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#171692 - 08/01/05 10:46 AM Re: Net responsibility [Re: glad2bhere]
kickcatcher Offline
Member

Registered: 12/30/04
Posts: 200
Loc: UK
Quote:

Its not bad enough that some guy is writing in and effectively wants to know what the best sword to use in an urban setting is.


Just direct the kid to the martialist. He'll go in looking for a blade and come out with a DEADLY FLASHLIGHT (LOL). If these nuts really had the potential to do what they dream about, they would go to their local hardware shop... Dim Mak or Brick... which is more effective? lol.
_________________________
Judokakakakaka!!!!!!!

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#171693 - 08/01/05 11:30 AM Re: Net responsibility [Re: glad2bhere]
MattJ Offline
Free Rhinoplasty!
Prolific

Registered: 11/25/04
Posts: 15634
Loc: York PA. USA
Quote by G2BH -

Quote:

Know what, Lane? Stick it in your ear.




Ah....there it is. Interesting counseling technique, Bruce.

Quote:

I did my part. After a thread like this, take a wild guess how willing I am to pitch-in if I have any other recommendations or suggestions.




We should be so lucky.
_________________________
"In case you ever wondered what it's like to be knocked out, it's like waking up from a nightmare only to discover it wasn't a dream." -Forrest Griffin

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#171694 - 08/01/05 11:48 AM Re: Net responsibility [Re: glad2bhere]
Kintama Offline
Professional Poster

Registered: 04/17/05
Posts: 2724
Loc: Massachusetts
Quote:

Have a nice life.



Take care.
It was nice owning...er I mean, knowing you.

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#171695 - 08/01/05 12:25 PM Re: Net responsibility [Re: MattJ]
glad2bhere Offline
Enthusiast

Registered: 08/11/00
Posts: 663
Loc: Lindenhurst, Illinois USA
I'm not in counseling position here-- not that you probably couldn't use it. At least the people I work with are willing to admit that they can improve, do something better and be marginally responsible. Can't imagine how nice it must be to sit back and cherry-pick the straightlines without giving anything back--- and have that be the sum total of anything you have to offer.
Not much to recommend you without your chorus of cheerleaders to mutually assure each other that your way is right and its everyone else that needs to change.

Nottaproblem. What goes around comes around and even a self-satisfied arrogance such as yours is not big enough to stop that. However, you have my sympathies.


Edited by glad2bhere (08/01/05 12:28 PM)

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#171696 - 08/01/05 12:46 PM Re: Net responsibility [Re: glad2bhere]
kickcatcher Offline
Member

Registered: 12/30/04
Posts: 200
Loc: UK
Quote:

Please help me. I want to buy weapons grade plutonium. Where can I get it? Thanks in advance,
Next school killer.



Well, www.notbloodylikely.org is a good bet. Ask in the sword forum, they'd love to help.
_________________________
Judokakakakaka!!!!!!!

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#171697 - 08/01/05 01:15 PM Re: Net responsibility [Re: kickcatcher]
Kintama Offline
Professional Poster

Registered: 04/17/05
Posts: 2724
Loc: Massachusetts
and then there was this one one month later, from the same fictitious person. It gets 84 replies with 56 links in the same sword arts forum:
Quote:

Topic: Looking for a good place...
Sorry, not really MA related but - anyone have a link with a detailed map of the San Andreas Fault lines?
Thanks for your help.




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#171698 - 08/01/05 01:22 PM Re: Net responsibility [Re: glad2bhere]
RazorFoot Offline
Professional Poster

Registered: 12/01/04
Posts: 2064
Loc: Seated at the computer, DUH
G2BH, I have not said anything until now because I am not one to perpetuate a bad situation. I feel that if you let it go long enough, it will burn itself out but I do not think this will. I try not to pass judgment on anyone but when they start to do it to others while ignoring their own flaws, then it becomes a problem.

Quote:

I'm not in counseling position here-- not that you probably couldn't use it. At least the people I work with are willing to admit that they can improve, do something better and be marginally responsible.



By whose standards and opinions? You seem to feel that if people do not agree with you, they are wrong.

