I Hate College

Posted by: Eric4444

I Hate College - 10/23/06 04:21 PM

Did anyone else hate college?
I'm miserable, it's absolutely terrible.
I'm actually not sure what's worse, dealing with college stupidity or being stereotyped by older adults who think I contribute to the college stupidity.

My room mate makes me sick. He's a stuck up materialistic rich kid. All he cares about is buying new and expensive things (all with his parents money) and getting into the latest gossip of who's dating who and who's cheating on who.

Every night I'm kept up until at least 1 am by the idiots on my floor making a ruckus.
All they care about is partying and having "fun." And of course by fun I mean act like an idiot.

The worse night is Thursday, which is "College Night" at all the local clubs and bars. For some reason, every single one of them KNOWINGLY serves alcohol to underaged drinkers.
On these nights I get to deal with everyone coming home at 4am screaming and hollering in their drunken fits. If I dare to open my door and ask everyone standing in the hall to please quiet down I'm bombarded with insults and usually have to slam my door shut as they try to push their way in screaming at me.

All of my professors are liberally biased. In my current events and politics class we're required to read and talk about articles in the New York Times. I hardly enjoy getting my information from the biggest secular progressive newspaper in the country.

Oh, and it doesn't help that I hate my business major and definetly need to change it (probably to writing).

I know one of the things you're suppose to learn during college life is how to "deal" with people, but I hardly plan on living my life surrounded by drunken, immature, idiotic imbeciles.
Posted by: oldman

Re: I Hate College - 10/23/06 04:25 PM

Quote:

I hardly plan on living my life surrounded by drunken, immature, idiotic imbeciles.



So you spend your free time here?
Posted by: Joss

Re: I Hate College - 10/23/06 04:34 PM

First time through, I was one of your drunken dorm mates. Second, I was married, GI Bill, working and lots more committed.

Rather than remain so actively miserable, look for some things you might change. Maybe change your dorm, or your floor or room. Go find out who makes the decisions about this and plead health and grades in a quiet serious manner. Also look around and see if there is a BB where people looking to trade roommates leave that info. Sometimes, even if the dorms are all full they will allow people to switch if they want.

Drunks look for sober people to tease. I always did. Try not to be such a desperate obvious target. Be quieter, smaller, less obvious.

See if anyone else wants to go in on an apartment next semester.... though that has other drawbacks of its own.

Maybe you need about 4 years off and some money saved up. Coming back, it will be more on your own terms. See your recruiter.
Posted by: harlan

Re: I Hate College - 10/23/06 04:39 PM

I love learning...but have a low tolerance for institutional education. If you break up the things that bother you, you can deal with them.

No privacy? See if you can get a library carrel. It is a great way to get work done.

Problems with roommate...ask for mediation. Act like you are interested in trying to get along (even if you are not).

Liberal bias? Sounds like you are stuck on this one. Do the work...and get out with a degree.

Social issues: the trickiest aspect of living in on campus...getting along with jerks. Using the system in place (do nothing RA's, alcohol policies, etc.) can get you in more of a bind.
Posted by: UofM Shorin Ryu

Re: I Hate College - 10/23/06 05:15 PM

Suck it up, keep your head up, and quit bitching. Everyone goes through rough patches.

I had almost the exact same problems my first year and a half. Crappy roommate, crappy dorm hall, loud noises, and no friggin clue what I was doing in terms of my education.

In fact, my hall was so bad, the assistant director for University Housing had to come talk to the hall as a whole, and reported that our hall had the most alcohol related incidents than any other on campus.

And of course, 1/2 my hallmates showed up to that meeting drunk!

1 am bedtimes would have been a blessing Freshman year. I was lucky if I got sleep, regardless of when it was.

And Thursday's are still "Thirsty Thursday's" here at U of M too.

Christ, even my CURRENT roommate is a jackass. Doesn't do dishes, plays loud music all night long, prone to violence, short-tempered, and inconsiderate. All my friends are wondering why I haven't beaten the living crap out of him yet (I do have a high tolerance and patience level though...)

U of M has several liberal professors. In fact, I don't think I've had one that isn't.....

Doesn't mean they're no good. You need to open your mind up more, that's what school is all about, learning what OTHER people think, not just sticking to your own damned opinions.

If you don't like your major, change it! End of story.

And I don't plan on being surrounded by drunk college frat guys either. Hopefully the majority will grow out of that phase.

Point is, you aren't the only one out there experiencing these things, but they aren't bitching. I'm not bitching, cause I'm out DOING SOMETHING about it. I just failed my first mid-term ever in college. Did I cry, complain, moan? Nope. I went out and had a beer to celebrate!!

Why? Cause I know that I learn best from mistakes, and I'm not always gonna do spectacular on tests. Plus, ain't nothing like a party to cheer ya up!!

You gotta problem? Solve it, don't bitch about it!

And if you think I'm being a little mean and harsh....GOOD!

I think what you need is a swift kick in the ass to get you on the right direction. Moping around all depressed and dejected is gonna get you nowhere. I've already tried that, it doesn't work.

So get yourself a beer, and get crackin on makin college what is SHOULD be! Take an ACTIVE stance on the college experience, and start MAKING it fun and enjoyable. Do what you can, alter or change things that are in your control (which is about half your rant), and don't worry about things you can't. What's the point? You've only got so much time to be a drunken mess, running around the streets at 4 am on a Wednesday night before REALITY checks in and makes you realize the drugeries of adulthood is around the corner.

You're a kid, just like me. Start acting your age!
Posted by: Dereck

Re: I Hate College - 10/23/06 05:21 PM

Yup, that sounds about right for all of my friends that went to College/University/Trade Schools. It takes sometimes a year for many to settle down before they get serious about things ... mainly because they get poor grades and there parents get ticked at them for spending their money but not living up to their end of the bargan.

I never went to College but did do "1" day at the University of Alberta which I had planned on becoming an Accountant. Auditorium class rooms, 100's of people, that was enough for me and I dropped out after a day just enough to get a full refund. I always told myself I'd go back again but I never did. My work put me through school at N.A.I.T. (North American Institute of Technology) and I did night classes to get the beginning of a Marketing degree. Working full time and then doing 2 classes a week plus homework every night including weekends was hell on earth and thankfully I got out of the schooling that I needed for my job so did not have to finish the degree ... but it is nice to have this information for my resume. Thankfully they paid for it, my mileage and parking for the whole time I was there. They were more then happy when I came out with an above 80% average.

