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#119052 - 05/30/03 04:51 PM Certification of belt level and instructor
malanr Offline
Member

Registered: 05/30/03
Posts: 66
Loc: IN USA
Hello everyone. New here, but anyway.

I have studied Tae Kwon Do for a couple years. I have noticed the difference between the quality of instructor, and wonder if there are other organizations that certify instructors other than WTF ATA and ITF.

Also, the instructor I first studied with was not associated with ATA WTF or ITF and did not teach any forms. I have spoke with other students of this instructor and they have expressed that they feel they know nothing, (much like my brown belt level when i switched instructors) and don't feel they could defend themselves.

I guess I just feel cheated (the other student's do to) and I would like to hear the opinions of other artists.

thanks

malanr

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#119053 - 05/30/03 05:12 PM Re: Certification of belt level and instructor
UKfightfreak Offline
Professional Poster

Registered: 01/08/03
Posts: 2599
Loc: San Francisco
Not many people can admit this, to themselves or anyone else.

I think the best thing you have done is realise, now get to a good school, they will probably let you re-grade at your level, work hard and don't worry - mistakes are made.

I have 10 years worth of them so don't feel alone!

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#119054 - 05/30/03 09:36 PM Re: Certification of belt level and instructor
Chen Zen Offline
Professional Poster

Registered: 02/09/03
Posts: 7043
Loc: Ms
Making mistakes is all about the learning experience. If you always executed flawlessly then there would be no purpose to doing a task since nothing would be learned.

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#119055 - 05/31/03 03:34 AM Re: Certification of belt level and instructor
Glashopper Offline
Member

Registered: 05/17/03
Posts: 34
Loc: Omaha, NE USA
I've noticed that a few of our students would have a tough time defending themselves at brown or black belt level, but the majority could inflict some serious damage. The ones who lack are the students who don't pay enough attention and have no drive. When I was in high school, I first studied TKD and was afraid of damaging my hands in sparring....this is very bad for a musician who is serious about his art. Now I'm an old fart and love to spar!
My instructors for the most part are metro policemen and deputies and show no fear about conflict. I feel that I have much to learn from my teachers and I drive a long ways when I know there are several schools right in my own neighborhood!

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#119056 - 06/05/03 11:07 AM Re: Certification of belt level and instructor
gdragon Offline
Member

Registered: 12/14/02
Posts: 38
Loc: CA
I don't think it's quite as simple as certified/uncertified instructors. I learned from an instructor who is not affiliated with an organization, but we do ITF forms. I moved far away and still fly back to train with him. I have had the opportunity to train with people who are affiliated with/certified by ITF and ATA and I have not been impressed. I think alot of TKD practitioners will feel strongly about this, maybe it has just been my luck, but I visited a school run by a Korean man, he has forms videos advertised in BlackBelt magazine, his students travel to national tournaments, and I was thoroughly unimpressed with the forms the students did. They seeemed to not understand the purpose of the techniques in their forms because they had NO power. This is the example of only one school I visited, the worst, but I did visit more.

I know I am just one person and maybe my luck was poor, but I have come to the conclusion (I have been training more than 10 years, BTW, in justification of this opinion) that certification by and affiliation with an organization do not mean much with regards to quality of instruction. I have thought about it alot and I think I have been very lucky to find an instructor who is just fascinated by martial arts. He loves learning and I don't think I will ever catch up to his knowledge, though I'm trying mightily! I think you will have to search and trust your judgement when you're looking for a new teacher. In my totally unhumble opinion (yeah, I might anger some of you, but maybe I'll learn something in the process) I think organizations like ITF and ATA (I don't have personal experience with WTF) limit what an instructor can teach. They tell an instructor what he can/cannot teach. I think that can only limit the art as a whole.

Well, Malanr, I wish you luck finding a new teacher. I ended up changing arts completely in my new location. I don't think certification is the answer. I wish it was that easy.

gdragon

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#119057 - 06/06/03 05:55 AM Re: Certification of belt level and instructor
viper aus Offline
Member

Registered: 05/14/03
Posts: 56
Loc: australia
i dont realy think it matters who they are affilliated with or which organization they belong to as long as you can trace the instructors lineage. these groups were created for political reasons or for money and this is not what martial arts is about.in Australia we have people going door to door selling martial art classes and this is an WTF club. i have been at meeting of associations and it seems most of the talk is of increasing numbers and not of increasing quality. i teach a mixed fighting class of average 12 students ,it could be bigger but it may not be better
to finnish i will say check out your instructor ,if you have any doubts go somewhere else, youll know when you find the right one

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#119058 - 06/11/03 11:39 PM Re: Certification of belt level and instructor
gdragon Offline
Member

Registered: 12/14/02
Posts: 38
Loc: CA
i dont realy think it matters who they are affilliated with or which organization they belong to as long as you can trace the instructors lineage. these groups were created for political reasons or for money and this is not what martial arts is about

Hey, you said what I wanted to have the guts to say. I don't think I would train with someone affiliated with an organization.

I have a question, though. As long as you can trace the instructor's lineage How does one do that? I know my instructor's instructors, but if I am checking out someone new, what do all those names mean? Do you mean we should call up their instructor and see if they claim as a student the yahoo we're trying to check out? How do we know the higher guy is any good?

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#119059 - 06/12/03 08:41 AM Re: Certification of belt level and instructor
JohnL Offline
Professional Poster

Registered: 03/24/03
Posts: 4309
Loc: NY, NY, USA
Why bother with the linage.

Is the instructor good or bad. That's the only criteria I need.

Whether his teacher or his teachers teacher was any good is irrelevant.

Johnl

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#119060 - 06/12/03 01:09 PM Re: Certification of belt level and instructor
UKfightfreak Offline
Professional Poster

Registered: 01/08/03
Posts: 2599
Loc: San Francisco
[QUOTE]Originally posted by JohnL:
Why bother with the linage.

Is the instructor good or bad. That's the only criteria I need.

Whether his teacher or his teachers teacher was any good is irrelevant.

Johnl

[/QUOTE]

As a beginner - who knows little or nothing about Martial Arts having some history that can be traced can give peace of mind.

Once you know what you are talking about this is less important.

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#119061 - 06/12/03 02:46 PM Re: Certification of belt level and instructor
malanr Offline
Member

Registered: 05/30/03
Posts: 66
Loc: IN USA
JohnL and UK: both are good answers

How about this thought: Lineage doesn't matter to someone who has studied and knows a little about what they are doing. Lineage does matter to someone who is innocent to the way and would like to make a educated decision on who to study with.

Now, do you think that an instructor should be proud to tell you who he received his training from? or that he has the blessings from someone other than himself and his instructor? My first instructor had a certificate from some TKD association but it was written all in Korean, so i don't know what the heck it said.

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