Quote:

Not much to recommend you without your chorus of cheerleaders to mutually assure each other that your way is right and its everyone else that needs to change.




Only difference is you do not seem to need a chorus. You cheer yourself into believing that no one else's opinion matters but yours.

Quote:

Nottaproblem. What goes around comes around and even a self-satisfied arrogance such as yours is not big enough to stop that.


So are you our punishment?

Quote:

However, you have my sympathies.




We have been nothing but sympathetic towards you during all your rants, tyrades, and, as you have deemed it, "self-satisfied arrogance".

As Butterfly stated, you have a lot to offer but you taint it with your smug, arrogant, condescending attitude towards your fellow forum members. That gets old after a while.

I actually find a lot of your posts interesting and informative. I have learned several new things and have used them to better my knowledge of certain areas but I can not ignore your tone in some of your posts.


Edited by RazorFoot (08/01/05 01:58 PM)
_________________________
"The greatest way to live with honor in this world is to be what we pretend to be."

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#171699 - 08/01/05 03:42 PM Re: Net responsibility [Re: RazorFoot]
glad2bhere Offline
Enthusiast

Registered: 08/11/00
Posts: 663
Loc: Lindenhurst, Illinois USA
Dear Razorfoot:

There is no way I can give you sufficient perspective on this except to say that what is being pushed around here is a self-satisfied attitude that has gone on for a number of years. I don't know how long its gone on at the particular NET because honestly I have not been here that long but the hallmarks are unmistakeable.

To borrow your thought, yes I DO have a lot to give and there was a time when I would have waited (almost after the manner you described) until the toxic behaviors burned themselves out. The fact is, Razorfoot, that the toxic behaviors will NEVER burn themselves out and my sitting by quietly in my old age and not saying anything only makes it easier for people to continue old behaviors.

Nobody died and left me "Gawd", and this is not a solicitation for the job. What this is. is one person standing up and saying "stop--- you are making a mistake."

Now the responses are no different here as on any other Net.

1.) "Who dafuk are you?
2.) "What gives you the right to talk like that?"
3.) " I don't like your attitude"
4.) "You don't have the knowledge/experience/vitae/education rank/status/office/position etc etc etc to speak to us like that!"
5.) "Thats more of the same old-fashion B***S***".
6.) "You aren't gonna last long here."
7.) "Keep it up and you'll get banned."

And the list goes on.

The fact is that in the end what I say and the way I say it is no more toxic, outlandish, insulting, condescending are any other quality you want to insert.

What you have here are folks who want to see the world a particular way and take exception to anyone, for any reason they can mount, so as to not tolerate an alternate point of view. FWIW.

Best Wishes,

Bruce


Edited by glad2bhere (08/01/05 03:48 PM)

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#171700 - 08/01/05 03:49 PM Re: Net responsibility [Re: glad2bhere]
laf7773 Offline
Professional Poster

Registered: 05/05/04
Posts: 4064
Loc: Limbo
Quote:

Here are three posts that to me represent the attitude that makes distributing information possible.




I'm pretty sure the question i posted to you, a couple of times, was about moderator giving dangerous information not about their attitude about it. Here it is again in case you missed it.

Quote:

I would like you provide an instance where one of the moderators blatantly fed "dangerous" information to a new practitioner.




The problem is you are choosing to ignore the many times a thread was closed due to content and not because of behavior or in the case that the thread wasn't closed the members and moderators went to great lengths to encourage finding an instructor. There as even been members who have complained about the lack of information given and the response to seek legitimate instruction.

http://www.fightingarts.com/ubbthreads/showflat.php/Cat/0/Number/15759295/an/0/page/1#15759295

http://www.fightingarts.com/ubbthreads/showflat.php/Cat/0/Number/15758375/an/0/page/1#15758375

http://www.fightingarts.com/ubbthreads/showflat.php/Cat/0/Number/15758134/an/0/page/1#15758134

http://www.fightingarts.com/ubbthreads/showflat.php/Cat/0/Number/15768391/an/0/page/0#15768391

http://www.fightingarts.com/ubbthreads/showflat.php/Cat/0/Number/15761026/an/0/page/0#15761026

http://www.fightingarts.com/ubbthreads/showflat.php/Cat/0/Number/15757216/an/0/page/2#15757216

You can also take a look at the number of "self teaching" threads in the sword forum where others and myself have gone to great lengths to discourage dangerous acts such as practicing with stainless steel.