I don't envy you Eric but try to make the best of it. See if you can be moved somewhere else and if not, do little things to pay these people back ... a couple of fire alarms will do the trick when they are trying to sleep. (joking of course).

EDIT:

I just read the post before mine ... no, I don't buy this. Don't ever change who you are just to fit in. Live by your standards especially if they are good standards. Too many people who go to school end up with degrees they can't use or never use or drop out all together. And then there are those that complain because they did get their degree but can't get a job not realizing that others had that same degree, did better then them and had good standards that carried over into their adult life. Going to school guarantees you nothing ... it is what you do with yourself there and in life in general that does. It is okay to kick back once in a while to relieve stress but too many are doing this all of the time taking the free ride. Free ride gets you a job at McDonalds!

Get the hard things in life out of the way earlier on so that when you reach adulthood you can enjoy life. There will always be hard thing throughout life to deal with but you might as well make them easier when you are older. Myself, I enjoy life a lot more now as I've gotten settled more, have a wife and daughter, own my house, have a good paying job with great benefits and have many toys. Isn't that what we all strive for?
Posted by: Cord

Re: I Hate College - 10/23/06 05:47 PM

Quote:

My room mate makes me sick. He's a stuck up materialistic rich kid. All he cares about is buying new and expensive things (all with his parents money) and getting into the latest gossip of who's dating who and who's cheating on who.



This sounds a little like envy to me. His upbringing is not his fault- he didn't choose high earning parents, nor should you look down on him for being affluent.

Quote:

Every night I'm kept up until at least 1 am by the idiots on my floor making a ruckus.
All they care about is partying and having "fun." And of course by fun I mean act like an idiot.



Ear plugs

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The worse night is Thursday, which is "College Night" at all the local clubs and bars. For some reason, every single one of them KNOWINGLY serves alcohol to underaged drinkers.
On these nights I get to deal with everyone coming home at 4am screaming and hollering in their drunken fits.



Sounds like fun- ever thought about joining them? One night a week is hardly going to turn you into Barney from the Simpsons

Quote:

If I dare to open my door and ask everyone standing in the hall to please quiet down I'm bombarded with insults and usually have to slam my door shut as they try to push their way in screaming at me.



The majority rules. Thats democracy. As the minority party, expecting all others to capitulate to your wishes is more selfish than what you percieve as their selfishness. Ask your student liason office if there are any designated 'quiet' dorms that you could be assigned to.

Quote:

All of my professors are liberally biased. In my current events and politics class we're required to read and talk about articles in the New York Times. I hardly enjoy getting my information from the biggest secular progressive newspaper in the country.



So not only do you want all around you to go to bed at a time of your choosing, you also want everyone in your politics class to be in line with your viewpoint. Why not just stick on some jackboots and start a new world order? Failing that you could see the chance to introduce differing opinions into such an environment as a wonderful opertunity to test, and have opinion tested in a lively knowledgeable environment.

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Oh, and it doesn't help that I hate my business major and definetly need to change it (probably to writing).



Why are you typing on here when you could be changing things in your favour already?

Quote:

I know one of the things you're suppose to learn during college life is how to "deal" with people, but I hardly plan on living my life surrounded by drunken, immature, idiotic imbeciles.



Lighten up. College is not about 'coping' or 'dealing' with people, its about new experiences, testing the boundaries of your new found freedoms,challenging what you think and believe as much as the beliefs of others, being young, and learning the hard way.
Some of these 'imbeciles' could end up as friends, colleagues or even your bosses in the future. Having a stick up your a$$ is not an indication that you will be more successful than these people.

Stop being so damn judgmental and give them a chance.
Posted by: UofM Shorin Ryu

Re: I Hate College - 10/23/06 05:52 PM

Quote:



I just read the post before mine ... no, I don't buy this. Don't ever change who you are just to fit in.





Dereck:

I think either you misinterpreted my post or I did a lousy job explaining myself.

I'm not asking to change yourself, I'm telling him to change his situation to conform to HIS standards, rather than everyone else's.

I AM one of those people going for the "pointless" degree I'll probably never use, never make money off of. And I won't change that for anyone, cause that's what I enjoy in school, (Classic Civ).

I haven't changed much, I'm stubborn in my ways. But I'm also not sitting around moping about the bad day I had, or how crappy my current siituation is.

I don't like my roommate, so I avoid him whenever possible. That's not me changing my ideals or standards, that's changing the situation to conform to MY ideals.

I told him to have a beer because it's infinitely more productive than complaining. I'm not telling him to become the drunk jerks he hates, I'm telling him to loosen up a bit.

Essentially, I'm not saying anything different from what Joss said

Quote:


Drunks look for sober people to tease. I always did. Try not to be such a desperate obvious target. Be quieter, smaller, less obvious.




I AM kind of put off by your comment here:

Quote:



Too many people who go to school end up with degrees they can't use or never use





Dereck:


So what?

I'll be real honest with you, I probably won't use my degree at all post graduation.

But there's no way in hell I'd change it just because of that. I like it too damned much.

Would you tell me to change my major because I won't use it?

I'm hoping not, because then I would be very confused, because on the one hand your advise is to be yourself, while on the other it is to change the major you may never use....maybe I'm misinterpreting what you wrote here, please clarify for me.....

NO offense meant by anything I've written in either post, I'm just offering my experiences and opinions on the said subject.
Posted by: Ed_Morris

Re: I Hate College - 10/23/06 06:06 PM

I agree. grow and adapt. I didn't know what I wanted at first and changed my major twice. lots of changes in a person during those college years....roll with it.
Posted by: Dereck

Re: I Hate College - 10/23/06 06:16 PM

UofM ... thanks for explaining more as I did misinterpret it. Most certainly make the best of your situation but don't ever compromise your standards. Do what you can to change the situation and if you can't then make the best of it.

As far as your question about your degree, most certainly continue with it if that is what you want and love. I was refering more to people that coasted through school to try to get a degree and then once in the market place realized that they wasted their time and it was for not. That they took something because their buddies were or what somebody else thought best for them or that they did not put the time and effort into it to take advantage of it so that the degree meant more to them and their potential employers.

