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#127242 - 11/14/03 10:21 AM Honesty in Training: My Humbling Experience
Joe Jutsu Offline
Enthusiast

Registered: 04/09/03
Posts: 575
Finally, after weeks of anticipation, the new gym opened at my university and my aikido club has started practicing outside of our "mother" dojo.

The two instructors for club are two students, one a shodan, the other ikkyu, with oversight from two of the head instructors from our dojo, who are more like "advisors."

The senior club members have all come to a consensus that we want to change the way we train. In comparison, the dojo is made up of a bunch of older people, and the training, at least during Friday night's "advanced" class, is not very rigorous. On top of that, we see that alot of people's ukemi in our dojo is weak, from breakfalls to attacking. This is one area that we are going to work on extensively.

Another thing that we are trying to work out his to find a real knowledge of what we can and cannot do. We have serious questions about the ablities of some of the shodan at our dojo, and maybe a nidan or two, to actually be able to pull of the techniques that they think they know how to do, particularly a couple of women who seem to be in aikido for ki more than martial competency (this is in no means to be an indictment on women in the martial arts, but an indictment of training methods). That's cool if ki development is what you're in it for I guess, but if your aikido is not effective than are you really doing aikido?

So we've been sort of left to our own devices. The attacks have become harder, and more real, and if uke is experienced enough, which is pretty much all of the old timer club members, then uke's balance is not compromised by the attack. We have nothing to prove to each other, we are really trying to help each other out as well as we can. What we've found, is that we cannot throw NEARLY as well as we thought we could. We're really only a week into our new system, and I had to sit out last night because of a shoulder injury, but Tuesday we worked on munatsuki koteoroshi. It was as if we had never done the technique before.

I've come to realise just how important, and difficult, the lead is. I don't think I threw anyone all night. We did find that for us it was actually easier to throw into a breakfall than to just drop uke, but we're still getting pretty stuck on the lead.

Ikkyo, Nikyo, Sankyo, Yonkyo, and Shihonage are all still working just fine. I shudder to think about when we get to kokyunage's though.

But anyway, we're trying to organise a seminar to break in our new space sometime early next year, and I want to bring in someone more "practicle (in a martial sense)" than not, and was wondering if anyone out there in cyberland has any suggestions of someone we could bring in who is reasonably affordable. Although I personally would not care what style the instructor came from, if you've heard of teachers within Ki Society that would be better, or at least would keep Sensei from killing us.

Thanks ahead of time for any replies.

Joe

[This message has been edited by Joe Jutsu (edited 11-14-2003).]

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#127243 - 11/16/03 12:38 AM Re: Honesty in Training: My Humbling Experience
avehnor Offline
Stranger

Registered: 11/15/03
Posts: 4
Loc: Redding, CA, USA
seminar... if you can... bernie lau is a good person for "practical" martial arts. he's had extensive aikido practise, aikijitsu, and also used to train the police and such in washington.

who else... kevin blok shihan is also a great one. he's canadian, but will travel. he has a program whose name i don't recall and he trains with the rocky mountain canadian mounties or whatever they are called on their hand to hand techniques and self defense.

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#127244 - 11/16/03 11:29 AM Re: Honesty in Training: My Humbling Experience
kempo_jujitsu Offline
Veteran

Registered: 06/15/03
Posts: 1914
Loc: illinois, usa
slightly off...but grandmaster john pellegrini, founder of combat hapkido would be a great choice.
he has studied hapkido and aikido extensively, (hapki=aiki in korean)...but his art has elements of bjj, jkd, wing chun, kali etc...but still retains alot of the hardcore aikijujutsu stuff, he could show you how to make your aiki more practical and realistic. http://www.ichf.com

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#127245 - 11/17/03 12:22 AM Re: Honesty in Training: My Humbling Experience
senseilou Offline
Professional Poster

Registered: 10/14/02
Posts: 2082
Loc: Glendale, Az.
Kempo-Just a note of awareness, There are some questions as to the validity of some of Master Pelligrini's information. I do not know what the questions are, however I had lunch with 2 of the leading exponents of the Korean Arts of Chosin Do and Hapkido, and they mention that some of Master Pelligrini's information is not valid and he has done some self-promoting as well. I have only met him, worked wih him once and he seemed ok, but I have heard these questions about him a couple of times, so there may be something to it. I know he has not trained witht he Aikido people he claims.

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#127246 - 11/17/03 11:39 AM Re: Honesty in Training: My Humbling Experience
Joe Jutsu Offline
Enthusiast

Registered: 04/09/03
Posts: 575
Thanks for the suggestions I will look into them further.

Joe

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#127247 - 11/17/03 04:09 PM Re: Honesty in Training: My Humbling Experience
kempo_jujitsu Offline
Veteran

Registered: 06/15/03
Posts: 1914
Loc: illinois, usa
thanks sensei lou,
it seems the masters in korea have a different opinion. as his is certified as an actual legitimate hapkido style by the korean kido association.
im not judging either way, from what i have seen his system is very practical and effective....if it should be called hapkido or not....thats another issue lol
who would you recommend senseilou? you know alot of aiki guys. id think toshoshiro obata would be a great choice!!! (could learn some cool sword stuff too toyama ryu battojutsu and shinkendo)

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#127248 - 12/30/04 06:57 PM Re: Honesty in Training: My Humbling Experience
Anonymous
Unregistered


particularly a couple of women who seem to be in aikido for ki more than martial competency (this is in no means to be an indictment on women in the martial arts, but an indictment of training methods). That's cool if ki development is what you're in it for I guess, but if your aikido is not effective than are you really doing aikido?

---
Joe,

What is ai-ki-do without ki? Define effective. In what context? In a street context? dojo context? life context?

Does a black belt (1st, 2nd, 3rd, whateva!) determine one's effectiveness or does it define a specific level of proficiency - as dictated by the syllabus?

What are your reasons and motivation for training in the art? To hurt? Or be hurt? How does that affect your training regime and that of your training partners?

Do people (whose livelihoods depending on them being able to use their various appendages) necessarily want to end up off-the-mat and off-work for any extended period of time due to injury - because we need to test if a technique is effective?

How is this consistent with the philosophy and practice of aikido? Isn't the central tenet of the art one of non-violent response to random acts of aggression?

There is inherent danger in (over)analysing the dichotomy of how can aikido be effective in a real situation. Define real. Your training partners are not trying to kill you (nor you them) and therefore how can a training session even approach reality?

Trust your training. Your partners will no doubt improve as you do, and as you (all) improve, it naturally gets harder to throw them. This does not mean it does not work. It simply means that you need to work out ways to deal with it. (Just like the rest of life).

This does not mean changing the training methods. The principles of ai-ki-do still apply.

Perhaps you are looking outside of the art for answers that already lie within the art. Surely, what remains is simply to practice.

That and memorize The Art of Peace...

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#127249 - 12/31/04 12:18 AM Re: Honesty in Training: My Humbling Experience
Anonymous
Unregistered


For your seminar I would suggest Amos Parker Sensei out of Texas. He rocks.

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