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#141997 - 05/10/05 02:28 PM New Sword Fighting Style
zanshi Offline
Newbie

Registered: 05/10/05
Posts: 21
Me and a training partner of mine are in the process of developing a new sword fighting style and we are having trouble naming the system. Does anyone know if there is a basis for naming styles, or how it has been done in the past? Any sugestions?

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#141998 - 05/10/05 02:30 PM Re: New Sword Fighting Style [Re: zanshi]
Charles Mahan Offline
Professional Poster

Registered: 06/14/04
Posts: 2502
Loc: Denton, Tx, USA
Quote:

Me and a training partner of mine are in the process of developing a new sword fighting style




Why? And since it's your creation, you can pretty much call it anything you want. How bout Zinglebarrium Ryu? Or if you want something which sounds more Japanese, perhaps Uraniwa Ryu?


Edited by Charles Mahan (05/10/05 02:36 PM)
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Iaido - Breaking down bad habits, and building new ones.

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#141999 - 05/10/05 02:40 PM Re: New Sword Fighting Style [Re: Charles Mahan]
zanshi Offline
Newbie

Registered: 05/10/05
Posts: 21
technically we created the art by accident; we were free-form sparring w/ bokken and I used a technique that she had never seen before. She asked me if I could do it again, and when I thought about it, we realized that there was not any current styles (that we are aware of) in which the practitioners used a sword in the manner I had executed the technique. So we sat down and we started with all of the eight direction cuts and modified them to work with the way I had been fighting in practice. We currently have 8 cuts and two thrust, with one complete form, and we're working on more forms.

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#142000 - 05/10/05 03:17 PM Re: New Sword Fighting Style [Re: zanshi]
Walter Wong Offline
Member

Registered: 12/09/04
Posts: 275
Loc: Boston, Massachusetts, United ...
If you've never recieved years of legitimate instruction under a qualified sensei, you're only play around no matter how serious you think you are swinging your sticks around.
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#142001 - 05/10/05 04:18 PM Re: New Sword Fighting Style [Re: Walter Wong]
zanshi Offline
Newbie

Registered: 05/10/05
Posts: 21
I am 8 1/2 years into my training, and we have been practicing swordfighting since year 2. As far as a "qualified sensei", I think I'll just stick to my books and my own experiences. I have no desire to learn how someone else does fight, I want to know how I can fight. I don't benefit in any way from someone saying "watch me and do what I do" and presenting me with a fancy belt when he decides I'm a good enough mindless robot to go on to the next level.

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#142002 - 05/10/05 04:45 PM Re: New Sword Fighting Style [Re: zanshi]
Charles Mahan Offline
Professional Poster

Registered: 06/14/04
Posts: 2502
Loc: Denton, Tx, USA
Yep. Sounds like Uraniwa Ryu is a good name for what you're doing.

Search the forum for "Self teaching". There is a wealth of opinions on what you are doing. You should probably read up on what countless folks have said on the subject. You will probably find that you're made up style will get very little respect from anyone. Good luck.
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Iaido - Breaking down bad habits, and building new ones.

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#142003 - 05/10/05 04:52 PM Re: New Sword Fighting Style [Re: zanshi]
Gunyo Kogusoku Offline
Member

Registered: 12/07/04
Posts: 38
Loc: London, England
Niseimono-ryu sounds about right
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Steve

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#142004 - 05/10/05 05:21 PM Re: New Sword Fighting Style [Re: Gunyo Kogusoku]
Charles Mahan Offline
Professional Poster

Registered: 06/14/04
Posts: 2502
Loc: Denton, Tx, USA
Well... Except that it isn't the second generation of anything. It's completely made up. Based on nothing except this guy's imagination by his own account.

He said it was accidental, so how about Guuhatsuteki Ryu? Guess that would make our original poster Zanshi-kaiso of Guuhatsuteki Ryu. Which I suppose translates to "Tragic Death founder of Accidental style."


Edited by Charles Mahan (05/10/05 05:27 PM)
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Iaido - Breaking down bad habits, and building new ones.

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#142005 - 05/10/05 06:57 PM Re: New Sword Fighting Style [Re: zanshi]
Ambrosius Offline
Newbie

Registered: 05/09/05
Posts: 15
Dude, its very cool that you are trying things out for yourself, however learning something like sword-fighting for yourself is a monumental task. Your new style could be very very good, it could in fact be revolutionary. Also, however, it could also be crap.

How about you describe this new move to us?
Don't worry, most people will be very discouraging and make fun of you, however a few people might provide useful commentary.
I still suggest you find some place that does teach some sword style and learn from them. Learning from someone with a lot of experience can help you correct your mistakes. (Trust me, we all make mistakes, even those who have been doing it for ages.)

