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#112241 - 07/18/04 12:01 PM Re: i want 2 no if ther is a style of nin jitsu
laf7773 Offline
Professional Poster

Registered: 05/05/04
Posts: 4064
Loc: Limbo
First of all he doesn't talk much about his past because he doesn't believe in developing fame by mentioning someone else’s name.

Or maybe he doesn't want to be associated with a fraud any longer.

Second of all his technique is not strictly Ninjitsu and he doesn't claim it to be,

Tew never studied ninjutsu. Some may be similar to ninjutsu techniques but the appliction of his techniques is sloppy.

there are only so many techniques and movements that are effective and not a waste of time if not dangerous to do in a real fight.

I have trained with people from both Tew's and Dux's systems. They lack proper timing and rythem, leave themselves open for counter and had no concept of proper body allignment or body mechnics for that matter. With out these basic fundamental skills any technique is dangerous in a real fight. If Tew were to train with a more legitamate instructor that understands these concepts he may be effective, as it is his system is all flash.

Third of all the things you see on the website are not all practical techniques, to judge something purely on what you see on a site instead of actually taking the time to experience it is ignorant.

A web site is repersentative of your system unless you state otherwise. If you don't want people to think you don't know what you are talking about don't post that sort of garbage on the net. The simple fact is his sword techniques are garbage. His empty hand techniques are taught against a nonresistant apponent and are all flash.

However I've personally spent 6 days a week training in his dojo the majority of which was on fighting and actual fighting not flashy things you'd see on TV. Guys in the ring punching, kicking, throwing, sweeping, and doing anything we can to win a match.

Fighting in the ring is a lot different than fighting on the street.

if you actually read his take on it all he sees the martial arts as a science,

A lot of frauds claim martial science, it's a disclaimer. My concepts are different than yours because this is martial science not martial arts.

I guess what I'm trying to say is don't knock it until you've tried it,

I have tried it, i'm still knocking it.

in a fight it isn't your teacher's name that is going to save you, it's how you utilize your assets to overcome your opponents.

But it is your teacher that will teach you HOW to overcome your opponent. Tew teaches you flashy techniques that have no bearing on a real fight, unless you want to loose.

Rick I know and respect. I've fought with him, trained with him, even hung out with him. He is an all around good guy, funny, fun, and very nice, as well as tough, skilled, and stern.

Sounds like your judgment is clouded by your friendship. Go train with a legitimate ninjutsu instructor and you will see the difference.

Maybe you should meet the man and see the real thing instead of getting caught up in a great deal of hearsay and rumors.

I do have first hand experience with it. I posted earlier about the Bujinkan instructor's experience with them because i KNOW he knows what he is talking about. He only confirmed my experience with his.

The simple fact is Tew and Dux are NOT teaching ninjutsu. Tew has had legitimate training in the past and was one of the students of Dux who helped develope Dux ryu. Tew's system is no more ninjutsu than tae kwon do is (not bashing TKD). If you want real ninjutsu look to the Bujinkan, Genbukan or Jinenkan. Both Genbukan and Jinenkan are derivatives of the 9 ryu that make up the Bujinkan.

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#112242 - 07/22/04 08:38 PM Re: i want 2 no if ther is a style of nin jitsu
Anonymous
Unregistered


you make yourself sound real knowledgeable on all ninjutsu arts. sounds egotisticle to me. you say that tew knows nothing and you are better because you can counter? are you the kid on "karate kid 3" "your karate's a joke". you also said that the site is a representative of who you are, and he never states that the moves are just for show. wrong! he does state that in his articles. so i would defenitly be sure of what you are talking about before posting. mr tew did study with dux but left him and went to study for a time hapkido then with bussey. so if you are so concerned about the world changing to bujinkan then just know that bussey at one time was bujinkan too. hatsumi isn't god and he has never had any experience outside of the dojo. even his own students say that. so if you want flash i guess you need to look at your own soke. i really wish you would get a real point of view before you go out and trash other styles. i would like also to know who you really trained with in tew ryu? you said that they had a lot of sloppy techniques. tell me who? you can't because you are a liar. too bad that the bujinkan has so many of them. another thing you claim that you are the only real ninjutsu but since there are 9 ryu in buji and only 3 teach taijutsu and the others teach samurai jujitsu i hope that you are from the "last 3 ninpo schools". (in the whole entire world)

[This message has been edited by eman (edited 07-22-2004).]

