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#152897 - 06/06/05 04:06 PM Re: TKD poll [Re: Kintama]
SkInHoUnD Offline

Registered: 04/13/05
Posts: 310
Loc: Canada
I dont think theres any more bogus TKD schools than there are in any other MA. Ive seen many bogus Karate schools, Jujutsu schools, hell, even ninjutsu schools.If your spending months in a MA and your not getting good at your art then mayby its you.An idiot master could train a prodigy easily, and a grand master who taught his whole life could teach the worst practitioner of an art ever.I think the problem is most people get in the habit of judging every college,school,dojo, etc in comparison to theyre own.Some schools may have more focus in different areas and prices may vary...but i think your gona have a hard time not learning an art if your dedicated no matter what unless of course your training litterly consists of watching kung fu movies and eating cheeseburgers.

#152898 - 06/06/05 05:35 PM Re: TKD poll [Re: SkInHoUnD]
Ryushosen Offline

Registered: 06/02/05
Posts: 13
Heh, yea tkd in my area is about 75% mcdojo to actual ma. My dojang focuses on self defense aspects of the techniques. We practice the practical kicks, none of this acrobatic 720 kicks. We do participate in tourneys bout our view is ma and defense first and then tourney. Personally i think that forms are worthless but thats just me.

#152899 - 06/06/05 08:41 PM Re: TKD poll [Re: TraditionalTKD]
eyrie Offline
Professional Poster

Registered: 12/28/04
Posts: 3106
Loc: QLD, Australia
I stand corrected. It was indeed Tae Guek that I did, but I think it existed BEFORE Palgue was introduced. Mind you, this was 25+ years ago and my memory is somewhat faulty at this point (u know, old age and everything).

#152900 - 06/07/05 12:56 AM Re: TKD poll [Re: eyrie]
skeeterzirra Offline

Registered: 02/07/05
Posts: 77
Loc: Cedar Rapids, IA, USA
I was learning palgue forms before there was a wtf. I believe that taeguk was made by and for wtf. Any oldsters learn taeguk before 73?

#152901 - 06/07/05 02:40 AM Re: TKD poll [Re: eyrie]
TraditionalTKD Offline

Registered: 05/16/05
Posts: 68
Loc: Jackson, MI
The Palgue forms were introduced before the Taegeuk forms. The Palgue forms were developed by the KTA to standardize the forms that everyone practiced. Previously, several different forms sets were used by by the different Kwans. The Taegeuk forms came later in an attempt to make the forms more "Korean".

#152902 - 06/07/05 02:59 AM Re: TKD poll [Re: TraditionalTKD]
SANCHIN31 Offline
Former Moderator

Registered: 12/26/04
Posts: 3783
Loc: Arkansas, U.S.
To everyone. How many TKD schools are in your area? How many are mcdojo's?
Skinny,Bald,and Handsome! Fightingarts Warrior of the year

#152903 - 06/07/05 05:06 AM Re: TKD poll [Re: SANCHIN31]
Bushi_no_ki Offline

Registered: 05/03/05
Posts: 1669
Loc: POM, Monterey CA
If you want to define area as being anything I can drive to within four hours, there's at least a dozen. Any of the ones I had contact with have shown no real signs of mcdojoism, except maybe the teachers wearing an expensive uniform.

The only one I could say for sure was a mcdojo closed down within a few years of it opening, it just couldn't compete in the atmosphere up here.

#152904 - 06/07/05 08:51 AM Re: TKD poll [Re: eyrie]
Gemini Offline

Registered: 11/28/04
Posts: 333
Loc: NY, USA

I did TKD (ooooh, 'bout 25 years ago). Good basics in block, punch, kick. But that's all there is to it.

*stares at the screen, speechless*
Because this statement encompasses all there is to TKD, I thought I'd ask you long you practiced the art to be able to make such a summation? Maybe save myself years of toil.


Most modern TKD schools are geared toward sport competition and tournament "fighting" (I use that word VERY loosely). .

Again, what source was this information based on? Is there a world wide TKD enlistement book somewhere?
You make some amazing revelations. Or is this maybe just your opinion?
Sparring isn't fighting. Isn't intended to be. Please tell me this isn't still news to some people.

Through competitions, I've had the ability to get a good look at many schools and meet the Owners/Sabumnims/Instructors/Students of them. In my area, competition is encouraged, but the main focus is still SD TKD.

I've noticed a growing correlation between McDojang's and Competition sparring. "These schools focus on sparring so they suck!". I'm getting real tired of hearing that. The reason sparring is encouraged is because, though it is NOT street fighting, it does teach things you need to know about yourself on both the mat and the street.
*Focus (empty mind)
*Distance (effective range)
The better someone understands these thigs, the better prepared they will be regardless of the venue.
True there are differences, but everyone always seems to focus on them and not the similarities. "He has a great flying spin kick but I bet he'd get mopped up on the street". I think I could safely say that most people who practice anything to this degree could probably figure out the difference. Why is it always assumed because you are capable of one thing, that you aren't of another? It's such an amazing generalization that I hear over and over, yet never a single example of anyone who ever did it.

I believe you hear the word McDojang in TKD more because it's stands to reason since it's the most practiced MA in the world, it would recive to most critism. (It sucks so bad, everyone wants to do it). Yea, that makes sense. But other than people stating their opinion as fact on here, I don't know that the ratio of good schools to bad ones is any higher than any other MA. In other words, I have no idea.

I think the word McDojang is used to generally. (Just my opinion). To me, it's a school that puts the $ above the need to teach students MA's. I've know of a McDojang chain that produces very good practitioners becaue the Sabumnims are top quality, but the owner only cares about the money. So is it really a McDojang? There are flags for potential McDojangs but they don't always mean they are.
*Young BB's. I've seen some very good ones.
*Web Sites. While you may be able to get a feel, you can't usually get enough real information to make a determination.
*BB's in 1 to 2 years on a regular basis. Real flag raiser to me.
*After school programs. So what? If there's a need, and it gets people training that otherwise could not, what's wrong with it.
*Fancy uniforms. Means nothing.

Palgwe was replaced by Taeguk. Both are WTF.


#152905 - 06/07/05 12:06 PM Re: TKD poll [Re: Gemini]
Supremor Offline
Professional Poster

Registered: 07/22/04
Posts: 2510
Loc: UK
Well I do ITF, great fun, hard work and certainly not a mcDojo. Tae Kwon Do is bound to have many more McDojos I think, because it is the most popular martial art in the west, or at least it has the most practitioners. I think alot of instructors just use the name Tae kwon do in order to give people some idea of what they teach.

My advice is to evaluate Dojos on their affiliation with national organisations and on how old their instructor is. I hope this causes no offense, but I don't believe a person with under 12 years of experience is good enough to teach others as though they were an expert. I mean, it take 4 odd years to get a black belt, and another 2-3 years for a 2nd Dan.

Ofcourse this is just my very subjective opinion. I have only a limited experience of Dojos, having stayed in the same area since I started. I am also English, and no little of what America is like for dojos.

#152906 - 06/07/05 12:18 PM Re: TKD poll [Re: Gemini]
Kintama Offline
Professional Poster

Registered: 04/17/05
Posts: 2724
Loc: Massachusetts
Gemini, are you trying to convince us or yourself? It is what it is, and people do what they do ...and all those zen-like justification phrases. lol kidding. seriously though, you can't explain away the fact that I can go to any random town in the US and within a 10 mile radius have a 1 in 4 chance of locating a TKD school that puts form over money and function over form.

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