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#114731 - 02/21/05 08:52 AM Re: Better Swordsmen? The Ninja or Samurai?
laf7773 Offline
Professional Poster

Registered: 05/05/04
Posts: 4064
Loc: Limbo
So is kyudo. Hojojutsu is still practiced by a few as well even though i personally haven't seen much of it recently.

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#114732 - 02/21/05 10:27 PM Re: Better Swordsmen? The Ninja or Samurai?
Anonymous
Unregistered


To answer, with what is solely my opinion, the original question asked if the thread...

We'll use a daylight, open-ground fight, with the ninja in their stealthy quiet clothes, the samurai clad in their traditional armor. The ninja was never a samurai at any point in his life. The samurai was not knowledged in the ninja ways. Swords drawn, they approach.

A few parries and broad strokes, the occasional dodge, until finally someone misses a large swing and gets countered to death. End fight.

Considering the emphasis on the longsword in the Samurai's training he'll have the upper hand. The samurai learned to kill the hell outta other human beings via longsword. Of course, a ninja would most likely have no reason to engage an armored opponent in combat when a longbow could effectively eliminate the threat.

Once more, solely my opinion. Kept using longsword so as not to present the dreaded K word everyone seems to despise.

- Op. Skinny Ninja

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#114733 - 02/22/05 03:21 AM Re: Better Swordsmen? The Ninja or Samurai?
Anonymous
Unregistered


[QUOTE]they probably even had arts for naginata(spelling?) etc also but never became popular today like the sword arts have. [/QUOTE]

Naginata is still popular these days, in fact there is a Victorian association. http://home.vicnet.net.au/~austnf/page3.html
I'm surprised you have never heard of this since you live in Victoria and have trained in budo for 22 years.

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#114734 - 02/22/05 04:04 AM Re: Better Swordsmen? The Ninja or Samurai?
Anonymous
Unregistered


i already knew you could train in the jap halberd in vic, they have it at the dojo i train at. i said "they probably have arts for it tho it is NOT AS POPULAR"

does anyone want to borrow my xray machine to examine the words any more closly?

meh

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#114735 - 02/22/05 04:24 AM Re: Better Swordsmen? The Ninja or Samurai?
laf7773 Offline
Professional Poster

Registered: 05/05/04
Posts: 4064
Loc: Limbo
And what dojo would that be?

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#114736 - 02/22/05 04:32 AM Re: Better Swordsmen? The Ninja or Samurai?
Anonymous
Unregistered


An X-ray machine might help decipher your poor spelling.

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#114737 - 02/22/05 04:47 AM Re: Better Swordsmen? The Ninja or Samurai?
Anonymous
Unregistered


so i have trouble spelling sometimes, i already mentioned i came from a rough background. SO WHAT?

picking on that is hardly intelligent, seems that some are running out of things to pick on.

and laf, i already said i was thru trying to explain myself to you, give it up.

[IMG]http://www.fightingarts.com/forums/ubb/smile.gif[/IMG]

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#114738 - 02/22/05 04:55 AM Re: Better Swordsmen? The Ninja or Samurai?
Anonymous
Unregistered


and BTW laf i already told you where i train at, dont you read the posts that you are supposed to moderate. go back and read it and then come back and tell me whats wrong with it. lol. cos i know your going to.

[IMG]http://www.fightingarts.com/forums/ubb/smile.gif[/IMG]

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#114739 - 02/25/05 02:58 AM Re: Better Swordsmen? The Ninja or Samurai?
Anonymous
Unregistered


Well for all of you who want to know the truth, The ninja were hired assassins. They were usually hired by either the local Yakuza or neighboring councilmen (samurai)(daimyo)to knock off and enemy near by. To answer the question of who is a better swordsmen, well who practices harder in the art? There were many art styles that were used in the past. Like, muso shin den ryu jukiden ryu, Shinshin muso ryu, yagyu ( very famous style by the way) and so many more. Each individual develops there own techniques when taught the fundamentals of budo. Keep in mind the term Sayano-Uchi which is defined....

Sayano-uchi is another name for Iai. A sword should never be drawn easily. The mystery of Iai is that defeat an enemy before drawing your sword. Donít put someone to the sword and do not be put to someoneís sword. Just drives out any evil thought of self-interest keeping self control. The best time to draw your sword is that after defeating an enemy....

It is basically about one's character and skill. whether is be a ninja, ronin, Samurai, or a paranoid schizophrenic. Whoever has the strongest character will always win. Keep the zanshin strong. For those of you who don't understand the terminology, you may want to consider taking up bowling instead.

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#114740 - 02/25/05 08:59 AM Re: Better Swordsmen? The Ninja or Samurai?
Charles Mahan Offline
Professional Poster

Registered: 06/14/04
Posts: 2502
Loc: Denton, Tx, USA
[QUOTE]Originally posted by haibara_iaido:
Well for all of you who want to know the truth, The ninja were hired assassins. They were usually hired by either the local Yakuza or neighboring councilmen (samurai)(daimyo)to knock off and enemy near by.

[/QUOTE]

Don't believe everything you read online, and only half of what you read in books. And practically nothing about ninja. Far too much misinformation in all sources.

[QUOTE]

To answer the question of who is a better swordsmen, well who practices harder in the art? There were many art styles that were used in the past. Like, muso shin den ryu jukiden ryu, Shinshin muso ryu, yagyu ( very famous style by the way) and so many more.
[/QUOTE]

Not sure what jukiden Ryu is supposed to be. Not a style name I recognize.

[QUOTE]
Keep in mind the term Sayano-Uchi which is defined....

Sayano-uchi is another name for Iai. A sword should never be drawn easily. The mystery of Iai is that defeat an enemy before drawing your sword. Donít put someone to the sword and do not be put to someoneís sword. Just drives out any evil thought of self-interest keeping self control. The best time to draw your sword is that after defeating an enemy....
[/QUOTE]

Well... not exactly. Saya no Uchi is a key concept in iai, but it is not another word for iai. Saya no Uchi is one of those terms that has a hundred different interpretations. A direct translation is "inside the saya". One intepretation is that if you develop your skill and presence to a sufficiently high enough degree, an encounter with a potential opponent becomes unlikely. Your phsyical presence and reputation are sufficient to intimidate your oponent into backing down. A philisophical take on the same idea would say that the best encounter is one where the sword is never drawn. A less idealistic interpretation is that you dominate your opponent through means of superior presence and force of will, and once his will to fight is broken, you strike him down. A practical and technical interpretation is that the initial cut begins while the tip of the sword is literally still inside the saya.

There are a variety of other interpretations as well.

[This message has been edited by Charles Mahan (edited 02-25-2005).]

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