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#109823 - 03/10/03 06:41 PM Re: Professional Conflict
Jamoni Offline
Veteran

Registered: 01/17/03
Posts: 1514
Loc: St. Louis, MO, USA
Well, in those regards, the US press is probably the worst. They are like a bunch of fourteen year old girls: Did you hear about... OHMYGAWDIKNOW! And then he... NO! HE DIDN"T! TOTALLY he DID!
Still, if not them, who?

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#109824 - 03/11/03 03:42 AM Re: Professional Conflict
Cato Offline
Veteran

Registered: 10/13/02
Posts: 1636
Sorry, Ashton - I forgot to add a reply to you. I think the media are becoming more intrusive over here in general, and it is quite frightening to realise that most of the press is run by a very small group of business men with their own interests to safeguard. Sadly, the police are seen as a legitimate means through which to attack the government, and if the government is unpopular the police get a slagging.

On an individuaL level we are only now having to face up to something you guys have had to put up with for years - civil litigation. It is now very popular in the UK to try to sue police officers, mainly fuelled by the number of "no win, no fee" solicitors knocking on people's doors. This generates a lot of negative press for the service and makes for a good story. The fact that the poor bobby gets exonerated doesn't usually warrant a mention.

As for firearms, we are one of the few police services that does not routinely arm. We have Armed Response Vehicles and Authorised Firearm Officers but authority to arm is only ever given reluctantly. As a point of interest, I am a dog handler and often work alongside AFO's, but I am not allowed to carry a firearm myself, because I have to be responsible for my dog. We put forward the argument of having a sidearm for personal protection and have been told we have a dog for that. So now you know, GSD's are officially bulletproof. It's nice to be valued.

Budo

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#109825 - 03/11/03 10:07 PM Re: Professional Conflict
Jamoni Offline
Veteran

Registered: 01/17/03
Posts: 1514
Loc: St. Louis, MO, USA
Cato, if it's any consolation, I live in the ghetto. I own both dogs and guns. people here just laugh if you pull out a gun, but they are scared SHITLESS of dogs. We own four dogs, and they keep my place safer than a yard full of guns ever could.

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#109826 - 03/12/03 10:49 AM Re: Professional Conflict
Ashton Offline
Member

Registered: 02/21/03
Posts: 54
Loc: Nope
Cato, thank you for the response....I was always curious about armed police in the UK. Jamoni, you hit the nail on the head, folks will taunt you and say "Go head, you ain't gonna pull the trigger !" But, show them your dogs and they crap their pants. I own two boxers and a pitbull. Sorry, I can't take the incessant shedding of the GSD (not that they are not great dogs,they are). I happen to love a medium size dog with heart. I like anything with mastiff or bulldog in it. Folks know that a reasonable person, with something to lose is not going to drop the hammer or lay their hands on them, but will let their dogs out on them if need be. Had a "prowler" once outside the house, let the dogs out....held him until I could render a good swift kick to the ass with a warning never to return. Ahhh, martial arts, guns and dogs, gotta love'em.

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#109827 - 03/22/03 03:46 PM Re: Professional Conflict
Ashton Offline
Member

Registered: 02/21/03
Posts: 54
Loc: Nope
Hey, just curious guys....seems like everyone who has been in this particular post is in the law enforcement/security/military field (I am taking a guess). What art/arts do you guys study ? And I know it's a little off track, but if you have a dog (for home security/pet, what breed do you have ? And if you are in the US or a country where fireams are permitted,what is your favorite home defense weapon ? Again, I am just curious. Thank you for induldging my inquiries. Just gathering info and opinions.