Sometime life doesn't work out to what you want and you make decisions later in life. What I've found with many people I know personally that went to secondary school is that they did not think things through of what they really wanted to do and they just wasted time being wasted and took a free ride on their parents and many with scholarships that they blew. That I find is wrong. For yourself your degree may be expanding your love and understanding, thus broadening your horizons, and therefore though you won't have a career doing it, it is something that you probably will use someway or another. Nothing wrong with that at all ... and you are going into this well knowing this ... no surprises.

Thankfully many people grow up and mature enough to make something of themselves and obtain a good life or even a fantastic life. I just have no pity for the person who whines and complains about going to school and having a degree and having a crumby job but he/she wasted that valuable time and is doing nothing to make their life better. Of course I'm sure there are people who still whine and complain and did put the time and effort in but hopefully these people realize sometime in their life to pick up their feet and move on and try something else.

Probably put my foot into my mouth deeper.
Posted by: UofM Shorin Ryu

Re: I Hate College - 10/23/06 06:34 PM

Dereck, thanks for clarifying. We're definitely on the same page here, just took a while to spit the words out correctly. The Downside of internet conversations unfortunately....

Quote:



I was refering more to people that coasted through school to try to get a degree and then once in the market place realized that they wasted their time and it was for not.





That's what I thought, just wanted to make sure first.

I think people who feel they've wasted their time just aren't using all the resources available to them. They're hungry, staring at a steak, fork, and knife and lamenting their hunger instead of eating!

I have a friend who has an engineering degree because his parents wanted him to do it. He then graduated, and immediately went to firefighting school. Graduated that, and is now the leader/co-leader of the non-profit I'm apart of.

He doesn't regret doing his parents will, because he made the most out of it. 2 friends he met while in engineering school are also apart of our little non-profit org, and great friends.

The people who do regret stuff just don't know how to use what they've got, IMO....

I believe hard work and effort will always yield a positive result. Maybe not the EXPECTED result (people who don't use their degrees for work or salary), but if they apply it properly, that experience can never be wasted (example above with non-profit group).

My 2 drachma.
Posted by: Eric4444

Re: I Hate College - 10/23/06 07:09 PM

Wow, those are a lot of replies to respond to.

Let me try and start from the beginning, my apologies if I miss something.

UofM Shorin Ryu, I DO NOT drink. NO drinking, no smoking, no drugs, no sex. I don't care if it's one drop of an alcoholic beverage, I will not even taste it.
I have NO interest in acting like a fool for the sake of acting like a fool. These four years of my life, even though I'm in college, are still four years of my life. I'm going to get the most out of them.
I agree with harlan, I like education, hate the institutions. I'm going to make the most out of these four years in a POSITIVE way, not a crazy party and beer way.

I don't consider myself to have a stick up my ass (Cord
) I'm just different from most kids my age I guess.

I would rather be reading Shakespeare or 1776, or watching Fox News than "hanging" out and talking about girls and stupid television shows like South Park.

Back to UofM, I'm not moping around depressed at all, I'm just [censored] off and damn sick of this. I want to be doing something with my life and I feel like it's being wasted away with a few hours of classes combined with trying to deal with the hooligans living around me.
Cord, there is no jealousy. I like buying things, I like nice clothes, techno stuff, etc. However, I realize that I don't NEED these things unlike him.

As for people keeping me up, how can you say I'm selfish? Quiet hours start at 10PM. At that time there is suppose to be no noise.
Coming in drunk as a skunk and screaming and hollering when others are trying to sleep is selfish. I don't see wanting to sleep at 4am when I have an 8:30 class as being selfish at all. I don't see how in the world it's selfish to want to go to bed at a reasonable hour.

I'm not asking for all classes to be in line with my political views but I also don't want my views to have to be lies. I have to lie and say I support this liberal crap or that ACLU thing to get a good grade.

Most importantly, I never said I was just sitting on my ass and complaining. I am trying to get things done, but there is only so much I can do.

I don't know, I'm starting to think college just isn't right for me now.
I'm thinking about finishing this year, working part time all the way through, and then working full time next summer, then in the fall taking my money and backpacking through Europe, or maybe joining the Peace Corps.
I just feel like I'm meant for something more important than what I'm doing now.
Posted by: 5353

Re: I Hate College - 10/23/06 08:21 PM

suck it up and deal because tou'll have to deal with people like that all your life nomatter which field you chose and especially if you are your own boss.
Posted by: Cord

Re: I Hate College - 10/24/06 05:57 AM

Quote:

I DO NOT drink. NO drinking, no smoking, no drugs, no sex. I don't care if it's one drop of an alcoholic beverage, I will not even taste it.... These four years of my life, even though I'm in college, are still four years of my life. I'm going to get the most out of them.



Erm, OK, if you say so.


Quote:

I don't consider myself to have a stick up my ass (Cord
) I'm just different from most kids my age I guess.



There is nothing wrong with not wishing to party- there is something wrong with seeing people who choose to party as inferior to you. I am an ex smoker, ex drug abuser, and now only drink alcohol on 5 days of the year- thats closer to 'straight edge' than many clergy I have known!
I do not sit in judgement over those who make personal choices that differ to mine. I will never be one of those ex smokers who scrunches their face up and makes some comment if someone lights up next to me in a bar- their lungs, their business. If I dont want the smoke, I step back. Live and let live.

Quote:

I would rather be reading Shakespeare or 1776, or watching Fox News than "hanging" out and talking about girls and stupid television shows like South Park.



Are you sure? Such anger towards things usually comes from repression. Are your choices based in religious beliefs? maybe an uber-strict upbringing? i only ask because your whole demeanour is as if your lifestyle is being threatened in some way by others going about the process of growing up and having fun. If your lifestyle really is your lifestyle, and not one imposed upon you, then you should be more secure in it, and derive more pleasure from it. If such restrictions have been placed upon you, then all I can say is that you only have one life, and you must live it feeling comfortable in your own skin.


Quote:

Cord, there is no jealousy. I like buying things, I like nice clothes, techno stuff, etc. However, I realize that I don't NEED these things unlike him.



How long have you been at college now? weeks? Days? Give the guy a chance.

Quote:

As for people keeping me up, how can you say I'm selfish? Quiet hours start at 10PM. At that time there is suppose to be no noise.



A large group of teenagers, away from home for the first time, with a 10pm curfew- did you really think that would be obeyed when you read it for the first time? Most colleges have 'mature students'-adults who have returned to education later in life. Ask if they have seperate dorms, and request transfer- life will be more sedate over there, but dont be suprised if it is not completely party free.

