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22738 Members
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35473 Topics
431968 Posts
Max Online: 307 @ 02/21/13 09:36 AM
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#144778 - 05/19/05 10:00 PM
Re: Grappling methods in Karate
[Re: Petjut84]
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Professional Poster
Registered: 09/03/03
Posts: 2142
Loc: Phoenix, Arizona USA
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Quote:
here's some grappling
http://www.pecahan.com/mmdemo.WMV
Some very compliant grappling. Fortunately most techniques look good with no resistance.
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#144779 - 05/19/05 10:44 PM
Re: Grappling methods in Karate
[Re: medulanet]
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Professional Poster
Registered: 04/17/05
Posts: 2724
Loc: Massachusetts
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Looks almost too pretty to be practical doesn't it. I like the dramatic poses after he's finished...very vogue.
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#144780 - 05/19/05 11:46 PM
Re: Grappling methods in Karate
[Re: Kintama]
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Member
Registered: 05/10/05
Posts: 102
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yeah, the poses are just kinda the traditional thing. Actually this guy's instructor doesnt have too much experience but trust me, this stuff can be done. The style (Harimau) is exclusively designed around maneuvering on the ground. And sure it is pretty slow in the demo. In real life it is very very fast. There are phillipino guys in my group that could maneuver around your legs and take you down before you do a jab cross.
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#144781 - 05/20/05 12:42 AM
Re: Grappling methods in Karate
[Re: Petjut84]
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Former Moderator
Registered: 12/26/04
Posts: 3783
Loc: Arkansas, U.S.
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Quote:
yeah, the poses are just kinda the traditional thing. Actually this guy's instructor doesnt have too much experience but trust me, this stuff can be done. The style (Harimau) is exclusively designed around maneuvering on the ground. And sure it is pretty slow in the demo. In real life it is very very fast. There are phillipino guys in my group that could maneuver around your legs and take you down before you do a jab cross.
Really! Can we see that on video?
_________________________
Skinny,Bald,and Handsome!
Fightingarts Warrior of the year
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#144782 - 05/20/05 03:29 AM
Re: Grappling methods in Karate
[Re: SANCHIN31]
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Member
Registered: 05/10/05
Posts: 102
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Maybe. I will see if I can get some of the other guys in my group to do a technique or two. If not I will get one of my roomates to get a video clip of me doing one. You might check out the video "secrets of harimau" for more realistic stuff or look into Herman Suwanda's videotapes. He is dead but some people still sell some of his videos around, I just bought one on ebay. There are not really any good video clips I would say of silat on the internet at all because first of all it is pretty rare and second the old generation of practitioners either dont like showing their stuff or are dying out. The newer silat is getting into more of the sporting aspects unfortunately. My instructor is really against videotaping though at all because he used to let people do it early on and they take techniques and put out videos and say they are part of their system. Some Bjj guys picked up the "cobra lock" from one of his seminars in the 60's and claimed it as theirs, after that I think he just decided he didnt want people to capitalize off his art. sorry, I forgot even who I was writing back to. It is kinda late and IM pretty tired. Here is one link to the website of the system I do and another is a massive picture gallery that has some interesting things. Note the weapons on the second to last page. My instructor has seen a man get his side totally slit open and killed with that weapon in the bottom right corner. You can get away with all kinds of stuff still in indonesia as there is no suing anyone and its not illegal to walk around with knives and swords. There are still cannibals there too so that is pretty intense.
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#144783 - 05/20/05 03:45 AM
Re: Grappling methods in Karate
[Re: Petjut84]
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Member
Registered: 12/23/04
Posts: 274
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What exactly is a "cobra lock" and how was it "stolen"?
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#144784 - 05/20/05 12:29 PM
Re: Grappling methods in Karate
[Re: Hedgehogey]
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Member
Registered: 05/10/05
Posts: 102
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man, i am kinda angry cause i just accidently erase this. Oh well. I looked on the internet and wanted to find a picture of a cobra lock so you can visually see what it is. ALL I got was talking about it. Basically it is when you go to the ground and are on a side mount on the guy. You slap the guys arm closest to your side towards his other arm and you loop your hand under his neck and grab the arm you just slapped. You wrap his own arm around his neck choking him and then you slip in your other fist and grind it into the cartoid artery. It is a pretty painful choke. They have it listed on this learn how to fight quick websites as one of his techniques but he calls it a cobra choke. http://www.safetytechnology.com/guardsubmissions.htmIt was "stolen" when "Oom" Jim had an early seminar at a grappling school in the 60's or so. That was one of the techniques that he learned in Indonesia and he was already knowledge about grappling techniques in America. Pretty soon like a month or two later he started seeing magazine articles and pictures with the same choke in there that he had never seen any grappling schools do up till this point. That is why he generally doesnt like people to videotape his stuff. Many people make money off of silat if you just look in paladin press the people who claim they do silat either barely learned any and claim they are a teacher or they have no real lineage and its not silat. But........there is some silat guys on a different newsgroup and they are sending me a seminar from the late 80's of my instructor. His school wasnt supposed to videotape but they apparently did anyways and he still has the footage so if I get it soon I will try to post a clip of him doing a cobra lock. ALso, you usually dont just grab his arm and try to put it behind his neck. You usually start from a standing position and soften him up with 3 or 4 strikes and then take him down and transition from there.
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#144785 - 05/20/05 01:43 PM
Re: Grappling methods in Karate
[Re: Hedgehogey]
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Free Rhinoplasty!
Prolific
Registered: 11/25/04
Posts: 15629
Loc: York PA. USA
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Hedge -
Petjut describes the same "cobra lock/choke" that I learned in my JKD grappling class. I can't do it very well, but my instructor can.
_________________________
"In case you ever wondered what it's like to be knocked out, it's like waking up from a nightmare only to discover it wasn't a dream." -Forrest Griffin
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#144786 - 05/20/05 01:55 PM
Re: Grappling methods in Karate
[Re: Petjut84]
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Banned
Registered: 03/11/03
Posts: 642
Loc: Sa, Tx. USA
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Quote:
I wasnt being sarcastic. I got stuff to put you in a pretzel too. Ive got some harimau and other ground fighting systems of silat that I do where you can have both legs tied up while cranking their chin towards you or elbowing them in the back of the head. There is a position from a front takedown where the guy has his leg up in the air and you step around his hip and have it locked while you lean towards his face and punch away. ALso, ways to tie yourself up with your own shirt and walk away where you will not be able to get out unless someone helps you.
I don't doubt you. Silat has some pretty unconventional grappling and groundfighting in it. I saw some examples of it in the Philippines. I don't know of any specific sites which detail Okinawan grappling, but it most certainly does exist too. There is an article in the magazine section which details some of Hohan Soken's grappling. Look for the interview with Soken O'Sensei done by Ernest Estrada. He talks about how old style Okinawan karate is replete with grappling and pressure point attacks. It's a good read.
Peace.
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#144787 - 05/20/05 04:32 PM
Re: Grappling methods in Karate
[Re: Multiversed]
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Member
Registered: 05/10/05
Posts: 102
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yeah, actually I think i remember reading about Hohan grappling too. I just heard a mention of it, but yes i think you are right. I would be interested to look that up for fun.
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