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#153626 - 06/29/05 10:36 AM Re: Funny video on Dillman student. [Re: laf7773]
Kosh Offline
Member

Registered: 03/04/05
Posts: 302
Loc: Novo mesto, Slovenia
Laf why should he find a new instructor, if he teaches something YOU don`t believe is possible? I don`t mean to be offensive or anything but if you don`t believe it or haven`t experienced it to be true, it does`t mean it
doesn`t exist or isn`t possible.

I don`t doubt there are many who don`t know what they`re talking about, but there are still those that know.
_________________________
Peter ...Understanding is a three-edged sword...

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#153627 - 06/29/05 11:14 AM Re: Funny video on Dillman student. [Re: Kosh]
Kempoman Offline
Veteran

Registered: 11/15/00
Posts: 1484
Loc: Houston, TX
If I may...


Quote:

Laf why should he find a new instructor, if he teaches something YOU don`t believe is possible? I don`t mean to be offensive or anything but if you don`t believe it or haven`t experienced it to be true, it does`t mean it
doesn`t exist or isn`t possible.




There is absolutely no evidence to support the 'projection' of qi, ki, chi or whatever you want to call it over a distance. None, nada, nunca. Every single time it has been tested using the scientific method and in a controlled environment the magical powers of the person seem to dissappear. They magically re-appear when they are back in class with the same people who have fallen prey to their illusion. This is why I provided the test case for you to try Kosh. I want you to do the test and see for yourself.

There is a $1,000,000.00 US prize waiting for anyone who can do this in a controlled environment. Guess what, noone has even come close to passing the prelimnary test. Rich Mooney (who by the way is a fantastic martial artist) practiced and proclaimed to have the power of ling kong jing (powerful empty force). He went around the country and the world and knocked over entire rows of individuals by simply pointing and them with his 'power'. This power was demonstrated in many different ways including

...attackers running at Rich with knives and being flung to the ground with a wave of his arms before getting anywhere close to him

...making people fall while seperated by a door
...making people fall while seperated by a curtain
...and many more great and wonderful things were shown

he was supported by DKI, DSI, KI and anyone who was interested in gaining this magical power.

Surely the greatest exponent of this ability to project chi over a distance would be able to perform a simple test of simply making a few people move with no barrier between them.

When tested much in the same manner in which I have suggested to you for the NTKO's there was absolutely NO EFFECT SHOWN.

Please see An Empty Force


People are gullable. As P.T. Barnum is rumored to have said, "There's a sucker born every minute" or something to that effect.

I'll give you an even simpler test. Go grab someone off of the street and instruct them to walk up to any of these grand poobahs of the magical chi blast and pour a glass of water on their heads. Instruct the chi maker to use their chi to knock the attacker out or down.

I leave the rest to you imagination.

Quote:

I don`t doubt there are many who don`t know what they`re talking about, but there are still those that know.




You are correct there are many who don't know that they are deluding themselves and others and then there are some who know exactly what they are doing.

--KM


Edited by Kempoman (06/29/05 11:17 AM)
_________________________
Yeah, if you want to get dry-humped and dookie-licked.

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#153628 - 06/29/05 11:25 AM Re: Funny video on Dillman student. [Re: Kempoman]
Kosh Offline
Member

Registered: 03/04/05
Posts: 302
Loc: Novo mesto, Slovenia
Lol
I`m sorry, I believe in qi projection and I`m not gullable or a sucker (well, alright, sometimes I am, but aren`t we all?). I understand what you`re saying though.
_________________________
Peter ...Understanding is a three-edged sword...

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#153629 - 06/29/05 11:43 AM Re: Funny video on Dillman student. [Re: Kosh]
JoelM Offline
Professional Poster

Registered: 07/26/04
Posts: 6355
Loc: Georgia, USA
Quote:

Lol
I`m sorry, I believe in qi projection and I`m not gullable or a sucker (well, alright, sometimes I am, but aren`t we all?). I understand what you`re saying though.




  • gullable?-no
  • sucker?-no
    the only thing left is:
  • misinformed?-inform yourself
    or:
  • gullable?-rethink
  • sucker?-rethink
  • _________________________
    We should all take ourselves seriously...and then crumple that image up and toss it out the window.

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    #153630 - 06/29/05 11:48 AM Re: Funny video on Dillman student. [Re: JoelM]
    Kempoman Offline
    Veteran

    Registered: 11/15/00
    Posts: 1484
    Loc: Houston, TX
    Quote:

    Lol
    I`m sorry, I believe in qi projection and I`m not gullable or a sucker (well, alright, sometimes I am, but aren`t we all?). I understand what you`re saying though.




    I think that there is a tendancy to want to believe in things that are greater than ourselves (hence the need for a god) or that humankind is greater than we appear to be (hence the need for telepathy, chi projection, magical healing etc). I think that this is natural, some though require evidence before succombing to these beliefs. These people are known as skeptics.

    I am a skeptic, I need proof to believe. That is not to say that I do not wish to believe, because I do. Just as I no longer can believe in the tooth fairy or santa claus due to the lack of evidence for their existance, I must acknowledge the same lack of evidence to support the existance of 'chi projection over a distance'. Pigs may indeed be able to fly but they have yet to show evidence to that effect.


    --KM
    _________________________
    Yeah, if you want to get dry-humped and dookie-licked.