Quote:

Coming in drunk as a skunk and screaming and hollering when others are trying to sleep is selfish. I don't see wanting to sleep at 4am when I have an 8:30 class as being selfish at all. I don't see how in the world it's selfish to want to go to bed at a reasonable hour.



If there are others not happy with the situation, band together and approach the college with a complaint.

Quote:

I'm not asking for all classes to be in line with my political views but I also don't want my views to have to be lies. I have to lie and say I support this liberal crap or that ACLU thing to get a good grade.



Are you sure? or is that the impression you are getting. Talk frankly with your tutor about your concerns. Maybe your low grade is not based on differing opinion, but rather that you just wrote a bad paper.

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I don't know, I'm starting to think college just isn't right for me now.



Your issues go wider than college, and will travel with you wherever you go. Deal with them now, dont run away.

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I'm thinking about finishing this year, working part time all the way through, and then working full time next summer, then in the fall taking my money and backpacking through Europe



Oh great idea The backpacking crowd hate to party- you are sure to enjoy nothing but peace and quiet as you enjoy not chatting up the hot women in Paris, not sampling the fine beers in Belgium, not going to the cafe's in Amsterdam, not clubbing the night away in Germany.

There is a whole world out there just waiting to be ignored and scowled at by you, and thousands of people for you to look down upon and not make friends with. Go get em tiger!

Quote:

I just feel like I'm meant for something more important than what I'm doing now.



Ever think that you might be limiting your chances of finding your true calling in life by following such a hard line on things? Stranger things have turned out to be true in this world.
Posted by: crablord

Re: I Hate College - 10/24/06 06:11 AM

I havnt read any of this topic other than cords post, but from those quotes dude...you suck lol. You need to have a beer, play some video games, and go partying. Then post back and tell us how cool life is
Posted by: jonwade

Re: I Hate College - 10/24/06 07:16 AM

When in Rome.......

I must admit, I did not enjoy my first year at uni (although it was acedemic problems and having my house burgled that got me down, not the wild parties) but it was then that I started kung-fu. That saved me really. Still, only spent one year in Preston before going to Coventry. THe parties were even better, but the kung-fu clubs were a disappointment. That was in 1992, so hopefully kung-fu in Cov has improved since then.

Anyway, chill out, get drunk (remember that the law is only a guideline for drinking, it is assumed that those that are mature enough to decide to start drinking earlier are responsible enough to do so), ask your rich room mate to take you out for a drink. Tell him material things do not matter, only fuelling the spirit with beer is important.

Cheers,

Jon.
Posted by: ANDY44

Re: I Hate College - 10/24/06 08:22 AM

Quote:

Wow, those are a lot of replies to respond to.

Let me try and start from the beginning, my apologies if I miss something.

UofM Shorin Ryu, I DO NOT drink. NO drinking, no smoking, no drugs, no sex. I don't care if it's one drop of an alcoholic beverage, I will not even taste it.
I have NO interest in acting like a fool for the sake of acting like a fool. These four years of my life, even though I'm in college, are still four years of my life. I'm going to get the most out of them.
I agree with harlan, I like education, hate the institutions. I'm going to make the most out of these four years in a POSITIVE way, not a crazy party and beer way.




Good way of thinking. I presume you are doing a degree?
If so and I was in your position I would try to get the highest degree you can. In this country (UK) a 2/1 is considered the norm.
Quote:



I don't consider myself to have a stick up my ass (Cord
) I'm just different from most kids my age I guess.



NO neither would I based on what you put on here.And why are you considerd different? Just because you dont have vises doesnt mean you are different.

Quote:


I would rather be reading Shakespeare or 1776, or watching Fox News than "hanging" out and talking about girls and stupid television shows like South Park.



Nothing wrong with that.
Quote:



Back to UofM, I'm not moping around depressed at all, I'm just [censored] off and damn sick of this. I want to be doing something with my life and I feel like it's being wasted away with a few hours of classes combined with trying to deal with the hooligans living around me.



Then avoid the hooligans some how and try to study hard.

Quote:


Cord, there is no jealousy. I like buying things, I like nice clothes, techno stuff, etc. However, I realize that I don't NEED these things unlike him.



Fine
Quote:



As for people keeping me up, how can you say I'm selfish? Quiet hours start at 10PM. At that time there is suppose to be no noise.
Coming in drunk as a skunk and screaming and hollering when others are trying to sleep is selfish. I don't see wanting to sleep at 4am when I have an 8:30 class as being selfish at all. I don't see how in the world it's selfish to want to go to bed at a reasonable hour.



Fine but if you cant sleep then see if you can move rooms somewhere quieter.

Quote:


I'm not asking for all classes to be in line with my political views but I also don't want my views to have to be lies. I have to lie and say I support this liberal crap or that ACLU thing to get a good grade.



Isnt the idea of assignments for a degree about stating both sides to an argument ?

Quote:



Most importantly, I never said I was just sitting on my ass and complaining. I am trying to get things done, but there is only so much I can do.

I don't know, I'm starting to think college just isn't right for me now.
I'm thinking about finishing this year, working part time all the way through, and then working full time next summer, then in the fall taking my money and backpacking through Europe, or maybe joining the Peace Corps.
I just feel like I'm meant for something more important than what I'm doing now.



If what you are saying is based on other peoples effects on you then I would suggest you ignore them the best way you can and focus on getting the highest degree you are capable of. Meanwhile I think Old Man made a good suggestion.

Drink drugs and smoking, no body needs them. I smoked once soon gave it up. Drink did some in the past not for long though. Now I dont bother. Drugs? NO Way I would ever touch them.

All in all if you have the chance of a good degree which will lead to well paid employment I would do just that.

What other people do is up to them. Either you can be a part of it or not.
Posted by: ANDY44

Re: I Hate College - 10/24/06 08:23 AM

Quote:

I havnt read any of this topic other than cords post, but from those quotes dude...you suck lol. You need to have a beer, play some video games, and go partying. Then post back and tell us how cool life is



Posted by: crablord

Re: I Hate College - 10/24/06 08:27 AM

Whats the problem andy? dont like having fun or something
Posted by: harlan

Re: I Hate College - 10/24/06 08:33 AM

Guys: let's keep this on topic...and not get personal.
Posted by: ANDY44

Re: I Hate College - 10/24/06 08:40 AM

Quote:

Whats the problem andy? dont like having fun or something




Crablord I think if the guy says he doesnt want to party then I dont think he wants to party. If he did he would have said so.
Yeah I like having fun in fact Im off down the gym to lift lots of very heavy weigths and then Im off for a run.
I might consider drinking after that but because I dont drink (very seldom) I wont.
And no doubt you will suggest I do.



