]
Gavin Offline
Professional Poster

Registered: 05/11/05
Posts: 2267
Loc: Southend, Essex, UK
Galen, I've been reading this thread with great interest and I think you've made some great points, which have come over brilliantly.

IMVHO the main intent for learning a MA is to learn how fight/defend yourself/some other term. Yes, through MA I agree that people will become 3 billion times more than they were before they started, but they must want to learn how to fight. If not why learn a fighting art? The intention behind a Martial Art has to be Martial, otherwise its just not a MA, merely a collection of moves that some old time guys once used to use to hurt other old timesguys. Whether you actually use your MA to defend yourself is irrelevant, fighting is still the primary intention of studying the MA.

There are far more efficient ways of achieving the fringe benefits of the MA's. Aerobic workouts are far better for building stamina and finding religion will probably make you a better person. Those wanting to be artistic have to be true to the real intention of the art. My art, a fighting art, is about learning the art of fighting. So I personally can't understand anyone wanting to study a fighting art without being concerned with how to fight.

I hope that has come across disrespectfully, as I have thoroughly enjoyed this thread thus far!


Edited by Gavin (08/18/05 11:25 AM)
_________________________
Gavin King
www.SHIKON.COM
Follow me on twitter @taichigav

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#177744 - 08/18/05 11:32 AM Re: I wear snivel-gear!!! [Re: Gavin]
Galen Offline
Member

Registered: 11/07/04
Posts: 381
Quote:

The intention behind a Martial Art has to be Martial




Couldnt disagre more, though I dont think we are that far apart in perspective. You state here that the intention must be martial; I simply believe that the vehicle for learning is martial, not the intent.

Quote:

I hope that has come across disrespectfully, as I have thoroughly enjoyed this thread thus far!




You have come across very well, friend. I take no personal offense in any of this, and appreciate the opportunity to exercise my deabating muscles again.

Galen
_________________________
Nothing imperfect is the measure of anything!

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#177745 - 08/18/05 11:47 AM Re: I wear snivel-gear!!! [Re: Galen]
Gavin Offline
Professional Poster

Registered: 05/11/05
Posts: 2267
Loc: Southend, Essex, UK
Quote:

Couldnt disagre more, though I dont think we are that far apart in perspective. You state here that the intention must be martial; I simply believe that the vehicle for learning is martial, not the intent.




Guess I'm just not as enlightend yet as I should be! Back under the bloody waterfall for me!

I've been working on an article about intent for about a month for my website. It's been through about 20 rewrites now, one version will make me come across as beliving that MA's are for killing so I rewrote it and looked like a complete arty farty tree hugger (not saying that you hug tree's BTW)!

I'm affraid I'm still on the side of the fence that believes fighting arts mean fighting, but I'm also a young arogant instructor hungry for challanges. I think wanting to fight everything that moves is a prerequisite for my current role in the world!
_________________________
Gavin King
www.SHIKON.COM
Follow me on twitter @taichigav

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#177746 - 08/18/05 11:54 AM Re: I wear snivel-gear!!! [Re: Gavin]
Galen Offline
Member

Registered: 11/07/04
Posts: 381
Quote:

Guess I'm just not as enlightend yet as I should be! Back under the bloody waterfall for me!




Well, speaking for myself, I am about as enlightened as a tree stump (not news to some of you I know...

Quote:

I've been working on an article about intent for about a month for my website. It's been through about 20 rewrites now, one version will make me come across as beliving that MA's are for killing so I rewrote it and looked like a complete arty farty tree hugger (not saying that you hug tree's BTW)!




Can you share the website? Would love to read it!

Quote:

I'm affraid I'm still on the side of the fence that believes fighting arts mean fighting, but I'm also a young arogant instructor hungry for challanges. I think wanting to fight everything that moves is a prerequisite for my current role in the world!




And God love ya for it!!

See, I dont think that perspective is wrong, so much as I know its not for me, not as a goal unto itself. I mean I love putting the gloves on and getting ugly now and again myself. I just like to think that the intent of it all is a little different.

Anyway, thanks for the work out!!

Cheers

Galen
_________________________
Nothing imperfect is the measure of anything!

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#177747 - 08/18/05 12:01 PM Re: I wear snivel-gear!!! [Re: Galen]
Gavin Offline
Professional Poster

Registered: 05/11/05
Posts: 2267
Loc: Southend, Essex, UK
Quote:

Anyway, thanks for the work out!!




Pleasure my friend! The article isn't up there yet, I bogged together another one to make up for it. My site is www.gosokempo.com and there's plenty of my inane ramblings on there under the articles section. Feel free to have a gander, they aren't that good but I'm trying!
_________________________
Gavin King
www.SHIKON.COM
Follow me on twitter @taichigav

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