[This message has been edited by eman (edited 07-22-2004).]

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#112243 - 07/23/04 01:48 AM Re: i want 2 no if ther is a style of nin jitsu
laf7773 Offline
Professional Poster

Registered: 05/05/04
Posts: 4064
Loc: Limbo
You really should read what a person writes before you make a fool of yourself. I didn't say Tew has no skill. I said what he presents on his site is not ninjutsu like he claims it is. What Dux taught isn't ninjutsu and never was. I'm sure Tew does have some skill but he is marketing toward a group that are more interested in flashy techniques that don't work. The people I trained with, Mr. Childress and Mr. Mullens, were accomplished martial artists from other systems and new a good portion of the techniques taught in the Tew system were ineffective. Just like any other system. The difference is when they don't teach you anything more than just technique. Most every technique has it's "window of opportunity" where it is effective. Some have a larger window, or greater range of effectiveness. One of the guys I worked with told me he didn't see where Tew's students were being taught this or the proper timing and range to make some of these techniques effective.

"you make yourself sound real knowledgeable on all ninjutsu arts."

Just passing on facts, and I never said anything about "all ninjutsu arts". Your making assumptions.

"you say that tew knows nothing and you are better because you can counter?"

I never said this.

"you also said that the site is a representative of who you are"

I said it was representative of your system. Get it straight.

"so if you are so concerned about the world changing to bujinkan then just know that bussey at one time was bujinkan too."

Who said anything about "the world changing to bujinkan"? Again more assumptions. I know who Bussey is and I know he was in the Bujinkan. I didn't know Tew studied with him, my mistake. But if Tew left Dux to later study with Bussey, formerly of the Bujinkan, shouldn't that tell you something about the Dux system?

"hatsumi isn't god and he has never had any experience outside of the dojo."

I'm sure you have proof of this, right? Your on a subject you know nothing about.

"even his own students say that."

Name one student that has trained directly under Hatsumi who has said that. Maybe you can't because you are lying?

"so if you want flash I guess you need to look at your own soke."

Who said I study in the bujinkan? I have trained with a few people from there but nothing formal. Again more assumptions.

"I really wish you would get a real point of view before you go out and trash other styles."

Not trashing, just pointing out the facts. Another fact is this IS my point of view. Maybe you should get your facts straight before you start flaming people.

"I would like also to know who you really trained with in tew ryu? you said that they had a lot of sloppy techniques. tell me who? you can't because you are a liar."

Already pointed them out. Your turn. Who are the "students" making these statements about Hatsumi?

"another thing you claim that you are the only real ninjutsu but since there are 9 ryu in buji and only 3 teach taijutsu and the others teach samurai jujitsu I hope that you are from the "last 3 ninpo schools". (in the whole entire world)"

Another assumption. I never said this, at all. There are three well known schools. The Bujinkan, Genbukan and Jeninkan. The soke's of Genbukan and Jeninkan are both students of Hatsumi's who received menkyo kaiden. There are other systems of ninjutsu out there but these are the easiest legitimate forms to find.

Now maybe you should go back and reread the posts and stop making assumptions. You know what they say about people who ASSuME too much. Your entire post is pure assumption. Stop getting your undies in a wad and let this thread die. It served it's purpose long ago.



[This message has been edited by laf7773 (edited 07-23-2004).]

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#112244 - 07/23/04 08:38 AM Re: i want 2 no if ther is a style of nin jitsu
Charles Mahan Offline
Professional Poster

Registered: 06/14/04
Posts: 2502
Loc: Denton, Tx, USA
[QUOTE]Originally posted by DV8R:
A fan? No.

I know who he is yes. I never studied anything directly from him. Why do u ask? Are you a fan of his?
[/QUOTE]

I've seen a tape of Dillman "instructing" a group of students in sword techniques.