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#142006 - 05/10/05 08:25 PM Re: New Sword Fighting Style [Re: Ambrosius]
zanshi Offline
Newbie

Registered: 05/10/05
Posts: 21
"How about you describe this new move to us?"

Thanks for being open minded, i appreciate it.
The most distinguishing feature of the style is the gripping of the blade with the dominant hand. The handle of the sword is gripped with the weak hand while the dominant hand is used to guide and support the blade for cutting, blocking, and thrusts.
The gripping consists of placing the hand along the blade, pinching the blade between the thumb and index finger, the hand being curled into a fist behind the blade, in order to maintain a more presice control of the blade movements.

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#142007 - 05/10/05 10:55 PM Re: New Sword Fighting Style [Re: zanshi]
Charles Mahan Offline
Professional Poster

Registered: 06/14/04
Posts: 2502
Loc: Denton, Tx, USA
To take this seriously for a moment. That's gonna create range issues you know. You're gonna have to get REALLY close in order to reach your opponent. Not to mention the extreme danger of having your fingers that close to not only your own blade, but to your opponents blade when you have to parry. Your forward hand is also an easy target to attack. I don't have to attack your hand. I just have to attack your sword in such a way that I end up sliding down the blade towards your hand. Do this enough with even wooden swords and your gonna break your fingers pretty badly sooner or later.

All that copying of sensei stuff you seem to loathe is the manner in which centuries of collected knowledge is passed down from one generation to the next. Knowledge created and passed down from people who trusted their lives to what they had been taught, gone off to battle, and returned to pass on what they had learned. The people who created goofy styles in the past, went off to battle, and didn't come back. So their goofy ideas died with them. That's the fundamental problem faced by those who would create their own styles today. The crucible by which these things could be tested no longer exists, and their is no suitable substitute.

Oh and BTW, before you respond that your forward hand is not in danger because you would be blocking edge to edge... There are two things wrong with this idea. First and foremost, a hard block, meaning a block intended to physically stop an opponents attack by meeting it force for force rather than deflecting the attack in some way, is a very bad idea with Japanese swords, and probably not a good idea with most. Hard blocks run a very real risk of breaking the sword, or at the least damaging it severely. They are done in most styles, but only as a last ditch, so this is it I'm going to die, sort of way. The general method of avoiding an incoming strike revolves around evasion and deflection of the incoming strike. Deflection is basically not possible, or is at the very least very difficult to pull off, when you block with the edge. The reason for that is the second fundamental problem with blocking edge to edge.

The second problem with edge to edge blocks is that the edges of Japanese swords are VERY sharp. Plenty sharp enough to cut into each other. One or, in all liklihood both, of the swords in question will notch at the point of contact. Anytime the edge is notched there is a chance for a full break as there is possible for a crack to form at the point of notching which can then propogate towards the mune. Notching is highly likely in this scenario and this is another reason why the type of edge to edge blocks that I suspect you would be using with the grip you mention is such a bad idea.



Edited by Charles Mahan (05/10/05 11:04 PM)
_________________________
Iaido - Breaking down bad habits, and building new ones.

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#142008 - 05/10/05 11:17 PM Re: New Sword Fighting Style [Re: zanshi]
nekogami13 V2.0 Offline
Professional Poster

Registered: 04/10/04
Posts: 2643
Loc: Texas, USA
Nice way to lose some fingers.

What's japanese for finger less school?
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I'm sorry, I was just imaging what you would look like with duct tape over your mouth

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#142009 - 05/10/05 11:31 PM Re: New Sword Fighting Style [Re: nekogami13 V2.0]
Charles Mahan Offline
Professional Poster

Registered: 06/14/04
Posts: 2502
Loc: Denton, Tx, USA
How about Muyubi Ryu? Or perhaps Yubigai Ryu? Gotta admit, I'm not to sure about this one.


Edited by Charles Mahan (05/10/05 11:33 PM)
_________________________
Iaido - Breaking down bad habits, and building new ones.

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#142010 - 05/11/05 01:09 AM Re: New Sword Fighting Style [Re: Ambrosius]
Gunyo Kogusoku Offline
Member

Registered: 12/07/04
Posts: 38
Loc: London, England

Charles,

Nisemono means fake or false in Japanese.
_________________________
Steve

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#142011 - 05/11/05 01:22 AM Re: New Sword Fighting Style [Re: zanshi]
laf7773 Offline
Professional Poster

Registered: 05/05/04
Posts: 4064
Loc: Limbo
Although this topic is not about anime it also is not about any actual sword art. If you want to have a discussion about an actual sword art you are more than welcome. What we will NOT go into again is another discussion about why you can't develop your own art from thin air or teaching yourself a sword art.
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Enjoy life while you can, you never know when things will change.

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