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#113634 - 12/25/04 11:37 AM Re: Teaching Myself
laf7773 Offline
Professional Poster

Registered: 05/05/04
Posts: 4064
Loc: Limbo
It really depends on the instructor. Some would rather you work on what they give you. It also depends on what you've been working on and if it's actually beneficial to your training.

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#113635 - 12/26/04 07:03 AM Re: Teaching Myself
Anonymous
Unregistered


You should also remember that there are instructors, and then there are instructors. All are not created equal.

As for self teaching, some of us have no choice. Training under a qualified instructor is without question the better way to go. But in some situations, your choice is either self training or no training. There is one and only one Iaido school within 2 hour drive from where I live. They meet Friday nights. I work second shift so have no chance of getting to classes. Working second shift deprives me of almost all martial arts training in my area. So my choice is either I self train, or don't train at all.

Since I really don't care all that much, (I train for fun and fitness), I will continue with what I'm doing. Am I learning some bad techniques? More than likely. Do I care? No.

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#113636 - 01/02/05 08:24 PM Re: Teaching Myself
Anonymous
Unregistered


.......
just depends on how devoted you are to something
.......

Instructors are their for guidance...
However, The world around you can be an instructor. This does not in any way condemn teachers; personally, I learned a few things from them.
(But as I stated it was lacking to me)


You can be instructed.......
You can learn from experience......
It's whatever feels right in your heart,

There are many methods of learning
and many ways of self training

I'm not sure if this helps you a lot
but I'm only stating what I myself have experienced

~In the end no matter what you choose
there is really only one question
How devoted are you~

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#113637 - 01/02/05 08:41 PM Re: Teaching Myself
Anonymous
Unregistered


[QUOTE]Originally posted by laf7773:
There is more to it than what you think it "looks" like. There are things you can learn on your own. Things like basic etiquette and terminology. You can educate yourself on various companies and what constitutes a quality sword and what is just for decoration. You can do basic conditioning like getting used to sitting in seiza. You can learn about the history of various arts. Trying to teach yourself much more will result in you having to back peddle and relearn everything the right way.

[/QUOTE]

I couldn't have put this any better. You ABSOLUTELY must know what your doing or all of your efforts will only make it more difficult for you down the road. As my sensei always says "Practice doesn't make purfect, Practice is good for you but in order to become good you must have purfect practice."

Glenn Letourneau

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#113638 - 01/02/05 11:42 PM Re: Teaching Myself
laf7773 Offline
Professional Poster

Registered: 05/05/04
Posts: 4064
Loc: Limbo
[QUOTE]Originally posted by Yuki Neko:
.......
just depends on how devoted you are to something
.......

Instructors are their for guidance...
However, The world around you can be an instructor. This does not in any way condemn teachers; personally, I learned a few things from them.
(But as I stated it was lacking to me)


You can be instructed.......
You can learn from experience......
It's whatever feels right in your heart,

There are many methods of learning
and many ways of self training

I'm not sure if this helps you a lot
but I'm only stating what I myself have experienced

~In the end no matter what you choose
there is really only one question
How devoted are you~
[/QUOTE]

Instructors are there to TEACH you the proper technique. It's your job to practice what you are taught.

How does the "world around you" teach you Japanese swordsmanship?

Again, how does a 16 yr old with limited experience in Japanese sword arts find an experienced instructor "lacking"? You still haven't answered this. What exactly were they lacking in?

How are you going to get "experience" in sword fighting today? How will you know what will get you killed and what will not? That's the funny thing about koryu sword arts, they were around when people actually USED swords in battle. This is where you should take advantage or THEIR experience, experience you may never get on your own.

It's not "what feels right in your heart". What feels right to you, the one with NO experience, is what can get you killed or cause you to injure your self or someone close to you.