I guess I am something of a fan, but perhaps not in a way that might be considered complimentary [IMG]http://www.fightingarts.com/forums/ubb/biggrin.gif[/IMG] [IMG]http://www.fightingarts.com/forums/ubb/biggrin.gif[/IMG] [IMG]http://www.fightingarts.com/forums/ubb/biggrin.gif[/IMG] [IMG]http://www.fightingarts.com/forums/ubb/biggrin.gif[/IMG] [IMG]http://www.fightingarts.com/forums/ubb/biggrin.gif[/IMG]

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#112245 - 07/23/04 09:58 AM Re: i want 2 no if ther is a style of nin jitsu
Anonymous
Unregistered


how can i let something die that has no merit or is completely false? i will admit that dux's backround is really shakey and he needs to come up with some real proof of his claims before anyone can start really taking him serious. his skill and the skill of his black belts is very good and i have seen them in action. as far as timing goes you might want to remember that the instructor can only teach you the technique and the way to apply it. if you go off and do your own thing... even with the dojo patch on your gi that is something on you. i really think those students really needed some more practice. the 9 ryu i'm talking about are in the bujinkan and i wasn't referring to the other schools (genbukan, jenikan) one of the students of hatsumi's is mr. severe that says hatsumi has no experience outside the dojo. as far as flash... well you and i both know that there is yin and yang to any style worth practicing. i have trained with multiple style practicioners. i even found flash in the jkd system that i saw. why not have some flash? why not practice moves that aren't necessarily going to work outside the dojo? as long as you learn that those moves are just for show... then there should be no problem. as for me i enjoy my martial arts training and even the flash moves that are just for show put some spice in the mix. mr. tew teaches you both sides so that you are well rounded. i know many bujinkan practicioners and they only see hatsumi from a distance when they go to train under him. so all they get is theory. on the other hand tew sensei shows you the moves on a one on one basis so that you are the most knowledgeable and effective. please don't take my words and try to twist them so you can make yourself look like you know more than you do. and those practicioners that you mentioned you said are from other styles not even tew ryu. am i saying tew sensei is the best and there is no one better?... no. all i'm saying is that he is an accomplished martial artist and a great instructor. so when you get on and say his moves are not ninjutsu you would have to say that bussey isn't ninjutsu either. tew trained with dux when he was a kid and then became a black belt under bussey. so why can't he name what he does ninjutsu? even tew says himself that it isn't traditional at all and is a very modern approach. he even says that his school isn't for you if you want the traditional stuff.(which by the way hatsumi seems to be modernizing his style too, so what is tradition?) all i'm sayin is don't get on and trash other styles ("the facts") when you have a limited knowledge of that style. just admit you don't know and then let the thread die.

[This message has been edited by eman (edited 07-23-2004).]

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#112246 - 07/23/04 02:27 PM Re: i want 2 no if ther is a style of nin jitsu
laf7773 Offline
Professional Poster

Registered: 05/05/04
Posts: 4064
Loc: Limbo
Tew ryu is not ninjutsu. Just because you want to call it that doesn't make it so.

"as far as timing goes you might want to remember that the instructor can only teach you the technique and the way to apply it."

You can't learn to apply a technique if you don't learn proper timing and range. Lessons you get from your instructor.

"if you go off and do your own thing... even with the dojo patch on your gi that is something on you."

This sentence makes no sense what so ever.

"one of the students of hatsumi's is mr. severe that says hatsumi has no experience outside the dojo."

I guess your talking about Ralph Severe? If so did he say this to you personally? Or was it second hand information?

"the 9 ryu i'm talking about are in the bujinkan and i wasn't referring to the other schools (genbukan, jenikan)"

I was referring to other legitimate ninjutsu systems, not the ryu with in them.

"why not have some flash? why not practice moves that aren't necessarily going to work outside the dojo?"

There is a difference in flashy techniques that aid in learning other important lessons and techniques that are just to show off.

"as for me i enjoy my martial arts training and even the flash moves that are just for show put some spice in the mix."

