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#111987 - 05/31/04 09:46 PM Blade tricks and skills

hey i just made this to see if anyone had any good tricks with the sword. for instance, i learned to spin the sword with one hand by putting the grip inbetween my fingers and by shifting it in and out of my fingers and using my thumb to push it back up once it got to the end of my hand. does any1 know of any other ones? and if this is an inapropriate topic please tell me. and just so everyone knows im only 16 so im in this more for the fun then for the art of it right now but i do wish to learn the art of the sword.

#111988 - 05/31/04 09:58 PM Re: Blade tricks and skills
laf7773 Offline
Professional Poster

Registered: 05/05/04
Posts: 4065
Loc: Limbo
The problem comes with the fact that you are just in it for the fun. A bladed weapon isn't something you should just play around with. If you were only using a bokken then fine but you have already expressed the desire to use a live balde for your "fun". If you really want to get into the sword arts later try getting a couple of books and videos and learn the proper etiquette and basic postures for now. I don't advise trying to learn from a book or video but in your case it will be better than nothing.

#111989 - 06/01/04 09:11 AM Re: Blade tricks and skills
schanne Offline
breaks things

Registered: 02/18/04
Posts: 4370
Loc: Woodbury NJ
Silly rabbit, tricks are for kids.

#111990 - 06/01/04 05:30 PM Re: Blade tricks and skills

well.... at the risk of getting shunned.....i AM a kid. lol so i guess that means tricks are for me? not a little kid but still a kid

#111991 - 06/01/04 11:06 PM Re: Blade tricks and skills
Sir5cEntss Offline

Registered: 06/10/04
Posts: 10
Loc: CA
ha i'm only 17, too.

but a proper respect for an art which originated for killing is necessary...

you expressed a desire to learn this art; you'll soon learn that tricks and fancy spins, unless utilized by a master, are often foolish and meant to make up for a lack of can thank musashi for this little lesson. this guy is a sword-saint and he scoffed at tricks and spins...why would you waste time and energy spinning when you can chop the enemy down with half the effort and time?

read his book of five rings. its a good intro to sword-fighting, and a good guide for most masters as well.

#111992 - 06/01/04 11:16 PM Re: Blade tricks and skills
laf7773 Offline
Professional Poster

Registered: 05/05/04
Posts: 4065
Loc: Limbo
And who said wisdom is wasted on the elder. Thank you Sir5cEntss. Silly tricks only impress people uneducated in the arts.

#111993 - 06/08/04 03:05 AM Re: Blade tricks and skills
javaman Offline

Registered: 07/04/03
Posts: 179
Loc: calgary, alberta, canada
[QUOTE]Originally posted by laf7773:
The problem comes with the fact that you are just in it for the fun. A bladed weapon isn't something you should just play around with. If you were only using a bokken then fine but you have already expressed the desire to use a live balde for your "fun".[/QUOTE]

laf773, I hate to break it to you, but the only reason you should ever practice a sword art is for fun. Swords are useless in modern combat, and anyone who thinks that actual sword combat is "practical" in the modern world is a fool

Yes, sword arts do help with unarmed skills; hand-eye coordination, timing ect. but there are other ways to learn this, mainly practicing the unarmed arts dedicatedly.

Using a metal sword is completely reasonable to learn "tricks" provided it is a blunt blade, and some degree of safety precautions is taken. Note that just because a blade is not sharp, does not make it blunt, a blade that is merely blunt will still cut if swung hard and fast enough. Not just a minor scratch either, but usually a deep serious cut.

Mojo, try using one hand to swing your sword in a complete 360 degree vertical circle, cutting as close to your own side as possible, using only your wrist to control the blade.

Try switching sword hands or swithing grips behing your back, and then immediatly coming forward into some attack.

My main experience is with chinese and European sword arts. These two "tricks" I described above are considered to be very basic exercise by practioners of both these arts; whereas all practioners of Japanese sword arts I have met consider these to be useless tricks.

But these exercises are perfect for improving hand-eye coordination and timing: exactly what defenders of practicing sword arts say these arts do; but when I show them these, they are skeptical and arrogent about them. I suppose this reflects that practioners of Japanese arts (only the ones I have met though) can be arrogent and egotistiacal about the superiority of their arts. Which is just plain BS.

Mojo, learning impressive tricks and skills is one of the most fun aspects of learning a classical-weapons-based martial art. These tricks were usually not meant to be used in actual combat, but to improve basic handling and skill of the sword. And these tricks did that excedingly well.

just be sure to be carful and safe; and if someone gives you crap about how tricks are not useful in real sword combat, point out that swords are not useful in modern combat.

#111994 - 06/08/04 03:48 AM Re: Blade tricks and skills
jimp1969 Offline

Registered: 06/08/04
Posts: 64
Loc: Midlands UK
Javaman - I disagree.

'Tricks' with the sword are ok if you want to work in the circus, not for if you want to learn a martial art. Would you do 'tricks' when learning a martial art other than a sword art? Would any Aikido or Judo sensei worth their weight during a lesson let you do some 'tricks'?! I would hope not. And with a sword - certainly not, unsharpened or not.

And as to whether they improve your hand-eye co-ordination, perhaps they do - but that is not the point here surely as correct practice will do just the same, and just for the record - I take my Iai 'seriously', I enjoy it alright - but I certainly don't do it for 'fun'.

I can only tell you what I have learned from my Sensei - 'tricks' would never be recommended, encouraged or used even in practice when learning classic Iai...never.

You concur that other Japanese sword practitioners have told you that the tricks you describe are 'useless', but in Chinese and European fighting forms their use might be beneficial - but I have to agree with the other Japanese practitioners, when training in Iai, your tricks serve no purpose. But I assume that as you didn't listen to them - you will pay me the same compliment.

Mojo - stick to what is taught to you by a good sensei, leave the tricks for the 'showboaters'.

#111995 - 06/08/04 07:47 AM Re: Blade tricks and skills
laf7773 Offline
Professional Poster

Registered: 05/05/04
Posts: 4065
Loc: Limbo
When people do flashy tricks with a sword it only shows there ignorance of the art. Like i said before the system problems. Weapons training of any kind is still very usefull. It doesn't matter if you will never use the weapon in a self defense situation or not. Training with weapons improves your sense of distance and timing and therefore improves your empty had skills and vise versa. Weapons training can be fun but should always be taken very seriously.

#111996 - 06/08/04 09:47 AM Re: Blade tricks and skills
cxt Offline
Professional Poster

Registered: 09/11/03
Posts: 5843
Loc: USA

Swords, bokken, bo, kama, clubs, guns, knives, etc.

If it can injure or kill you or others you should not be "playing" with it or doing "tricks" with it.

Weapons of ANY sort are NOT toys and should not be "played" with.

If you don't understand that you should not be handeling weapons.

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