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#109828 - 03/22/03 06:24 PM Re: Professional Conflict
Jamoni Offline
Veteran

Registered: 01/17/03
Posts: 1514
Loc: St. Louis, MO, USA
Ashton, I don't know what the heck my dogs are. Pound puppies, each and every one. They are healthier, smarter, (and cheaper) than most mixed breeds (unless you personally know the breeder and their standards). As far as favorite home defense weapon? Pound puppies. After that, It's a Smith and Wesson .357. I like revolvers cause they are simple, foolproof, and mainly cause the only other gun I own is a Ruger 10/22. Given my choice, though, I'd get a bare basics 12 gauge shotgun. Still, your best option is the dogs, an alarm, well lit exterior, and get to be good friends with your neighbors.
Right now I practice Bagua and Escrima.

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#109829 - 03/23/03 10:47 PM Re: Professional Conflict
Ashton Offline
Member

Registered: 02/21/03
Posts: 54
Loc: Nope
Thanks for the response, Jamoni. I, too utilize a .357 revolver, a Speed-Six Ruger for home defense, it was inexpensive and the revolver is the most reliable, especially under stress and still has some of the best "knock down" power. Sadly, I cruise through the local animal shelter, even though I have plenty of dog at home, it is a shame, there are so many good dogs needing a home there.

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#109830 - 03/24/03 12:23 AM Re: Professional Conflict
joesixpack Offline
Professional Poster

Registered: 02/04/02
Posts: 2282
Loc: Australia
Are modern autoloading pistols that unrealiable? .357, Magnum especially, seems like a good cailber to me. With the magnum, I don't think you'd get the horror stories of some cokehead whacked up on PCP walking into the hail of bullets, unlike the 9mm parabellum. Also, how true are thse tales?

I suppose if the revolver stops working, at least you can throw it or hit them with it.

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#109831 - 03/24/03 10:14 AM Re: Professional Conflict
Ashton Offline
Member

Registered: 02/21/03
Posts: 54
Loc: Nope
I would not want to get konked on the head by an empty revolver thrown at me, that might just hurt a little. Seriously, my opinion and it is just an opinion, I am not professing to know everthing, well almost everything [IMG]http://www.fightingarts.com/forums/ubb/smile.gif[/IMG] A .22 caliber shot in the right spot beats getting winged by a .44 magnum. My experience is that as a cop there has never been an instance that I was outgunned because I had a revolver, and when we switched to auto-loaders, I did not get any more of a boost of confidence. If you are a professional that carries a firearm in your line of work, just like martial arts philosophy, your best weapon is tactics and that thing between your ears, not just placing all of your eggs in one basket or in this case, one holster. Your training is your advantage on a badguy. It's true in martial arts, too. Just while recently qualifying on the range, I have seen officers "limp wrist" their guns, causing jams, stove pipes and a whole host of problems never experienced by revolver use. A solution is that they should practice more, they won't, the emphasis on policing at least around my parts is that firearms qualifying is just done so the insurance companies are happy that you're now an instant "expert". No time for correcting problems...how'd you like to be on the street with one of those guys backing you up ? Many veteran officers have to go through qualification three times to make minimum score for passing. Some even hold rank. One guy, a "golden boy" shot himself in the hand off-duty...swept under the proverbial rug. His local police looked into it, but no remedial classes, disciplinary action or investigation ! What if he accidentally discharges on duty and kills someone ? Not that qualifying is an opportunity to correct your bad habits and polish up on your shooting skills.

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#109832 - 03/24/03 10:28 PM Re: Professional Conflict
Jamoni Offline
Veteran

Registered: 01/17/03
Posts: 1514
Loc: St. Louis, MO, USA
It's not that automatics are unreliable, it's that for the same money, a revolver is MORE reliable. I paid $300 for my .357. You won't get much of an auto for that. Also, less levers and crap to fumble in an emergency, ESPECIALLY IF YOU DON'T TRAIN AS MUCH AS YOU SHOULD. Plus, they LOOK the business. Ever hear a .357 in close quarters? Intimidating, to say the least.
In summary: Cheaper, more reliable, easier to use. Downside: Ammo capacity.
As far as caliber, more people die from .22 LR than any other round. Usually in the hospital, and often after they've killed or injured their opponent. If you use anything that small, a head shot is mandatory. .357? Well, they fall down real quick, no matter where you get em.

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