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#127307 - 12/31/03 01:07 PM Aiki - DO vs. JUTSU
Joe Jutsu Offline

Registered: 04/09/03
Posts: 575
Hello everyone and Happy New Year!

So, bumming around this board and others, there seems to be a consensus amongst MA types that aikijutsu is effective, and actually has "worked on the street," whereas aikido is not effective. I've never studied aikijujutsu, but I was wondering really, how different are the two? Is it just that "jujutsu" is sort of a flash word or catch phrase these days? Are the techniques really different? Or is perhaps the emphases and applications of the techniques a bit different?

Just trying to find some answers,


#127308 - 12/31/03 04:26 PM Re: Aiki - DO vs. JUTSU
the504mikey Offline

Registered: 06/19/03
Posts: 790
Loc: Louisiana, United States
I have trained in both, so here are some of my thoughts on it for what it is worth:

1. There is a wide variation in how aikido is trained.

2. There is a wide variation in how aikijujutsu is trained.

Points one and two serve to reinforce the fact that it is very hard to say anything about either art that is true everywhere. That said, I will make a couple of attempts to generalize, with the understanding that what I am about to say cannot be true for everyone.

1. In general, aikijujitsu will progress from hard, linear techniques (more jujutsu than aiki) to softer more circular techniques as a student progresses. I think having these hard techniques as a fallback mode is partly responsible for the reputation for street effectiveness.

2. In general, an aikijujitsu student will learn many of the same techniques that an aikido student learns, but the circles in the techniques will be smaller and tighter. In my experience there has been much less emphasis on "leading control" and more emphasis on "minimum effort, maximum result". As such, while "blending" with the energy of an attack is nice and shows highly developed skill, there is less emphasis on it being a fundamental component of every technique.

In aikido the way I have experienced, the attacks are stylized in order to give the student maximum opportunity to experience the feeling of aiki. In aikijujitsu as I have practiced it, it is more permissible to "muscle through" a technique and wait for the softness to develop later, and the attacks are less cooperative in spirit. That said, uke's in aikijujitsu tend to resist more and attempt counters more frequently than in aikido, so muscling through is not all that successful a strategy for long.

In the end, I think they are more alike than they are different, and if you train in either one for long enough you end up in the same place. I think the confusion is compounded by the fact that many aikido dojos who practice a harder style of aikido tend to start calling themselves aikijujitsu dojos in order to differentiate themselves from softer styles. It can be pretty hard to tell the difference. For me, at the level I am currently studying, I would say aikjujitsu makes smaller, more sudden circular movements (more of a jerk), and has more pronounced linear movement. I bet you could find many aikidoka that practice that way, and many aikijujutsu practitioners who don't, though.

I think there are a lot more people expressing opinions about these arts than there are training in them, so take whatever you hear with a grain of salt, and occasionally pressure test the stuff you are learning to see how it holds up.

You are a serious student, and you are going to get where you are headed no matter where you train.

Happy New Year, by the way.


#127309 - 12/31/03 10:58 PM Re: Aiki - DO vs. JUTSU
senseilou Offline
Professional Poster

Registered: 10/14/02
Posts: 2082
Loc: Glendale, Az.
Happy New Year to all. I agree with the last post as I have studied both and have gotten to Dan Level in both. So I tell everyone I train in Aiki, not Do or Jutsu. It goes to what I always say, it depends on how you train. I have had Aikido partners who trained and did technique like my Aiki-Jujutsu partners. I have also seen, Aiki-Jujutsu done softly and with no focus. It depends who you train with and how you approach the art.I think the biggest differnce is how the locks are applied and the intent at which they were done. My Aikido was no harm intent mainly control.Yet my Aiki-Jujutsu was meant to hurt or injure, but again that was my Sensei's approach. He said the biggest difference was Aikido was done with the locks to go with the joints not to damage them, where our Aiki-Jujutsu lockls were meant to hurt and destroy the joint to render our attacker helpless. I think in my training, the Do was meant for control and as little damage as possible, but my Jutsu was to hurt, injure, do as much damage as possible, but that was my Sensei's approach


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