Good for you, stop crying over spilled milk. If it makes you happy then let it be. Give your oppinion of Tew's system and don't come into a forum attacking someone you know nothing about. I never attacked Tew personally, Dux yes i did. All i said was his system is not ninjutsu and the techniques on his site and those shown to me were ineffective.

"i know many bujinkan practitioners and they only see hatsumi from a distance when they go to train under him."

Hatsumi's student base is also much larger than Tew's. Hatsumi also has several very highly qualified instructors a few of which have received menkyo kaiden so it's not needed for him to train one on one with every one in the system.

" please don't take my words and try to twist them so you can make yourself look like you know more than you do."

I haven't twisted anything nor do i intend to. You have no idea what my knowledge of this subject is. Once again, stop making assumptions.

"and those practicioners that you mentioned you said are from other styles not even tew ryu."

No i said they also had training in other styles. This is what lead them to leave. They had nothing bad to say about Tew, only that they were less than impressed with the system.

"am i saying tew sensei is the best and there is no one better?... no. all i'm saying is that he is an accomplished martial artist and a great instructor."

I haven't stated anything different. Just maybe he wasn't taught these things. If he only received a shodan form Bussey what makes you think he is qualified to teach ninjutsu? Shodan is far from obtaining enough knowledge of a system to teach it.

"so why can't he name what he does ninjutsu?"

For the same reason he can't call it tae kwon do, krav maga or any other art, because it's not. Why not Tew Ryu martial arts? The fact is he is doing something several others have done. Take from various systems they have studied to form their own system. Then give it a popular name to attract students. The problem is most of the "founders" haven't attained the level of understanding in order to found a system. Not saying they aren't good at what they do, but there is a big difference in a 5th degree in one system, a 3rd degree in another combining them as on to teach and someone that is of 8th degree or higher in at least one system starting their own. I'm only using the dan system as an example as not all 8th dans are created equal. You get the point though.

".(which by the way hatsumi seems to be modernizing his style too, so what is tradition?)"

All systems must move forward or they get left behind. It's when you abandon tradition all together that some make mistakes. You also hear a lot of "founders" claim a "modern/ non traditional" system in order to cover the fact that what they are teaching or calling their system is misleading.

"all i'm sayin is don't get on and trash other styles ("the facts") when you have a limited knowledge of that style. just admit you don't know and then let the thread die."

Again, not trashing. Just pointing out facts from FIRST HAND KNOWLEDGE of what i have seen of the system and it's origins. I'm sorry if i hurt your feelings, but Tew ryu isn't ninjutsu no matter how much you want to believe it is. Dux did not bring any ninjutsu system over from Japan. It's obvious what Tew is teaching is not from the bujinkan. If his only two claims to ninjutsu is Dux and Bussey then what he is teaching can't be ninjutsu. If he only obtained a black belt from Bussey, he is not teaching ninjutsu.

If you call a dogs tail a leg then how many legs does it have? 5? No. Just because you call it a leg doesn't mean it is.

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#112247 - 07/23/04 03:02 PM Re: i want 2 no if ther is a style of nin jitsu
Anonymous
Unregistered


that was a horrible comeback about a dog.

the fact is if i learn under bussey and i become one of his black belts then i have learned ninjutsu (bussey way back when). the same if i studied under hoban or van donk or even hayes. so if i become one of their black belts and i have been given the right to teach by my instructor/sensei then i can call what i teach ninjutsu.

ralph severe told me that himself by the way. in fact he still teaches bujinkan his way which he calls kamiyama ninjutsu. he still claims its bujinkan but now honed for combat.

i think tew sensei doesn't talk much about dux because of the scandel dux brought on himself. he wants people to judge him by his school not his lineage.

i can train under hatsumi and take what i learned and make it horrible but just because i carry a bujinkan patch doesn't mean i'm good.(just as an example, not trying to say that bujinkan isn't good) when you are given the right to teach and do your own thing from your instructor then i don't see why you can't.

so lets judge a man by his skill. what tew says is that he teaches a modern ninjutsu and if you want traditional you should look elsewhere. even though he has is "dans" in hapkido he doesn't claim to teach hapkido. what he calls it is tew ryu ninjutsu or rtms (rick tew's martial science) so that way people looking for goofy costum warriors won't come knocking on his door.

hope this doesn't annoy you. the fact that i point out your mistakes.

