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#132032 - 12/04/02 06:27 PM Ninjutsu
DarkNinja Offline
Stranger

Registered: 12/03/02
Posts: 4
I have been interested in Ninjutsu for a long time now. After timeless searching I called this one school that said they can teach the Ninjutsu fighting style which is some kind of karate (kempo or something)
He said it's exactly the same as the Ninjutsu fighting style and the only reason it's not called Ninjutsu is because Ninjutsu classes teach tree climbing, stealth, shuriken, etc.
Does anyone know if this is true or not?

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#132033 - 12/05/02 04:40 AM Re: Ninjutsu
Cato Offline
Veteran

Registered: 10/13/02
Posts: 1636
For what its worth I think it more likely that ninja trained in ju jutsu rather than karate. Ninpo ju jutsu claims to be an authentic ninja art, although I don't know of any evidence to support the claim.

But really, does it matter? You're never going to be a ninja, nobody really knows what they trained in and it probably varied fron clan to clan anyway. Just enjoy what you train in.

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#132034 - 03/06/03 08:28 PM Re: Ninjutsu
Chen Zen Offline
Professional Poster

Registered: 02/09/03
Posts: 7043
Loc: Ms
For one Cato how can you say "you are never gonna be this or that"? Never squander someones ability to learn and their desire to reach their dreams. Second off Ninja's use jujutsu since when? You are a damned fool if thats what you think. Normally I have a hard time saying that but oddly enough not to you. Ninja's didnt wrestle. Its too noisy. Ninja are stealth. Ninja uses pressure points/ Ki points and devastating strike to quickly subdue there opposition. I doubt there was ever a ninja assassination by wrestling the guy to death. You should not speak on things of which you obviously do not know. You probably think ninja walked around in black suits and masks too.

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#132035 - 03/07/03 06:21 PM Re: Ninjutsu
Jamoni Offline
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Registered: 01/17/03
Posts: 1514
Loc: St. Louis, MO, USA
Chen Zen, you have officially pissed me off.
You call Cato a damn fool, when he is expressing a KNOWLEDGEABLE OPINION. As stated in his post, no one knows what the ninja's used, because they didn't talk about it. Duh. BUT, wrestling is BY NATURE quieter than unarmed striking. Which is louder, the sound of someone being choked out, or the sound of them getting punched in the face? THINK. Study some commando silent kill techniques, and you will find most of them involve closing from behind, choking, and stabbing into the neck. Sounds more like grappling than striking.
If I wanted to take someone out stealthily, I would not attack him with ki/pressure points, and devastating strikes. I'd sneak up and snap his neck or choke him out. Do you think YOU could silently beat someone to death before they had a chance to yell? Do you know ANYONE who could?
Try to be a little more civil, please.

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#132036 - 03/07/03 07:00 PM Re: Ninjutsu
Chen Zen Offline
Professional Poster

Registered: 02/09/03
Posts: 7043
Loc: Ms
Jamoni, Please you mean to tell me a strike to the base of someones brain stem is quiter than wrestling them and having them struggle back? Please. Do you know anything about pressure points? It takes about a second in a half to knock someone unconscious using the proper technique.When a ninja was sent on a mission to assassinate someone how could he quitley wrestle them in there home without breaking things shaking the floor or what have you? That is why ninja do not wrestle. Wrestle someone with a choke and wait the whole thirty seconds to a minute till they pass out or punch them in the throat? Punch in the throat and they will not yell. Nor will they breathe. As far as commando techniques what is the one that takes them out? The STRIKE to the neck so thank you for making my point for me. As for beating someone to death silently absolutely. Do you know anything about chi energy. If you disrupt the energy then the energy stops. When the energy stopps then so does the being. That simple. As far as being civil goes piss off because my remark had more to do with the way he addressed Darkninja then what he has to say about ninja. Not to mention the fact that he has been quite rude to me before. And personally every post I have read from you meant dick. You have as much martial art knowledge as a van damme movie. Dont try to approach me with your bullshit cuz if I wanted it I would have addressed the post to you. Chen Zen

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#132037 - 03/08/03 08:03 PM Re: Ninjutsu
Jamoni Offline
Veteran

Registered: 01/17/03
Posts: 1514
Loc: St. Louis, MO, USA
Chen ZEN (Where's the zen?) I give up. Your manly and powerful internet posting has rendered me impotent with fear and shame.
People are rude to you because you are rude.
I don't know "dick"? How very high school of you. I will make sure to never approach you with my "bullshit". It is obvious that your ninja stealth moves are totally realistic, and that a person just drops dead instantly when you punch them in the throat. But I'm just a soldier, so what would I know about violence? I'm just an EMT, so what would I know about anatomy and trauma? I am prepared for your well thought out and rational response.