Quote:

OK? Now, look at my post in REALISTIC SWORD thread regarding the Kukri used by the Nepalese Gurhkas (Posted 7-30-05).




Quote:

The post in question:Still not sure why noone is talking about the Kukris that are used by the Nepalese Gurkhas. These are sound enough to take off a limb and formidible thrusting weapons. I understand that the Gurkhas themselves often train by smearing the handles with animal blood so that the in consistent sometimes sticky/sometimes slippery handling requires them to develop assured eye-hand coordination. There are a number of sources currently that are selling both the larger and the smaller weapon and they can be had for a pretty cheap price. Learning to throw them is actually rather simple given the odd shape. Since they are currently on the market as historical oddities I would go so far as to say that even a minor might be able to purchase one without too many questions asked. Of course you will probably need to GOOGLE for the source most convenient to people here. FWIW.

Best Wishes,

Bruce





So here are the dangerous points you made in that post.

Quote:

a,) An identified weapon of lethal intent.




You identified a kukri. Not exactly a secret weapon and no more dangerous than any other bladed weapon in any particular person hands.

Quote:

b.) A training modality




You suggested using blood on the handle to improve hand eye coordination. Is this any worse than telling someone to train alive in order to increase the effectiveness of their techniques?

Quote:

c.) A resource for securing the piece




Telling someone they can "google" something is hardly providing them with a resource.

Quote:

d.) Encouragement on how one might circumvent the usual restrictions.




This will also tie in with point C. Telling someone they might be able to get one if they are under aged isn't going to help them very much. Now on the other hand if you had given a specific web site that you KNOW would sell this weapon to a minor and told them so i would have removed it. In your own words..
Quote:

But I purposely injected a questionable post and you folks don't seem to mind.



So after all of your ranting about people safety, terrorist and providing new practitioners with dangerous information you put out information that YOU feel is dangerous to prove a point? What about all the little kiddies who may be reading? Where are your morals now? Killing a man is wrong but is killing a man in order to see if the cop watching you will act right? Get off you high horse.

Now let's take a look at the "quotes" you made of others and see how they compare.

Quote:

“……….Honestly, based on the parts of your post that I understand (not your fault) I don't really see a need to have an active censorship policy. I would venture to say that a large percentage of people here who actually have the knowledge of these things also have the ability to discern whether or not they should share this information. Many of the "deadly" moves posted on here are by kids who watch too much anime and have downloaded the anarchist's cookbook from Kazaa………..”

Joel




Since you seem to have misunderstood this statement i will try to clarify it for you even though i can't pretend to speak for Joel. What he is saying is there is little need for the moderators to censor posts for content because the majority of the members here do it them selves. On the occasions we do get members posting "deadly moves" they are generally dealt with or discouraged.

Quote:

“…….There is no clear and present danger that any kid will go and do soething that we have advised anymore than a kid will buy a tech9 and shoot up his school.
The net provides information about anything to anyone and however scary that is, I think it is the most important invention since the wheel, it wopuld be a shame to have to fly all the way to the US in order to exchange opinions about MAs. Kids learn those techniques in school anyway, it doesnt matter what we tell them.
Obviousy bad advice is bad advice, but that can come from us or it can come from a McDojo, or it can come from a strasnger on the street. All this political correctness and legality and should we do this, and is it right of us to disclose potentially lethal info on a public forum; it does my head in…….”




It's convenient you only post the portion you feel backs your position. What about the first paragraph in that post?
Quote:

This forum is not a website where kids ask adults questions and adults decide what to write and what not to write. Its a discussion forum where people with similar interests get together to discuss MAs. If we were all to fly to a specified location and talk about it would that make it better? Its the same thing, we are discussing and debating MAs not advising kids. If kids want to participate in the conversation then that should be fine by us. It is the parents' business whether they should be allowed to participate in the forums. If I tell you what is the best way to kill someone, then a gun is the best way to kill someone, doesnt mean you are going to go and do it. There are no legal ramifications for telling people about techniques or how to use a knife, or which is the best knife. We are talking about honing martial ability which cannot happen without training. So if I tell a kid that the throat is a sensitive area, that does not mean that they can go away and apply that to their friends.




