some of these Zen guys teach rough...slapping with sandals, getting beatup in the kitchen fetching soup (or as some would write, 'soap'), and now forced bobbing for apprentices. lol
I don't know about this Zen stuff...maybe I'll just stick to full-contact kumite.
ok, on topic:
We don't fully appreciate the things in life until they are taken away.
"Of all the things I've lost, I miss my mind the most."