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#132038 - 03/08/03 08:22 PM Re: Ninjutsu
Chen Zen Offline
Professional Poster

Registered: 02/09/03
Posts: 7043
Loc: Ms
First off Jamoni I'm not rude to people unless provoked. When they are rude to me or others then hell yes I am rude.For two I am not saying that a person will drop dead from a throat punch but it definately is quiter than wrestling them to the ground and easier to dispatch them in this way. As far as being a soldier well let me say hello to you from One soldier to another so I imagine I know as much about military combat as you do. As far as being a emt goes what does that matter? The question at hand isn't about anatomy,(which I have an above average understanding of) but about stealth. Also this is the second thread in which you have made my point for me. Since it was unintentional for you to do so I deemed your response bullshit. You see Jamoni the problem is this. Rather than take note as to why I said what I said to Cato you instead look only at the words. That is the problem. You look at the words but not in the context they are given. You look at the words but not the message. And then to say I piss you off with a comment that 1) wasn't directed to you 2)Without proper interpretation then you have been rude to me and that makes you wrong. The tao say to learn from your mistakes so learn from this one and learn to read more carefully into the messages before you decide to assault someone. I haven't had nor do I have a problem with anyone in this forum or in my life. So perhaps the problem does not reside in me but in you. Chen Zen

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#132039 - 03/08/03 08:43 PM Re: Ninjutsu
Jamoni Offline
Veteran

Registered: 01/17/03
Posts: 1514
Loc: St. Louis, MO, USA
You can't call someone a damn fool and then defend that as a reasonable action. Sure, Cato can handle himself (he's probably laughing his ass off at this thread), but I wanted to call you out. I don't have a problem with YOU. The problem is with your action. You could have made your point in a non-insulting way. Also, you could have left a little latitude for discussion. As for my criterion as an EMT, I have seen people die. From car accidents, from knife wounds, from drug overdoses, etc. NONE of them went quietly. The unarmed instant kill is a myth. If you punch someone in the throat, They will be able to breathe quite well until the swelling closes the trachea. After that, they still have all of the oxygen in their lungs, and all of the oxygen in their blood to use up before they die. They will jump around and make a lot of noise. As for the base of the skull blow, sure, fine, that might work. But I've also seen a sixteen year old kid take a monkey wrench to that spot, and beat the hell out of the guy who hit him.
All of this is incidental however, because any ninja (supposing they DID exist), would have used BOTH grappling AND striking only IF he didn't have a BLADE. Duh. I can't believe I am arguing with you over how ninjas killed people. I feel twelve years old.
And, SOLDIER, you can deem my reponse bullshit all you want. Time and truth will tell.

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#132040 - 03/09/03 12:34 AM Re: Ninjutsu
Chen Zen Offline
Professional Poster

Registered: 02/09/03
Posts: 7043
Loc: Ms
Jamoni, Look sure I could have approached the situation in a nicer manner but here is the problem. First he was rude to the asker of the question and he has had rude remarks towards me before as well as I stated earlier. Had he not then yes I would have taken a different approach. As for the thraot topic. I assume they would breathe but would this be the case if the throat box were crushed by the impact? I dont think so. As for me calling your resposes bullshit, I apologize for that but let me explain to you why I deemed it so. This topic came up the other day with Cato only regarding samurai instead of ninja. My argument with Cato is not that samurai or ninja did not grapple my argument is that neither of the two were based solely on this. A ninja or a Samurai were not jujutsu artist. For one I dont believe jujutsu was around then and two how could you say that when their are the sword techniques and the stand up striking. You walked into a conversation that had transfered from another thread so you didnt have the full story. Do I feel bad for addressing Cato? Absolutely not because the fact is he was extremely rude to the kid. You dont try to just stomp on someones dream and personally it disgusted me. Now then lets try to get this civil again and on to the topic at hand. Also I apologize to Dark Ninja as none of us have paid attention to his question. My next post will. Until then lets get to the learning and forget all this. Chen Zen

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#132041 - 03/09/03 12:49 AM Re: Ninjutsu
Chen Zen Offline
Professional Poster