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#113639 - 01/04/05 08:29 AM Re: Teaching Myself
Charles Mahan Offline
Professional Poster

Registered: 06/14/04
Posts: 2502
Loc: Denton, Tx, USA
[QUOTE]Originally posted by Yuki Neko:

You can learn from experience......
It's whatever feels right in your heart,
[/QUOTE]

Heh. Hard to argue with logic like that. If you feel a sword in your heart, you know you've made a mistake and should learn from that experience [IMG]http://www.fightingarts.com/forums/ubb/biggrin.gif[/IMG]

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#113640 - 01/04/05 11:15 AM Re: Teaching Myself
MAGon Offline
Veteran

Registered: 07/22/03
Posts: 1737
Loc: Miami, Fl.
[QUOTE]Originally posted by JuStAkId:


What was your point in that one MAGon? That made sense, but is there a point to that one? Another thing, is that when I first started reading here, I thought that self teaching was okay, as long as others help you, somewhat. Like I learned a few TKD kata from an Aunt, the basics of Jujitsu from a book, and I learned how to box from my friend. In between all that, I read about martial arts on the internet, and applied it to what I already knew. After a while I got better, and I know I did good, but now I wonder if there might be flaws in my technique, or how I move. Anyone wanna give me some advice?
[/QUOTE]

Just drawing a (Somewhat sarcastic) paralell: Look, does it make sense to ignore several thousands of yrs. of theoretical and practical knowledge on the capabilities of the wheel and go off by yourself to try and figure out what you can do with the thing? Or is your time better spent studying what's already known and hopefully becoming knowledgeable enough to come up with something new nobody's thought of before?
The paralell to the sword arts is fairly obvious: There are written records and oral teachings about these that go back hundreds of yrs. In addition, the same as in engineering, there's applications that just can't be learned from books and require a knowledgeable teacher to demonstrate. As Mr. Mahan makes the point, it's tough to find out that attempting to wield a sword in a particular way you may think is a good idea others discovered 400 yrs. ago only leads to stabbing yourself through the heart!!!

[QUOTE]Originally posted by JuStAkId:
Thanks. I'll find an instructor. But would it be good to still do some of the self-training things I did already, while taking a class, or while having an instructor?[/QUOTE]

That's an entirely different think all together. In fact, putting in extra time by yourself to polish what you've been taught by a competent instructor will make you a better swordsman. Sooner, too!



[This message has been edited by MAGon (edited 01-04-2005).]

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#113641 - 01/04/05 11:54 AM Re: Teaching Myself
Anonymous
Unregistered


These self teaching discussions are getting more and more amusing to read. There's no getting through to these people. It feels more sensible to sit back and read bout their adventures of creating a sword art through their experiences of fighting like a Samurai. It's kinda entertaining.

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#113642 - 01/05/05 04:57 AM Re: Teaching Myself
Anonymous
Unregistered


Thought I'd add my two cents worth. I have been interested in T'ai Chi for a loooong time - but always had trouble finding classes (till recently) so I attempted to learn it first from books (oh yeah - real successful lol) and then from a video. The video was a good one, but the fact remains that it is not possible to learn it properly from a video. I actually got stuck fairly early on, which turned out to be a really good thing, since I was not doing things properly. This meant that when I started a class I had much less to unlearn. When you do the form properly, it feels quite different, in terms of the muscles you are using, the intent of the motions, and the energy flow. In addition, an instructor can watch what you are doing and catch not only positioning items, but also the more subtle things like if you have tensed up. This type of thing applies to all the martial arts.

In addition, as has been stated previously in this thread, when you add the factor of a weapon, you also increase the risk.

This is in reference to the post above: "Sensei told me a few years ago an old Japanese saying that goes something like "Before you get to know your sword, your sword will get to know YOU". By which is meant that it's inevitable that you'll cut yourself at some point, before you get good enough"

One of the people that is training me in push hands mentioned that no matter how good someone is with a blade, she said it never fails that the moment they go to a live blade, they cut themselves. Certainly seems like the 'blade getting to know you before you get to know the blade.' [IMG]http://www.fightingarts.com/forums/ubb/smile.gif[/IMG]

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#113643 - 01/07/05 12:31 PM Re: Teaching Myself
MAGon Offline
Veteran

Registered: 07/22/03
Posts: 1737
Loc: Miami, Fl.
[QUOTE]Originally posted by Walter Wong:
These self teaching discussions are getting more and more amusing to read. There's no getting through to these people. It feels more sensible to sit back and read bout their adventures of creating a sword art through their experiences of fighting like a Samurai. It's kinda entertaining.[/QUOTE]

Is it just me, or are any of you guys also starting to HATE those MA movies that portray the talented SUPERIOR Western guy mastering an art after a few months practice, some coaching and a a bit more going- off- on- their- own- for- training- and- self- enlightment?

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