(note the changes)

[This message has been edited by eman (edited 07-23-2004).]

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#112248 - 07/23/04 03:22 PM Re: i want 2 no if ther is a style of nin jitsu
Kempoman Offline
Veteran

Registered: 11/15/00
Posts: 1484
Loc: Houston, TX
eman,

First of all you are never going to get your point across on an internet message board without using at least semi-correct grammar and sentance structure.

You also might try some paragraphs as they tend to help seperate different thoughts into nice neat sections.

This one reminds me of a scene from that Sylvester Stallone movie about the mountain rescue team and the bad guy Jon Lithgow.

One of the underlings tells Mr. Lithgow to "Get off my back". To wit Mr. Lithgow replies "Off...I haven't got on yet"


[Notice the paragraphs]

Go ahead and bring the beng quan to him Lane. I am enjoying the sh!t out of this since sojowbobo(means founder) isn't around to play with anymore.


Scott

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#112249 - 07/23/04 03:34 PM Re: i want 2 no if ther is a style of nin jitsu
Anonymous
Unregistered


was trying to save on space! whoops!

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#112250 - 07/23/04 04:03 PM Re: i want 2 no if ther is a style of nin jitsu
laf7773 Offline
Professional Poster

Registered: 05/05/04
Posts: 4064
Loc: Limbo
that was a horrible comeback about a dog

It is true though.

the fact is if i learn under bussey and i become one of his black belts then i have learned ninjutsu (bussey way back when)

It's now obvious you don't know what you are talking about. Shodan is when you start learning. Up till then you are only learning basics. Some shodans may be allowed to teach under supervision but they are not knowledgable enough about the art to teach it full time.

the same if i studied under hoban or van donk or even hayes.

All students of bujinkan.

so if i become one of their black belts and i have been given the right to teach by my instructor/sensei then i can call what i teach ninjutsu.

But not the right to create your own system and call it ninjutsu. Tew is not teaching bujinkan. So regardless of if he was promoted to shodan by Bussey and given permission to teach, what he is teaching is not ninjutsu.

ralph severe told me that himself by the way.

I'll e-mail him and ask him.

in fact he still teaches bujinkan his way which he calls kamiyama ninjutsu. he still claims its bujinkan but now honed for combat.

I'm well aware of what he teaches. He was promoted to 8th dan in '92 and 9th dan in '02.

i think tew sensei doesn't talk much about dux because of the scandel dux brought on himself. he wants people to judge him by his school not his lineage.

May have been the best thing he did. But a shodan in the bujinkan doesn't mean he is teaching ninjutsu. He may have taken cues from ninjutsu for his system but the only reason he calls his system what he does is for publicity.

i can train under hatsumi and take what i learned and make it horrible but just because i carry a bujinkan patch doesn't mean i'm good

Another assumption. I never said it does. I never said bujinkan is the best. I never said bujinkan is the only ninjutsu. I only said to look to the bujinkan, genbukan and jinenkan for legitamate ninjutsu. Why did i point out these three? Because they are the most wide spread and easiest to find in the states or any where else for that matter.

when you are given the right to teach and do your own thing from your instructor then i don't see why you can't.

Simple. Let's say that Bussey promoted Tew to shodan and gave him permission to teach bujinkan. Tew made up his own system. This system doesn't resemble bujinkan in any way, more than likely because it was more influenced by hapkido, tae kwon do and ju jutsu. If this is so. Why call it ninjutsu at all? To get students. Why not just leave it at RTMS? It is obvious to anyone with any knowledge of ninjutsu that Tew is not teaching it.

what tew says is that he teaches a modern ninjutsu and if you want traditional you should look elsewhere

You should also look elsewhere if you want real ninjutsu.

hope this doesn't annoy you. the fact that i point out your mistakes.

You have only pointed out one mistake. That Tew trained with Bussey. I'm sorry you got your feelings hurt. I'm also sorry if i make it sound like you have wasted months or years training in Tew's system, it's not entended. I did message Mr. Severe to get his take on your comment.

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