Registered: 02/09/03
Posts: 7043
Loc: Ms
Dark Ninja, I studied with a man in Cincinatti who had some experience with Ninjutsu. The striking techniques seem to be a mixture of Eagle Claw (with tissue tearing and locking grasping techniques) With praying mantis or Snake style Kung Fu.(Due to the quick pressure point and soft tissue attacks) It may have even been Dim Mak but I dont know how authentic Dim Mak is. Undoubtedly they also studied some sort of ground fighting but I am not so quick to call this Jujutsu. They also obviously used a sword when they could but I am not sure what style it was based. I can find out but it may take a while as I have not been in contact with him for some time. Also an authentic Ninjutsu school will teach you stealth and things of that nature.If you really want good Ninjutsu training look for Masaaki Hatsumi (changed the name from Ninpo Taijutsu to Budo Taijutsu) but all he changed was the name not the style. If he has returned to Japan (im not sure) then look for Jack Hoban who Hatsumi taught and personally recommends. Hope this helps. And people thaught I knew nothing of NINJA [IMG]http://www.fightingarts.com/forums/ubb/smile.gif[/IMG]

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#132042 - 03/09/03 03:35 AM Re: Ninjutsu
Scholar Offline
Member

Registered: 03/05/03
Posts: 472
Loc: Brockton
Research includes; Various type of stepping techniques for moving quietly and on various terrain. Also methods of hiding thus invisibility. The use of mudras where energy work appears more involved in holding the breath than other methods. Check out the books by Ashida Kim. Also note tactics using flash in campfire, string to deliver poison. Note also escape by training to be double jointed ect. Referance to elements/postures

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#132043 - 03/09/03 09:59 AM Re: Ninjutsu
Cato Offline
Veteran

Registered: 10/13/02
Posts: 1636
Chen, You obviously have a problem with me.
Forget it and move on. Life's too short and I really don't care enough to engage in some petty feud with you. You have an opinion of me, and I of you. I'm willing to bet that neither is complimentary - get over it.


[This message has been edited by Cato (edited 03-09-2003).]

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#132044 - 03/09/03 10:38 AM Re: Ninjutsu
Cato Offline
Veteran

Registered: 10/13/02
Posts: 1636
Chen, You have raised my curiosity. You say that ju jutsu wasn't contemporary with Samurai, so perhaps you could tell me the history of the art? When did it come into being, and why?

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#132045 - 03/09/03 11:44 AM Re: Ninjutsu
Chen Zen Offline
Professional Poster

Registered: 02/09/03
Posts: 7043
Loc: Ms
Cato I have no problem with you I have a problem with how you adressed DarkNinja. Thats all. You did not have to say to him that he would never be a ninja and so on. To me that was very rude. But enough of that. As for history which art? Your question was rather vague.

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#132046 - 03/10/03 10:11 AM Re: Ninjutsu
Cato Offline
Veteran

Registered: 10/13/02
Posts: 1636
Ju jutsu.

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#132047 - 03/10/03 11:57 AM Re: Ninjutsu
senseilou Offline
Professional Poster

Registered: 10/14/02
Posts: 2082
Loc: Glendale, Az.
Children, children, now lets be nice or I'll send you all to time out, Geez, just when I thought I could quit being Sensei!!!
Now, anyone ever heard of a silent kill? The Navy S.E.A.L.s use this all the time, and has 2 variations. One you come up from behind(NInja style)someone, your hand goes to their mouth so they can not yell, and you slit their throat with the other hand. Adapting this, you can cover their mouth, and snap their neck OR cover their mouth and choke them out, and no one hears anything. They have used this for years.We use a combination choke and smothering technique ourselves. So did the Ninja, so you can choke someone out without making noise. Ninja used stealth, period. It doesn't matter what you call what they did. My buddy Cato is right though, its basic Jujutsu. If you go to the essence of what they did, they trained in Jujutsu arts. Chen you may have an offskew idea of early on Jujutsu. Jujutsu was radically changed in Japan after 1860 something. The old school Jujutsu was much different than you see today. Even Danzan Ryu Jujutsu is so very different than the old Jujutsu, you can't make the comparison.
Ever heard of a Yawara? Do you know that original Jujutsu was called Yawara. Yawara is a Jujutsu weapon that the Ninja employed, it looks like a roll of quarters, made of metal(though I am not sure what type they used back then) and both ends are pointed. This was used to hit pressure points and joints, and assist in their locking. Chen by your own addmission Ninja used pressure points, have you ever tried to use them on a fighting person, or a person with 'recessed' points. They can be hard to find, and time consuming, something the Ninja didn't have alot of. Ninja's had many functions, from just spying to silent killers. Do you know they were the first to 'sight' a rifle in Japan. They used a string and a plumb to sight the rifle, so they had other functions as well
I think one can be blinded by bad information, remember not all Martial artists are Historians. There are several good books on this, one is Secrets of the Samurai by Oscar Ratti. This is a historical journey and one will see that Jujutsu was around very early on. Chen I think someone may have given you some bad information as the Jujutsu arts were used by Samurai and Ninja and the Karate you speak of is atemi waza which was not codified in any nature in Japan, but in China, then to Okinawa. Karate as we know it, in curriculum form DID NOT EXIST in feudal Japan. That is not to say they didn't strike, but if you do some research, Samurai were noblity, and to leave a 'mark' on a Samurai meant you lost you head. As for the Ninja, they used what was necessary especially the escape arts, both for stealth, and to get out of locks. some of the best reverses for joint locks I got came from Ninjutsu. Why would they practice escaping from locks, if no body was doing them?

