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#165651 - 07/08/05 06:38 PM the right thing?
Crash Offline
Buckle up!

Registered: 08/17/04
Posts: 627
Loc: Ontario, Canada
When I read the post about what martial artists are obligated to do I was reminded of my actions during a particuler incident at my highschool at the begining of the first semester.

I was on my way to my next morning class when I saw a bunch of people crowded around two grade 9's who were just pounding the hell out of each other. The first thing I did was look through the crowd, I saw a guy who I know and moved over to him and said "Hey! shouldn't we do something!?"
he simply replied
"No way! they're throwing haymakers!" I don't want to get in the middle of that!".
this didn't makes sense to me at all, because the kids who were fighting were both about the same size I'd say 5'3" and 125lbs AT THE MOST! where as I'm 6 foot and weigh 200lbs and the guy I asked to help me was a football player and almost 7 feet tall! all we would have had to do was each grab them and then drag them to the office which was not far away. I also saw another big guy I know that could have helped but he was just laughing and cheering them on!(neither of these guys are my friends, just people I know from classes)
so I knew I was on my own on this one. everything happened so fast after that, people yelling mixed words of encouragement and discouragement at them, some lady was yelling "get the office!". I had to make up my mind right then and there but I froze up! I did absolutely nothing! After another minute a Gym teacher showed up and told them to get to the office and for some reason they did, but by this time they were both pretty badly beat up and both had blood comeing out of their noses. This all took place in about 2 minutes but it was all I thought about for the rest of the day.

That night I had karate and told one of my sensi's what happened. He said that some times it was best to just let them duke it out unless one of them continued to beat on the other guy when he was clearly beaten and helpless, or if 2 or more people gang up on 1 person etc.
this happened months ago, but, sometimes I still think about it and what I could have done or if I could have done anything at all.

What I'm asking is: what do you think I should have done? and have you had a similar experience?
_________________________
Even though you only have two arms you can still block with your forearms.

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#165652 - 07/09/05 02:47 AM Re: the right thing? [Re: Crash]
Salek Offline
Member

Registered: 06/09/04
Posts: 474
Loc: Minnesota
When the time is right, you will know... I think you did the right thing to stay wear you were, because think of this...

Some guy cheering on the fight sees you go to them and grab one of them... He thinks Hey! a brawl!! then he jumps in and starts throwing punches... More and more people join in until its a riot... I have seen this happen...

Your sensei is right
_________________________
He who does not punish evil commands it to be done.

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#165653 - 07/14/05 10:10 AM Re: the right thing? [Re: Salek]
thegnome Offline
Member

Registered: 05/20/05
Posts: 49
From a school officials standpoint you did the right thing. Everytime another person is added to an altercation it just turns out to be another person that gets into trouble. Had it been needed to save a person I would say different but this sounds like a question of mutual combatants. I've seen situations where a person claimed to be trying to stop the fight and the other person thought they were trying to help or then a fourth person gets involved. Let the adults do their job. As for why they went to the office, most people in fights listen to a command voice, usualy both parties want the altercation to end and are willing to go somewhere safe. It never fails to amaze me when I see two kids that were beating on eachother five minutes ago sitting quietly together in the office.

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#165654 - 07/14/05 04:15 PM Re: the right thing? [Re: Crash]
fattts14 Offline
Member

Registered: 07/07/05
Posts: 224
Loc: T.O. On, Can
Yeah unless unless the fight is overly one sided stay out. If you got involved and serious injury occured, (not neccessarily your fault) you could become liable...especially with martial arts training...it could be cosidered a waepon...in some areas
_________________________
Practice doesn't make perfect, practice makes permanent. Perfect practice makes perfect.

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#165655 - 07/15/05 07:52 AM Re: the right thing? [Re: Crash]
Acid Offline
Newbie

Registered: 07/14/05
Posts: 12
Loc: Australia
i have been in situations similar to yours.on a few seperate occassions i havnt acted when i probabily should have. i at the time shared the same opinion as everyone above. but with a little hindsight can see how i could have put an end to a situation before it progressed. for discussions sake, i pose a related question.

If you have the ability to defend and protect people (from themselves as well as others) dont you feel you have an obligation to help??? what is the point of having the resourses needed to do good if you dont use them???

obviously it comes down to the severity of the issue but when do the results excuse the actions?? do they excuse them at all??
_________________________
"The strongest way to block, is never to provoke a blow" "through form and speed comes power."

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#165656 - 07/17/05 02:14 PM Re: the right thing? [Re: Crash]
Intrepidinv1 Offline
Member

Registered: 04/20/05
Posts: 308
Loc: NC, USA
A few months ago I was in a large dance place. I observed a man yelling real loudly at another man. The man that was being yelled at walked toward the yeller and planted a quick, devastating punch which knocked both men to the floor. I instinctively jumped up and grabbed the one that had been punched and pulled him away from the other. Another group grabbed the other guy. I held my guy in an arm bar and waited for the bouncer to come over. As they try to sort it out I raised my hands up and pointed to the guy to let them know I wasn't involved. They took over from there and eventually made the guy I grabbed leave.

This seemed to happen instinctively to me and the other guys, we just did it. However, I've been a police officer and also did a little bouncing in the past to make a few bucks. In the past I have stood with bouncers when they escorted someone out as a form of back up. When I was a boouncer we knew that certain people would back us up even though we didn't ask for it.

I don't think it would have been wrong for you to help break this fight up if you could have done it without adding to the level of violence and without unfairly picking one out unless he was the aggressor. I think this kind of thing is a good use of the martial arts. However, you have to decide, is it worth it, under the circumstances of that particular event. If I was out in public and observed a large fight in a parking lot of a convenience store what would I do? Call the police and sit back and watch from a safe distance. You have to make the call when it happens, it's not going to be the same solution every time.

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#165657 - 07/18/05 12:51 PM Re: the right thing? [Re: Crash]
japangirl Offline
Newbie

Registered: 07/18/05
Posts: 16
Loc: Baltimore, Md. USA
Never jump in during a fight. Something going to be decided and settled. If you jump in your only going to push them further. Let them fight. Alot of times Roger gets into a fight, then after they become friends. Sometimes pateints. All honor and pride aside, people need to fight. War is a instinct, back during the crusades people didn't think twice. Only jump in if you have a friend getting his ass handed to him.
_________________________
Some are so afraid to die They never truly live

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#165658 - 07/18/05 01:03 PM Re: the right thing? [Re: japangirl]
Christie Offline
Enthusiast

Registered: 07/12/05
Posts: 872
Loc: Waterloo, ON
I agree with whats already been said. Although all the good people in the world feel the compelling need to jump in and help when there is someone in need we can't always do that. In this situation both were mutually fighting. It wasn't one person being picked on by another or one person being picked on by more then one person. It was one on one and had you tried to stop it both may have turned on you. Sometimes its best to just leave things well enough alone, you did the right thing.

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#165659 - 07/22/05 08:31 PM Re: the right thing? [Re: Christie]
Crash Offline
Buckle up!

Registered: 08/17/04
Posts: 627
Loc: Ontario, Canada
Thanks Christie! thats exactly how I feel!
_________________________
Even though you only have two arms you can still block with your forearms.

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