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#132123 - 12/21/02 12:27 AM Real World Feedback
joesixpack Offline
Professional Poster

Registered: 02/04/02
Posts: 2282
Loc: Australia
In Chris Caile's opinion piece, he points out that like any endeavour, MA's require feedback to monitor progress or desired results.

Karate, is said to be taught using two man drills. Which are very effective. What is also said, is that partners are not expected to interfere. This is a mistake. Athough people can take the liberty to far, and be annoying or counter productive, it is better to let those training not only bend the rules andchallenge the ability of their partner to apply a technique - for example, the speed or timing of a punch, or the ability of a armbar to restrain an assailant. This is essential feedback and this more laissez faire approach to practice encourages people to innovate for themselves and to make their technique in less controlled environments.

If ettiquete doesn't help foster self preservation, it should be thrown away. Low level contact sparring has it's place, but full contact is indispensable in terms of distancing and building up toughness. Unusual attacks, retaliations and counter attacks should also be taught. Streetfights are unlikey to begin with a beautifully executed side kcik or reverse buch. Self defense should be taught so that you can keep pace, but once you have got the basics right, make it so it would work in an encounter, against a paticularly aggressive or stronger aggressor.

But, short of joining police forces, or engaging in streetfighting routinely, how else can we get feedback controls on our current performance?

#132124 - 12/21/02 12:29 PM Re: Real World Feedback
senseilou Offline
Professional Poster

Registered: 10/14/02
Posts: 2082
Loc: Glendale, Az.
I totally agree with this point of view. I do think that one needs to learn the basic of the technique before people start to resist. When caveman roamed and I studied Aikido, senior students wouldn't give you a chance for the technique before they reversed this. They wouldn't do it to a senior student but to all the young kyu's. It was great for them, but very frustrating for us not to be able to learn the technique first, before the resisting and reverses. But within that same art, on the higher level, they 'give' you the technique which doesn't help anyone either. Beginner students need to get the feel of what they do before people quit giving the technique and resisting.
As far as testing your technique, we can't hurt people that we train with, so you really can't apply 100% what we do at 100% speed. We try to simulate as much as possible, and I know that it is simulation, and get as close as we can to the real thing. The only thing I have come up with, is not to tell the attacker what the defender is going to do. I know it is not true fighting, but I tell the defenders, off to a side, what I want them to accomplish, then have the attackers go, usually to the surprise of the defender, I let them attack anyway they want. So I may tell the defender to take a wrist lock, and the person kicks, it just keeps everyone on their toes, and they have to ad lib. I feel there is 'learning the technique' in which we cooperate and feedback to our defender, and 'using the techniques' in which there is no feedback and no knowledge of what one another is doing. I KNOW this is not fighting for real, but it is still learning about how to fight. The only other idea is to suit someone up in those 'space suits' and let them beat the hell out of spaceman. But even at that, the attacker can't do much in return. One concept that I try to use is that Uke(attacker) is learning as well. I have all my attackers look for holes in what their partners do, and look for reverses. When they work with higer rank, I let them reverse, or counter, the rule being when someone gets what he wants accomplished, give in so no one gets hurt. "Good uke's make geat nage's". Other than getting into fights, this is as close as we get.


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