Keep on topic and off of personal attacks
-joel
Posted by: MattJ

Re: I Hate College - 10/24/06 11:09 AM

Quote by Eric4444 -

Quote:

I have to lie and say I support this liberal crap or that ACLU thing to get a good grade.



That is very unsettling to me. Why do you feel the need to lie about your positions? Support your views with facts and make a case for your side if you truly beleive in it. Sticking to your morals and views is a very important life lesson that seems not be getting through here.
Posted by: harlan

Re: I Hate College - 10/24/06 11:16 AM

Getting through college is viewed as part of a larger socialization process. Learning, and conforming...and depending on the college/professor/topic there may be more pressure to conform. It is well known where I work/went to college...that you give the answer the professor wants to hear in order to get through the course...and that may very well include regurgitating political POV.
Posted by: Eric4444

Re: I Hate College - 10/24/06 11:40 AM

Yes, if anyone wants to pass you need to stick to the same ideas as the professor, we all learned this early on.
I guess I did come off earlier as kind of sounding like an ass, I apologize.
And Cord, I do like doing all of the things I mentioned, trust me, my parents think I'm as weird as everyone else lol
The reason I get so mad, is I look at all the problems we have in the world. Then I look at the selfishness of all the kids in college. They need to be learning what's going on in the world so they can learn what they can be doing to help it.
I'm saying for people to pack up and head over to Sudan, that's crazy, but nobody in my entire Global issues class new anything about what was happening in Darfur.
Maybe if they spent a few less nights going crazy and drinking the night away they would be able to learn things like this.
I just don't consider college a time to waste your life away partying. My Dad does nothing but spend hours and hours of his day in a bar, and even he says people shouldn't drink in college ( he didn't even go).
There's so much we could all be doing.
Posted by: Cord

Re: I Hate College - 10/24/06 11:43 AM

Quote:

It is well known where I work/went to college...that you give the answer the professor wants to hear in order to get through the course...and that may very well include regurgitating political POV.



That is shocking to me. Very different to the university culture in the UK.
Posted by: rideonlythelabel

Re: I Hate College - 10/24/06 11:52 AM

Quote:

Getting through college is viewed as part of a larger socialization process. Learning, and conforming...and depending on the college/professor/topic there may be more pressure to conform. It is well known where I work/went to college...that you give the answer the professor wants to hear in order to get through the course...and that may very well include regurgitating political POV.



That's too broad a generalization. While it's true that some professors will only give you a good grade if you agree with them, some will give you a good grade as long as you substantiate your answers.
Posted by: harlan

Re: I Hate College - 10/24/06 11:55 AM

I think I had enough qualifiers in my statement to keep it from being a generalization. I said, 'where I work'. Also, 'depending on the college/professor/topic there may be more pressure to conform'.
Posted by: MattJWife

Re: I Hate College - 10/24/06 11:57 AM

Quote by Eric4444

Quote:

don't know, I'm starting to think college just isn't right for me now.
I'm thinking about finishing this year, working part time all the way through, and then working full time next summer, then in the fall taking my money and backpacking through Europe, or maybe joining the Peace Corps.
I just feel like I'm meant for something more important than what I'm doing now.



In reading your post, this is the first topic in which I felt compelled to respond. I am dishearted at your view on your 'life at college' right now. There are thousand upon thousands of people in this world who would love to have the opportunity in which you are having right now, no matter how 'horrible' it is.

I too went to college and had the "drunken roommates", the loud party hearty neighbors, 8AM classes on 1 hour sleep, but you know what? I sucked it up and thought to myself, this is my current reality and I made the best of it and found a way to make it liveable.

I too am not a drinker/partier, and was not into going to the clubs and acting "like an idiot." However, in college we are all adults and have the ability to make our own decisions wheather it be Shakespeare or Sam Adams. No one wants someone telling them what to do, nor should you allow them to dictate your experience.

Life happens so fast, and the 4 years of college (if you're lucky) are only a minute portion of it. No matter how 'horrible' it feels right now, it is an accomplishment that you can take all through life with you. At 30,40 hell even 80 years old, I can guarantee you will not proclaim "I wasted 4 years of my life in college." College is never a waste of time, no matter how boring or left winged the professor is. In your whole scheme of things Professor Joe Blow is a model of how to deal with someone else in your future. Tip: If you don't have to take political classes for your major: DON'T!

College is not just about learning the things that are written in your textbook, but about learning about yourself and how strong you really are.

Things that may seem like an easy way out, hardly ever are. You are the keeper of your own destiny, choose wisely.
Posted by: Eric4444

Re: I Hate College - 10/24/06 12:05 PM

Quote:

Quote:

It is well known where I work/went to college...that you give the answer the professor wants to hear in order to get through the course...and that may very well include regurgitating political POV.



That is shocking to me. Very different to the university culture in the UK.



I know, and that's one reason I put in an application to study abroad at the University of Westminster next fall.
Posted by: UofM Shorin Ryu

Re: I Hate College - 10/24/06 12:34 PM

Quote:



Yes, if anyone wants to pass you need to stick to the same ideas as the professor, we all learned this early on.





I learned the complete opposite....

Quote:


That's too broad a generalization. While it's true that some professors will only give you a good grade if you agree with them, some will give you a good grade as long as you substantiate your answers.



Wow, I've never had this problem in my 3 years of college....

In fact, I usually argue specifically against the professor because I think they grade me higher just for having the cahones to state a differing opinion....that and I'm very good at writing papers....

In fact, on the papers I DO agree on the professor with, I usually do worse, the major "red ink" statement being I am simply summarizing what the prof said and not stating my own viewpoint.....

Seems in my experience at least that opposing viewpoints or differing opinions are valued higher than regurgitation....and I've had some very liberal professors (one who absolutely refused to use the word "President" when talking about Bush. He simply referred to him as "the current occupant of the White House"...)

Quote:



I just don't consider college a time to waste your life away partying.