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    #153631 - 06/29/05 12:47 PM Re: Funny video on Dillman student. [Re: Kosh]
    laf7773 Offline
    Professional Poster

    Registered: 05/05/04
    Posts: 4064
    Loc: Limbo
    To put it simply, everything he just described as teachings by his instructor scream fraud. If his instructor truly believes in what he is teaching then he may very well be the victim of a fraud himself. Nonetheless NTKOs and projecting chi over a distance is not real. You can choose to believe in it all you want but no matter how much you believe it's not going to make it true. No many how many times you stomp your feet and scream "i've seen it done", until you have seen it done in a CONTROLED environment as Scott has suggested it is not real.

    I invite anyone who believes in this sort of thing to do some REAL research into the subject and stop looking only to those with the same beliefs for their information. Not all of these guys are liars and frauds; some have been duped just like the rest of their students.
    _________________________
    Enjoy life while you can, you never know when things will change.

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    #153632 - 06/29/05 07:54 PM Re: Funny video on Dillman student. [Re: laf7773]
    GSD Offline
    Newbie

    Registered: 06/22/05
    Posts: 14
    Sir,
    You really have no need to know the name of my Sensei. I will tell you that he was a key figure in DKI. He left DKI because of the politics involved in all MA.
    As far as projecting energy goes, I'm sorry but I think it is you that should rethink things and find a new instructor.
    My Sensei s' touchless ko s' were from several inches away. It wasn't from 3 feet away ,and he didn't have us run at him while he struck a very impressive stance. He is a very honest man that never held us back from entering other styles of study. A matter of fact he encouraged us to seek out other styles and instructors. It was his belief that this would only serve to make us better Martial Artists. Sounds quite similar to Funakoshi s thinking, huh? You do know Funakoshi , right?
    Now, let me ask you a question. Have you been able to break 5 pcs of 2" thick concrete with a palm strike that only travels 4 to 5"? Okay, how about breaking an uncracked coconut with a palm strike that travels only 12"? Here's a little test for you to try if you so desire. Set a stack of cinder blocks up so you can place 3 pcs. of 2" thick concrete on top of each other. No spacers please. Now, do a palm strike on them. Breaking the stack is not the goal. The goal is to break only the one on the bottom.
    I have done each one of these things repeatedly for many people.
    Now , I do feel the need to say I am sorry if I appear rude. After all, being polite is one of the best self-defense techniques there is. It does upset me when I come across people with closed minds. Not to overuse an old saying but, "The mind is like a parachute , it only works when it is open".
    I know the men of DKI, DSI and other newer offsprings. I find some of the things they are demonstrating a bit hard to digest also. So we agree on that.
    I say to you believe what you want , it's your right, but don't tell someone they should rethink things and find a new instructor. When you say things like that it makes you sound like you only read the fighting part of the book and ignored the part on proper behavior.
    Here is something I'd like to share with you. "He who conquers himself is the greatest warrior" (Samurai Maxim). After your statement that I should find a new instructor I'd say that you need some work on manners,son.
    GSD.

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    #153633 - 06/29/05 08:04 PM Re: Funny video on Dillman student. [Re: Kempoman]
    GSD Offline
    Newbie

    Registered: 06/22/05
    Posts: 14
    Sir,
    You were the Rep. for DKI in Texas?

    GSD.

    Top
    #153634 - 06/29/05 08:22 PM Re: Funny video on Dillman student. [Re: Kosh]
    GSD Offline
    Newbie

    Registered: 06/22/05
    Posts: 14
    You will go far in the studies of the Arts because of your open mind.I don't know your rank or the rank of Mr. Laf and it doesn't really matter. Rank means very little to me.
    I've rubbed shoulders with some of the most famous Martial Atists in the world . You wouldn't believe how many of them are really just the south end of a north bound horse.
    If you have an interest in energy transfer (not nec. touchless ko s') check out Rick Clark , Erle Montigue , James Lacy and Montak Chia .
    Oh yes , thanks for the supporting words.
    GSD.

    Top
    #153635 - 06/29/05 08:28 PM Re: Funny video on Dillman student. [Re: GSD]
    BaguaMonk Offline
    Member

    Registered: 12/18/04
    Posts: 404
    Loc: DALLAS TX BABY
    Wow, I never expected this thread to grow some big, I haven't read all so I might be editing this post soon without my own inputs.

    If your talking about the middle-forhead knockout point, that is a common dim mak/accupressure point, and it is what Televangelists use to trick people into "the power of god" knocking them out.

    You can tell wether a person practices internal arts, or the study of chi gong, by the way they move. In forms, punches, heck even kicks. Dim Mak was usually used in conjunction with Fa Jing. I really don't think most of these people who claim to be able to do such things have the sufficient internal training, nor even physical training to make them effective in a real situation. There are some of the more obvious ones around the head area, which can be used by almost anyone. But for the most part, its partly power of suggestion, and also alot of gimmicks. There are sorts of tricks, that have to do with body mechanics, physics, etc. that many have used for ages to show off, but nowdays its actually used to make people sign up for classes.

    In the more external gong fu styles, ALOT of physical conditioning was required, and back then when practice was heavy, the vital areas (head, groin, neck) were the most heavily protected of them all. So being able to use your tools/weapons (hands, fingers, fist, etc.) to penetrate into small openings that were exposed was a pretty valuble skill. The physical training was difficult, with streneous physical activities, and hard chi gong excercises to strengthen the muscles/bones/ligaments. For example they would use their fingers like an iron rod, or the pheonix eye, and correct angle of direction.


    Edited by BaguaMonk (06/29/05 08:41 PM)
    _________________________
    Truth comes from the absolute stillness of the mind...

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