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#153616 - 06/22/05 05:28 AM Re: Funny video on Dillman student. [Re: Kempoman]
Kosh Offline
Member

Registered: 03/04/05
Posts: 302
Loc: Novo mesto, Slovenia
Hi Kempoman!

Sorry for not replying so long, but I`ve been really busy with school.
I like the experiment, but I`ll have to talk with my sensei about doing it. I doubt we`ll be doing such an experiment anytime soon, one reason being that a lot of people will go on vacation about this time of year.

It might be hard to get people who haven`t heard about qi (most of the people I know, know at least something about it). Another thing is that most people don`t really like the idea of being KOed, with a touch or no touch. I don`t know why .

Otherwise I really like the experiment, and I`ll definitely do it in the future. When I do it I`ll post the results. Thank you for the suggestion.

There`s one thing I don`t quite understand though. Why the use of index cards? Why not just test everyone with the three ways?
_________________________
Peter ...Understanding is a three-edged sword...

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#153617 - 06/22/05 09:54 AM Re: Funny video on Dillman student. [Re: Kosh]
Kempoman Offline
Veteran

Registered: 11/15/00
Posts: 1484
Loc: Houston, TX
Good Day Kosh,

Sounds great.

The index cards are so that the order can be random (perhaps drawing them out of the hat), so that the order of the test are changed up (less room to cheat). Like I said, try and control as many variables as possible.

Thanks again,
Scott
_________________________
Yeah, if you want to get dry-humped and dookie-licked.

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#153618 - 06/23/05 07:48 PM Re: Funny video on Dillman student. [Re: Kempoman]
Kosh Offline
Member

Registered: 03/04/05
Posts: 302
Loc: Novo mesto, Slovenia
I`m not sure that I understand you. Doesn`t that mean that all three tests wouldn`t be made on everybody, but just one test per person?
_________________________
Peter ...Understanding is a three-edged sword...

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#153619 - 06/24/05 09:39 AM Re: Funny video on Dillman student. [Re: Kosh]
Kempoman Offline
Veteran

Registered: 11/15/00
Posts: 1484
Loc: Houston, TX
Quote:

I`m not sure that I understand you. Doesn`t that mean that all three tests wouldn`t be made on everybody, but just one test per person?




I am sorry for not being clear. Each of the three tests would be done on each individual but in a random order.

Each time a card is removed from the hat it is not replaced until the next subject is ready to be tested and all three cards are ultimately drawn for each subject.


For example:

Subject #1:
Draw 1 from hat yields: Hands Up No chi projection

Draw 2 from hat yields: Hands down

Draw 3 from hat yields: Hands Up with chi projection

Subject 2:
Draw 1 from hat yields: Hands Up with chi projection

Draw 2 from hat yields: Hands Up no chi projection

Draw 3 from hat yields: Hands down

and so on and so forth


--KM
_________________________
Yeah, if you want to get dry-humped and dookie-licked.

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#153620 - 06/24/05 04:52 PM Re: Funny video on Dillman student. [Re: BaguaMonk]
GSD Offline
Newbie

Registered: 06/22/05
Posts: 14
I am new to this game here so excuse me if I step on toes. I am a Ryukyu-Kempo , Kyusho Jitsu instructor. Although my Sensei was a Rep. for DKI I offer no loyalty to the org. My Sensei retired from DKI and from teaching in 1998. I in turn, with his permission, re-opened his school in 1999. Sensei was one of the first in DKI (if not the first) to execute a touchless ko. He had many years of study in The Healing Tao.I think this played a major role with his success. If I understood it right , one was not attacking pressure points . It was the microcosmic orbit of the person that was under attack. There are basics to everything. Without dumb luck you can't do a pressure point ko without knowing a little about them. In the same turn you can't do a touchless without knowing a thing or two about the microcosmic orbit.
I have done ko 's and I have helped people learn to do them. I no longer do this. I teach theory. I believe no demonstration or seminar is worth taking a chance with someones health or life. One has to remember kyusho/dim mak was designed to kill. In order to further ones understanding of life and death some risks must be taken. But extreme caution should be exercised.
It makes me smile when I hear or read that someone doesn't believe soft touch or touchless ko s' are real. To me it just means there is one less person walking around with a loaded gun.
The Dillman seminars with their ko feeding frenzies towards the end of the seminars were always fun. But after giving it some serious thought I found myself asking the question "Are we doing this because we should or just because we can"?
Also , all Dillman did was bring kyusho to our attention. He planted a seed and it grew into a tree. He got people thinking. Heck, Dillman probably learned more from all of us then we learned from him.