Then when should this stage in life occur? By your 20's, 30's, and 40's, you are dealing with a much harsher world. You aren't sheltered by your parents, you aren't sheltered by friends at school, and you have to go out and SURVIVE.

In college you are experiencing all the best things with very little responsabilities. I feel the exact opposite. I feel that if you aren't partying and aren't having a good time, then you're wasting what college is all about. Cuase I was a stickler and didn't party much my first few years, and it SUCKED! Felt like I wasted two years working hard when I could have enjoyed myself so much more. Cause guess what? The work is still there.

No matter how much I worked and worked and worked, there was always more work. So why worry about all the work there is, and let loose every once in a while?

The fact of the matter is that all those people you consider "idiots" or excessive party animals will be responsible adults, just like you. They may even end up being more successful than you. So who's "wasting" college then? The guy who worked constantly and had a good stable job and life, or the guy who partied and had a good stable job and life?

Choice is yours, but I've seen how fast life can hit you in the face, so I'm gonna live it up while I got the chance...

EDIT:

Wow! You even got Mrs. Administrator to post!! See what you did with those negative waves Eric?

Kick back and relax! That's an ORDER!
Posted by: Landus

Re: I Hate College - 10/24/06 12:59 PM

perhaps get some of those ear muffs, they should help you sleep!
Posted by: Cord

Re: I Hate College - 10/24/06 02:50 PM

In Britain degree's come in different grades- in order- highest to lowest:

1st
2/1
2/2
3rd
Pass

It has been shown through much consultation with large employers and industry organisations, that the grade of degree most attractive to employers is 2/2. It has been found that graduates who gain 2/2's in general have shown a grasp of work/life balance, and have developed social skills that prove essential in the workplace. Many who strive and gain 1st's stay within academic circles to further their research, and find the term 'over-qualified' used in many job rejection letters in the private sector.

Like it or not, it is those with a more relaxed attitude who are more likely to be in positions of influence and affluence to make the difference you intend to in the future.

And for goodness sake, dont transfer to the UK if you have a problem with the consumption of alcohol. Our entire social culture revolves around it, our laws allow us to start drinking younger, our beer is stronger, and every student in the land could drink your average frat boy under the table with one kidney tied behind their back
Posted by: trevek

Re: I Hate College - 10/24/06 04:11 PM

In England the general arts/soc sci degree is three years. In Scotland it can be 3-4 years, with an Honours system. Worth noting that a first degree in Scotland is often an MA(ord) or MA(hons). Not the same as a post-graduate MA.

Crazy thing, Cord. I got my First by slacking and being older than the average. Ironic I'd be considered a 'striver'.
Posted by: Cord

Re: I Hate College - 10/24/06 04:42 PM

there are always exceptions to every generalisation, but for most students, a 2/2 indicates that they have done enough work to get a respectable degree, but also had enough time to have some fun and get some life experience as well as book-smarts.

Eric's frst post on this thread could have been a voice over from a sequel to 'taxi driver' Nothing wrong with feeling at odds with the majority of the world- I know I am and have always been, but you have to focus on realistic ways in which to work within society and get what positives you can from it. Walking around with an aura of hatred and superiority that you aim at people for no other reason than they are different to you is exactly the intolerance and prejudice that leads to many of the worlds ills.
Posted by: Eric4444

Re: I Hate College - 10/24/06 05:06 PM

Oh no, I don't hate them or think I'm better than them at all, please excuse me if that's how I came across. It's more like I'm....mad...and disappointed in a sense.
I know I'm no where near perfect, not by a long shot. But I do my best to give up my time for a better education, and to help others.
When I think about how much more society could do for itself if everyone spent less time drinking, or sitting in front of the television all day, it really makes me mad.
I'm not saying I expect people to give up all their free time, I know I don't, I just wish people would give some of it, and most of all, just give a damn about someones life other than their own.
Posted by: Dereck

Re: I Hate College - 10/24/06 06:19 PM

Quote:

And for goodness sake, dont transfer to the UK if you have a problem with the consumption of alcohol. Our entire social culture revolves around it, our laws allow us to start drinking younger, our beer is stronger, and every student in the land could drink your average frat boy under the table with one kidney tied behind their back



How young is young? In Canada, legally in Alberta it is 18 years old and I believe BC and a few other Provinces it is 19. I've heard of places in the US that it is 21. I grew up in a family that drank all of the time so I must of inherited this gene as at one time I would drink 30+ ounces of Rum/Vodka easily in a night. Of course not in the last year or so due to medicication, injuries and training but it wasn't uncommon until my mid 30's to drink every weekend since I was 16 years old. Did get drunk when I was 15 but didn't like it too much so switched from beer about the age of 17 to real alcohol. Though our beer is far stronger then the beer in the United States.
Posted by: UofM Shorin Ryu

Re: I Hate College - 10/24/06 06:39 PM

It's 21 in the US. Yes, that means we can vote, smoke, and die for our country (military service), but can't sit down and relax with a beer!

Friggin sucks, but I'm happy I'm in Michigan.....cause Canada's only a 30 minute drive away from my hometown!!

Yay for Windsor!
Posted by: Eric4444

Re: I Hate College - 10/24/06 06:53 PM

Well if you ask me the United States needs another Prohibition, only it needs to be enforced much better this time around.
Smokingn needs to be made illegal as well.
Posted by: Eric4444

Re: I Hate College - 10/24/06 11:04 PM

I'm sitting here with a change of major form infront of me.

I'm afraid to fill it out though. I want to double major in Creative Writing and History. I don't know if I should do it though. I honestly don't think I'll be happy in business but I know it gives me a secure future.

I just keep thinking, "How in the world am I going to make a living with a writing and history degree?"

I don't need to be rich, but I like travelling, and I don't want to be struggling to make ends meet. I want my children to have a good future. I don't know...
Posted by: clmibb

Re: I Hate College - 10/25/06 12:43 AM

Quote:

It's 21 in the US. Yes, that means we can vote, smoke, and die for our country (military service), but can't sit down and relax with a beer!

Friggin sucks, but I'm happy I'm in Michigan.....cause Canada's only a 30 minute drive away from my hometown!!

Yay for Windsor!



Mexico is only about 2 hours away for me. South of the border there is no drinking age. If you can order it, you can drink it! WOOO HOOOO! Mexico has been my best friend since I was about 14 or so. Viva Mexico!
Posted by: Cord

Re: I Hate College - 10/25/06 04:12 AM

Quote:

Well if you ask me the United States needs another Prohibition, only it needs to be enforced much better this time around.
Smokingn needs to be made illegal as well.