Let's keep things in context shall we?

Quote:

“……And I dont think that it should be OUR responsibility to shield kids of this information. If someone is talking about killing someone, the thread would be deleted and stopped and the person banned (thats why we have moderators) but I dont think that information and bad advice is something that is a characteristic of this forum in particular, or something that can be avoided in society in general…….”

MAGr




Your little examples here do less to support your position than you would like to believe.

Quote:

I already know what you are going to write back. "Hey! One post!" (BTW: I could have used the "Throws designed for killing" thread (See: the later posts from Kito-ryu) but I am satisfied that I have made my point.)




Here is the post i believe you are talking about.
Quote:

I am sorry guys but i am with tomh777 on this one.. I train and have trained in Kito Ryu jiu jitsu for close to 8 years and throws with the intention to kill is what the traditional art was all about. Also tomh is spot on with the way throws have been changed to make it possible to use them in free practise and is 100% about how the slight change of an angle, a different grip etc have come into these throws to make them possible for free practise or Randori. I myself do not know many throws which are designed to kill, but my sensei knows alot and has shown myself and the higher ranks of our class some of these throws that really make you shiver.

my 2 cents..thanks jim




Where is this member giving any dangerous information? They have identified an art, kito ryu, that they say uses deadly throws . How is knowing this dangerous? I don't see any descriptions of how to do these throws.

Quote:

Know what, Lane? Stick it in your ear.




Someone getting their feelings hurt? I don't see how. Unlike you i've made no personal attacks. All i've done is hold YOU accountable for YOUR actions and behavior. Now how about you deal with the issues i've raised about your behavior? After all we are discussing your claims that we are intentionally providing new practitioners, and oh yes the terrorist, with "dangerous information". Unfortunately you have yet to solidly prove your point, which leaves it to nothing more than a misguided opinion.

I'm going to ask you again and i'm going to make it very plain and clear this time.

Quote:

hey, what's a wooden tanto used for? Like, what's the art called? what's it like?




How is this question deserving of the response you gave it? You use the excuse of providing possible terrorist with dangerous information but if that is truly what you believe then why respond at all? The simple fact is your actions were rude and uncalled for and you were looking for an out in order to explain your actions.
_________________________
Enjoy life while you can, you never know when things will change.

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#171701 - 08/01/05 04:13 PM Re: Net responsibility [Re: laf7773]
glad2bhere Offline
Enthusiast

Registered: 08/11/00
Posts: 663
Loc: Lindenhurst, Illinois USA
".....How is this question deserving of the response you gave it? You use the excuse of providing possible terrorist with dangerous information but if that is truly what you believe then why respond at all? The simple fact is your actions were rude and uncalled for and you were looking for an out in order to explain your actions....."


Oh ANOTHER simple question. What, you keep asking questions. I answer and then you turn to another question and I answer that one and I turn to another.This last was answered previosly. Get off yer lazy butt and look up my response.

And don't make like you aren't getting all defensive and spinning and taking things in a particular light as well. The fact is that you were challenged and you didn't like it. Started out nice enough but when I didn't except the usual pat answers things started getting rougher.

You keep characterizing me in a number of disparaging ways but you still have not said I was wrong--- only that you take exception to "how" I communicated. The fact that you have HAD to close threads tells me that you are aware of the problem. So the last 6 pages are nothing but damage control and PR work to make sure that

a.) I am a single voice of a malcontent

b.) There is no problem

c.) If there is a problem Lane is on top of it.

And I just don't believe any of that crap you are shoveling. Now you can keep going over the same lines time and again like one of these times suddenly I will realize that you were right all along. Ain't gonna happen.

BTW: For future reference. The correct response is

"thanks for the in-put. We have not looked into that in quite a while and probably need to check it out. Give me about a week to run through things and I want to get back to you.
Shall we keep this thread opn to see if other people have thioughts or do you want me to PM you?"


Edited by glad2bhere (08/01/05 04:17 PM)

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