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#132048 - 03/10/03 12:07 PM Re: Ninjutsu
senseilou Offline
Professional Poster

Registered: 10/14/02
Posts: 2082
Loc: Glendale, Az.
P.S........Jujutsu is not wrestling, there is much more, a hip throw may resemble wrestling, but what about finger, wrist and elbow locks, standing up, not wrestling.
P.S.S.............Having kids in Ninja getup running around doing hand flips and such and sneaking into a room is not Ninjitsu. Ninjitsu has been "amercanized' here and in now way reflects the original art. Most schools now 'play' at being a Ninja. I have seen some of Hatsumi students and they are playing Ninja and are not in touch with their roots

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#132049 - 03/10/03 01:01 PM Re: Ninjutsu
raccoon Offline
Enthusiast

Registered: 02/09/03
Posts: 848
Loc: Victoria BC Canada
is Cato one of those "children" at risk of time-out? [IMG]http://www.fightingarts.com/forums/ubb/biggrin.gif[/IMG]

I don't know about anyone else, I am suffering severe stomach ache from laughing too hard while reading this thread. Time for some "laugh muscle" conditionings...

-raccoon

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#132050 - 03/10/03 01:22 PM Re: Ninjutsu
raccoon Offline
Enthusiast

Registered: 02/09/03
Posts: 848
Loc: Victoria BC Canada
[QUOTE]Originally posted by Chen Zen:
Jamoni, Look sure I could have approached the situation in a nicer manner but here is the problem. First he was rude to the asker of the question and he has had rude remarks towards me before as well as I stated earlier. Had he not then yes I would have taken a different approach. [/QUOTE]

Chen, didn't you said to me something about "love your enemies like your friends"? What I see here is "an eye for an eye, a tooth for a tooth"

I think most of us come here to see different views on same topics; why don't we do each other a favor, focus more on the topic discussed and less on criticizing the author? From your previous posts I see someone who means well, who likes to make the World a better place; who like to promote respects among people, whether they earned it or not. Why don't you show us how it's done by actions instead of by theory? That way you can practice to be a better Christian and we can enjoy sharing different views without the finger pointings. Sensei Lou also gets to take a break from being Wraphy sensei [IMG]http://www.fightingarts.com/forums/ubb/biggrin.gif[/IMG]

-raccoon

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#132051 - 03/10/03 04:02 PM Re: Ninjutsu
Cato Offline
Veteran

Registered: 10/13/02
Posts: 1636
Before I get given a "time out" I'd just like to say... Tell him, not me. HE started it. You always pick on me. It's not fair. I hate you. [IMG]http://www.fightingarts.com/forums/ubb/tongue.gif[/IMG]

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#132052 - 03/10/03 05:23 PM Re: Ninjutsu
raccoon Offline
Enthusiast

Registered: 02/09/03
Posts: 848
Loc: Victoria BC Canada
Very nice pout Cato [IMG]http://www.fightingarts.com/forums/ubb/biggrin.gif[/IMG]

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#132053 - 03/10/03 11:11 PM Re: Ninjutsu
senseilou Offline
Professional Poster

Registered: 10/14/02
Posts: 2082
Loc: Glendale, Az.
That's it Cato-5 minutes in Time out if I can quit laughing............Hilarious reply!!!!!!!!!!