Just because you dont like something does not mean it should be removed as a possible life choice for others.
How do you enforce a prohibition? We have prohibition on drugs and prostitution- do these vices still exist?

To ban something is to release your control over it and drive it underground, not make it vanish from society.

I'll do you a trade, you ban drinking and smoking, and I will ban Shakespear and educational TV programmes. How do you like your freedom being encroached upon

spend your time living your life, and stay out of others business, or they may stick their nose into yours.
Posted by: Leo_E_49

Re: I Hate College - 10/25/06 09:59 AM

Quote:

Quote:

Quote:

It is well known where I work/went to college...that you give the answer the professor wants to hear in order to get through the course...and that may very well include regurgitating political POV.



That is shocking to me. Very different to the university culture in the UK.



I know, and that's one reason I put in an application to study abroad at the University of Westminster next fall.



Eric, we've got lots in common, I'm also a "nice guy", we're a rare breed but, heck, we survive. Although the people I hang out with are into drinking and drugs and the sort, I don't look down on them for it. It's their lifestyle choice and has no real bearing on whether they are "good enough" to hang out with me. They're all interesting people and funnily enough, most of them got into drugs and stuff because of family problems or that sort of thing, so I can't really blame them for it, as long as they don't push all that on me.

It is SO not true that universities in the UK are all better. There are good universities here and bad universities here, just as there are in the states. There are plenty of shallow, boring and inane people in the university where I study. Would that I could meet girls who are actually interesting and have a world view (other than wanting to get pregnant asap) but I've come to realise that they are also a rare breed.

The most important thing to realise is that we're in university as much to learn about what people can be like, as we are to learn about the subject of our degrees. University is a stepping stone into our working lives and I'm coming to realise that it's probably going to be exactly the same there. People don't get smarter or more mature as they get older, that comes from making mistakes and learning from them or watching other people make mistakes and learning from that. I think of it like a demonstration of the principle of natural selection it's quite funny to watch if you've got that kind of dark humour.

Always look on the bright side of life, the grass is not greener over here, it's probably the same.
Posted by: UofM Shorin Ryu

Re: I Hate College - 10/25/06 11:49 AM

Quote:

I'm sitting here with a change of major form infront of me.
I'm afraid to fill it out though. I want to double major in Creative Writing and History. I don't know if I should do it though. I honestly don't think I'll be happy in business but I know it gives me a secure future.
I just keep thinking, "How in the world am I going to make a living with a writing and history degree?"
I don't need to be rich, but I like travelling, and I don't want to be struggling to make ends meet. I want my children to have a good future. I don't know...



You've got two choices really. Do what you enjoy doing now (writing and history), and worry about the consequences later (secure future). Or you can do what you "hate" (business), in the HOPES (key word here!) that it will secure your future.

An old friend of my father's went into engineering while in college, thinking it would be a secure future. Now, 30 years later in Michigan, he really regrets getting into that business. He makes a decent living, but nowhere near what he expected to make...

Point being, while you may think NOW that business will be more useful, you don't know.

So what I'd do (and I realize I'm not you), is have fun now and worry about the little details later....

Hell, how am I supposed to scrounge a living on a CLASSIC CIV degree?

Don't know, don't care. All I know is I enjoy learning about Greece and Rome, so I'm not gonna stop because I MIGHT be making more money later in life with another major...
Posted by: harlan

Re: I Hate College - 10/25/06 12:11 PM

Fact is...you will not know if whatever decision you make today is one that you might regret. Personally, I majored in something that I loved...but it never turned into a job/career and put me into debt for 30 years! History requires a committment of going on to Graduate school for a payoff. I majored in Anthropology, but after years of bumping around after college I finally had to retrain to get a decent enough job/career to buy a house, have kids, and pay off some horrific student debt; after 20 years...I find that I've changed and actually like Business (when I used to hate it).

Technical skills will always be useful. Learning how to write (creative, journalism, technical writing, grant writing, etc.) is always a good skill.
Posted by: stormbringer

Re: I Hate College - 10/25/06 06:19 PM

Quote:

I'm sitting here with a change of major form infront of me.

I'm afraid to fill it out though. I want to double major in Creative Writing and History. I don't know if I should do it though. I honestly don't think I'll be happy in business but I know it gives me a secure future.

I just keep thinking, "How in the world am I going to make a living with a writing and history degree?"

I don't need to be rich, but I like travelling, and I don't want to be struggling to make ends meet. I want my children to have a good future. I don't know...




Take the History and Writing degrees and get a third degree in teaching. That way you can teach what you like and possibly influence the next generation. Nowadays schools are wanting their teachers to have a masters in the field they are teaching and then get a teaching degree.
Posted by: Landus

Re: I Hate College - 10/25/06 08:39 PM

wow Cord that's a really interested thing you wrote back there.. about employer's seeing 2/2 as more desirable, I never knew :/

But I think people are missing something here!!!

Wear ear muffs when you REALLY have to get some sleep. You can socialize or not, but when you gotta sleep you gotta sleep. It wouldn't hurt!
Posted by: rideonlythelabel

Re: I Hate College - 10/25/06 09:59 PM

I agree with the ear plugs idea, but if you go with it, put a smoke detector right over your bed. Get the kind of model that will shake the foundations of the entire bulding.
Posted by: Eric4444

Re: I Hate College - 10/25/06 11:00 PM

Cord your response on drinking is interesting. Can you tell me the last time books or education killed someone? How about ruined a family? What about destroyed innocent lives?
Any facts on that?
Why don't you take a look at the facts for drinking and smoking now.
People want to have a bear or two that's fine and dandy, but the fact of the matter is TOO many people around the world abuse it. There are too many cases of drunk driving, too many cases of drunken rapes, TOO MANY.
A ban on it may not eradicate it completely, we see this everyday with drug use. It will put a major hamper on things though.
There needs to be more control. If getting caught with a blunt meritted a life sentance, not many people would risk it would they?
We need harsher penalties and law enforcement and government officials need more power.