Stranger.

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#153621 - 06/24/05 08:13 PM Re: Funny video on Dillman student. [Re: GSD]
Gavin Offline
Professional Poster

Registered: 05/11/05
Posts: 2267
Loc: Southend, Essex, UK
GSD, I don't question that something does happen during the NTKO's, but I do seriously question what exactly is happening. I think Kempoman has already put quite a few possiable theories. As I've said before in this thread I know too little about the energetic and internal side to come up with a strong arguement for or against the NKTO, but my gutt instinct just says "Nah!". Obviously the first time I'm put out by a practical one, I'll be buying the book and DVD at the same time as grovelling to become a live in student of the person that put me out!

Your comment about those ney-sayers of touchless KO's, being one less person with a loaded gun, would suggest that you believe that the NTKO have a valid combative use. Is that the case? The stuff that I've read so far, seems to point that they are nothing more than an interesting trick, just wondering what your take on this is?

Hope that didn't come across as disrepectful, its just an interested inquiry!
_________________________
Gavin King
www.SHIKON.COM
Follow me on twitter @taichigav

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#153622 - 06/25/05 01:33 AM Re: Funny video on Dillman student. [Re: Gavin]
laf7773 Offline
Professional Poster

Registered: 05/05/04
Posts: 4064
Loc: Limbo
As i've said before, i've met people claiming to be able to do NTKOs and they had several students who had fallen to them but when they attempted the same techniques on me they failed every time. I have every bit of faith in what Kempoman has said in regards to the NTKO. When i met him he was the DKI rep for Texas. I've been his punching bag on several occasions and have felt the effects of pressure points first hand.

I do agree somewhat with GSD. Anyone walking around thinking they truly CAN perform a NTKO is walking around with a "loaded gun". Unfortunately the gun is pointed at them.
_________________________
Enjoy life while you can, you never know when things will change.

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#153623 - 06/25/05 02:26 AM Re: Funny video on Dillman student. [Re: laf7773]
Gavin Offline
Professional Poster

Registered: 05/11/05
Posts: 2267
Loc: Southend, Essex, UK
Quote:

I do agree somewhat with GSD. Anyone walking around thinking they truly CAN perform a NTKO is walking around with a "loaded gun". Unfortunately the gun is pointed at them.




LOL, I do like a good giggle first thing in the morning! And laf7773 that has most definately made me giggle!
_________________________
Gavin King
www.SHIKON.COM
Follow me on twitter @taichigav

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#153624 - 06/28/05 11:01 PM Re: Funny video on Dillman student. [Re: Gavin]
GSD Offline
Newbie

Registered: 06/22/05
Posts: 14
Gavin,
I do not believe touchless or soft touch ko s' are practical on the street. But if one was able to project energy to the point of knocking someone out without touching them imagine what the effect would be if contact was made.
As I stated before , my Sensei is a student of the Healing Tao. He has been for many years and I do believe one would have to be in order to have any chance with a touchless.
It wasn't done at every class but we did do alot of work with Chi-energy. Everything from chi-ball exercises to rooting.We were taught to attack or counter attack with a flowing type motion. Palm strikes weren't just solid strikes they were "springy palm" techniques from the "iron palm" system. Flowing movements , not straight on stiff strikes transfer "Chi".
Even my punches were changed so there was somewhat of snap to the wrist.
Internal Arts play a big role in the Arts. I don't know what style or styles you study but if you're not adding the soft side to your training you're missing out on an incredible part of MA. Besides, sometimes the soft side hurts worse.
Hey, don't get me wrong, I've seen some stuff on DVD by people I KNOW and at one time or another respected that made me shake my head. Somethings are better left unsaid and hidden.
Me myself , I've never claimed to be able to do anything unless I could back it up 100%. This way if someone put $1000 on the table , I'd be the one picking it up not the one looking like a fool.
I've seen some things that made me wonder if I was watching an instructional video or Bennie Hinn "healing" someone!
GSD.

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#153625 - 06/29/05 01:20 AM Re: Funny video on Dillman student. [Re: GSD]
laf7773 Offline
Professional Poster

Registered: 05/05/04
Posts: 4064
Loc: Limbo
GSD what is your instructors name?

The deal is no one is able to project energy the way you are describing. You may want to rethink things and find another instructor. None of the teachings you described from your instructor lead me to believe he has any idea he knows what he is talking about.
_________________________
Enjoy life while you can, you never know when things will change.

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