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#132054 - 03/11/03 12:49 AM Re: Ninjutsu
Chen Zen Offline
Professional Poster

Registered: 02/09/03
Posts: 7043
Loc: Ms
Raccoon, Thank you for setting me back to my path to mastery. I apologize for the way I put things but I wont apologize for saying something as I feel something needed said. Now I leave it at that. I do respect everyone hear and I value each and every opinion no matter how askew I believe it to be. As for my information on Hatsumi and Jack Hoban. Hoban is said to be the official american representative of ninjutsu. The information I got about hatsumi mostly came from Black belt magazine. However they do talk of many topics such as killing a horse silently. I cant imagine this done grappling. I never said ninja didnt grapple but I dont believe this to be their primary source of attack. However I may be missinformed and this is something I should research.

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#132055 - 03/11/03 01:32 AM Re: Ninjutsu
raccoon Offline
Enthusiast

Registered: 02/09/03
Posts: 848
Loc: Victoria BC Canada
Any time Chen =)

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#132056 - 03/13/03 07:17 AM Re: Ninjutsu
Cato Offline
Veteran

Registered: 10/13/02
Posts: 1636
Chen, I'm still interested in hearing your view on both the Samurai and ju jutsu during Japan's feudal period. I don't want to carry on being a "damn fool" any longer.

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#132057 - 03/13/03 07:21 AM Re: Ninjutsu
raccoon Offline
Enthusiast

Registered: 02/09/03
Posts: 848
Loc: Victoria BC Canada
Thats all good, Cato, but have you done your 5 minutes of time out yet?

[IMG]http://www.fightingarts.com/forums/ubb/biggrin.gif[/IMG] [IMG]http://www.fightingarts.com/forums/ubb/biggrin.gif[/IMG] [IMG]http://www.fightingarts.com/forums/ubb/biggrin.gif[/IMG]

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#132058 - 03/13/03 04:24 PM Re: Ninjutsu
Cato Offline
Veteran

Registered: 10/13/02
Posts: 1636
I'm sorry. I think I'm heading for another 5 aren't I? I just feel a bit like I've been unjustly attacked and well, frankly I want to get my own back. Childish I know, but bloody good fun all the same. [IMG]http://www.fightingarts.com/forums/ubb/biggrin.gif[/IMG] [IMG]http://www.fightingarts.com/forums/ubb/biggrin.gif[/IMG]

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#132059 - 03/13/03 04:40 PM Re: Ninjutsu
Jamoni Offline
Veteran

Registered: 01/17/03
Posts: 1514
Loc: St. Louis, MO, USA
Chen zen, perhaps Cato WASN'T blasting Darkninjas future hopes and dreams. By saying "you'll never be a ninja", perhaps he simply meant "You'll never be a Japanese spy/assassin who kills silently hundreds of years ago." This is true. It's like saying "You will never be the inventor of the helicopter."

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#132060 - 03/13/03 08:51 PM Re: Ninjutsu
senseilou Offline
Professional Poster

Registered: 10/14/02
Posts: 2082
Loc: Glendale, Az.
Even though I am the one to put Cato in 'time out' and magnify his temper tandrem, I have to agree with him Chen. I will tell you why.....I don't think he was coming down on anyone, but I think(and its what I think Cato is saying)what he is saying is that too many people 'Pretend" to be what they are not. People play at being Ninja, wear the gear of a Ninja(which is out of date)and practice playing Ninja, they are not doing it for real. The day of the Ninja is gone as it was then, just as the day of the Samurai is gone. No one is a true Samurai any more, Society won't allow it, they stopped allowing it in Japan in the late 1890's so how could it be in todays society outside Japan. Too many times we see people who 'think' they are Japanesse, they dress like it, run like them, say a few Japanesse words and they think they are. They are playing at it, truth is we are a product of our country learning the culture of another. Just because we learn another culture doesn't make us that culture.Look at any Aikido dojo and you will see this in action.
The Late Great Grandmaster Mitose of Kosho Ryu Kempo, who came from a Japaneese Temple made this analysis of an American Kempo Sensei. The Sensei gave Grandmaster Mitose a business card and on the card was his logo, a Tiger. Mitose asked the Sensei why, and the Sensei said the tiger represented him and his dojo. Rev. Miotse answered, which is more ridiculus an animal being an animal, or a man pretedning to be one? You see my point, that Sensei was no more a tiger, than anyone today is a Ninja, they are just practicing Ninjitsu, but they will never be a NInja.

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#132061 - 03/13/03 10:00 PM Re: Ninjutsu
Jamoni Offline
Veteran

Registered: 01/17/03
Posts: 1514
Loc: St. Louis, MO, USA
As long as Senseilou is disciplining us children, could you make chen zen apologize for the van damme comment? I can take anything else that was said, but that was sheer libel, and cruel to boot. I think I'm more in the "Gymkata" range.

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#132062 - 03/13/03 11:26 PM Re: Ninjutsu
Chen Zen Offline
Professional Poster

Registered: 02/09/03
Posts: 7043
Loc: Ms
Jamoni, forget the comment ok? You have since made it defunct. LOL! As for CATO I was going to aanswer your question until you once again had to put a sarcastic remark in your post to me. It wasn't enough for you that I end the conversation and apologize but now you want to raise the confrontation again? Its childish. So now learn somewhere else because I will no longer dignify your post with an answer.

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#132063 - 03/13/03 11:45 PM Re: Ninjutsu
raccoon Offline
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Registered: 02/09/03
Posts: 848
Loc: Victoria BC Canada
Sensei Lou,

maybe, just maybe, the shinai is called for. No?

[IMG]http://www.fightingarts.com/forums/ubb/biggrin.gif[/IMG] [IMG]http://www.fightingarts.com/forums/ubb/biggrin.gif[/IMG] [IMG]http://www.fightingarts.com/forums/ubb/biggrin.gif[/IMG]

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#132064 - 03/14/03 02:21 AM Re: Ninjutsu
Cato Offline
Veteran

Registered: 10/13/02
Posts: 1636
Oh Dear...I seem to have forgoten some people lack a sense of humour. My apologies Chen Zen. No real insult intended. I think perhaps you just don't "get" my humour. I understand why you don't want to answer my question, and that's cool.

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#132065 - 03/14/03 10:16 AM Re: Ninjutsu
Chen Zen Offline
Professional Poster

Registered: 02/09/03
Posts: 7043
Loc: Ms
I am afaid I do not Cato. I am a serious kind of guy but not the stern master type. I do have a sense of humour but I do feel this post has gone way out of hand and further debate on it will just trigger more mud flinging I think. So I will answer further post of yours just not this one, at least for the time being.

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#132066 - 03/15/03 08:45 AM Re: Ninjutsu
UKfightfreak Offline
Professional Poster

Registered: 01/08/03
Posts: 2599
Loc: San Francisco
I couldn't be bothered to read the whole thread, but I will say that Ninjitsu is a Martial Art, they didn't train in Karate or Ju-jitsu or anything else, they trained in Ninjitsu.

To be honest you will be hard pushed to find a real ninjitsu school, in fact there are very few Grandmasters that have ever taught anyone in the West (Stephen K Hayes being one of those).

I would seriously question the liniage of anyone claiming they train in Ninjitsu.

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#132067 - 03/15/03 01:01 PM Re: Ninjutsu
Cato Offline
Veteran

Registered: 10/13/02
Posts: 1636
How do we know what they trained in? Personally I don't care what they trained in, but historically it makesd sense that ninja training incorporated some form of Ju jutsu to supplement their major arts. I'm not convinced that ninjutsu as a seperate style of unarmed fighting ever existed. "Ninjutsu" as a way of training in various martial arts (including ju jutsu) may well have done.

Budo

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#132068 - 03/15/03 01:32 PM Re: Ninjutsu
Chen Zen Offline
Professional Poster

Registered: 02/09/03
Posts: 7043
Loc: Ms
This is what I have been trying to say the whole time Cato. [IMG]http://www.fightingarts.com/forums/ubb/smile.gif[/IMG] That ninja werent solely Jujutsu practitioners. Sure they grappled but like you said the encorporated all types of styles.

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#132069 - 03/23/03 07:49 AM Re: Ninjutsu
Scholar Offline
Member

Registered: 03/05/03
Posts: 472
Loc: Brockton
It seemed like ancient special weapons and tactics like the "shaken"/Star and Shuriken, calitropes to lay down on the path of pursuit,ect. As far as Juijutsu ,I studied Judo, I thought that the other style used joint locking and wrenching/breaking combined with the throws, am I wrong?

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