Frankly I'm appalled you pretty much put reading and drinking on the same level.
Posted by: oldman

Re: I Hate College - 10/25/06 11:18 PM

Eric,

Imagine being at a wedding. Everyone is having a good time. The wine is running low. Then along comes this guy out of nowhere and poof more wine. Just when the wedding guests are getting used to the idea of drinking water, there is more wine. The party continues with food and wine.Some folks celebrate. Others hear about it and brand the man a drunkard and a fool. Was the man a fool for providing more wine? There is time for celebration and there it time for work. There is time for justice and also grace.
Posted by: Eric4444

Re: I Hate College - 10/25/06 11:23 PM

I guess I'd be one of the guests labeling him a fool.
This is my stance, it's what I believe in and frankly I feel as if it's a damn good thing to believe in.
I believe that if it is a health hazard it needs to be banned. Same goes for things like fast food. I love fast food. I eat it once in a while and I enjoy it. However, people ABUSE the privledge. So, in the name of healthy living, I will give up my occasional indulgence.
Posted by: Ronin1966

Re: I Hate College - 10/26/06 12:17 AM

Hello Eric:

As others said talk to your Residence Director or one of their assistants of your particular dorm, the RA's. Explain the problems you're having, they are paid to listen & help.

If they don't then talk to the housing director of the university or their office. Talk to the Counseling Center. Somebody will help... there are "quiet dorms" one assumes.
Keep talking until someone responds in a way that helps...

After you've gotten a better handle THEN talk with the roomate. Parts he'll understand, parts he'll agree with parts he will not hopefully. You will never know until you have the conversation. DO NOT do it in your room... Your room is "neutral space" and not the place to start the screaming argument if it comes to that...

Good luck,
Jeff
Posted by: UofM Shorin Ryu

Re: I Hate College - 10/26/06 12:59 AM

Quote:

Cord your response on drinking is interesting. Can you tell me the last time books or education killed someone? How about ruined a family? What about destroyed innocent lives?
Any facts on that?
Why don't you take a look at the facts for drinking and smoking now.
People want to have a bear or two that's fine and dandy, but the fact of the matter is TOO many people around the world abuse it. There are too many cases of drunk driving, too many cases of drunken rapes, TOO MANY.
A ban on it may not eradicate it completely, we see this everyday with drug use. It will put a major hamper on things though.
There needs to be more control. If getting caught with a blunt meritted a life sentance, not many people would risk it would they?
We need harsher penalties and law enforcement and government officials need more power.

Frankly I'm appalled you pretty much put reading and drinking on the same level.




Take a look at the facts. Cars kill thousands upon thousands of Americans EVERY YEAR. We need to ban cars. It may not stop it, but banning car use will severely hamper deaths as the result of driving....
Posted by: Cord

Re: I Hate College - 10/26/06 04:12 AM

Quote:

My Dad does nothing but spend hours and hours of his day in a bar, and even he says people shouldn't drink in college ( he didn't even go).
There's so much we could all be doing.



This is interesting. would I be right in thinking that your Father's relationship with alcohol and his choices in life have been a deciding influence on your opinion on drink?

If so, then quite frankly you have anger issues with him that you are re-directing onto others for their alcohol use, and anger at the substance itself.

Alcohol never jumped out of a bottle and forced its way down anyone'e throat. It is a non sentient liquid. It has no agenda or plan for you in life. It is a substance that is completely harmless unless misused by an individual. In such cases, the fault lies with the individual, not the alcohol.

People who abuse substances are usually trying to escape unhapiness, or find the reality of themselves, or their situation too much to cope with unless they have the mental 'cushion' provided by a drugs effects.
I understand this from first hand experience.

it is also with no small sense of irony that I would point out that much of the literature that is respected in this world, and you prize so highly (Coleridge, Thomas, Joyce, Kerouac, Byron, Burroughs and countless others) has been created by people under the influence of alcohol and other substances, and would never have been created under your 'world vision'.

Churchill started the day with 4 large gin and tonics and a cigar for breakfast whilst in the bath. Hitler was a vegetarian, and promoter of physical health and exercise.

Have the courage to direct and deal with your anger in the appropriate place.

As for literature not causing death- how many millions have died over the Bible and the various interpretations of it? Biggest selling book in the world.

on a smaller scale, Phil Anselmo (ex vocalist of Pantera) is quoted in print of his wish for 'Dimebag Darrel' (a guitarist he has fallen out with) 'to get his'. Fast forward a couple of months and Dimebag is shot dead on stage by a disturbed fan of Phil Anselmo, having read that interview.

The written word has far greater power to destroy lives than alcohol, and must be used responsibly just the same.

Now the question is, did the written interview make a balanced guy an insane killer, or did it have an effect on a guy with existing problems?

Same can be asked of alcohol. The person is the problem, not the substance.

Maybe we should ban people?
Posted by: billyg

Re: I Hate College - 10/26/06 05:24 AM

Quote:

Cord your response on drinking is interesting. Can you tell me the last time books or education killed someone? How about ruined a family? What about destroyed innocent lives?
Any facts on that?
Why don't you take a look at the facts for drinking and smoking now.
People want to have a bear or two that's fine and dandy, but the fact of the matter is TOO many people around the world abuse it. There are too many cases of drunk driving, too many cases of drunken rapes, TOO MANY.




Hi Guys
I am new to the forum.
Smoking and drinking related illnesses and are one of the biggest burden on the NHSS in this country (UK) in fact as far as I can gather moves are being made to ban smoking from nearly everywhere except a persons own home.

Drug related crimes are one of the biggest burdens on the money allocated for crime fighting.
Why anybody should resort to illegal drugs, legal smoking or excessive drinking is their choice, but then I don’t think they should burden the rest of society with the illness’s that follow.
A self inflicted illness is exactly that.



.
Posted by: Cord

Re: I Hate College - 10/26/06 05:58 AM

Quote:


Hi Guys
I am new to the forum.
Smoking and drinking related illnesses and are one of the biggest burden on the NHSS in this country (UK) in fact as far as I can gather moves are being made to ban smoking from nearly everywhere except a persons own home.

Drug related crimes are one of the biggest burdens on the money allocated for crime fighting.
Why anybody should resort to illegal drugs, legal smoking or excessive drinking is their choice, but then I don’t think they should burden the rest of society with the illness’s that follow.
A self inflicted illness is exactly that.



This is not news to anyone. I am not saying that irresponsible abuse of anything is right or clever, nor do I disagree that addiction in all forms is directly linked to crime and misery.

lets look at the act of 'banning' something on grounds of 'what is good for you', and then see where it could lead.

OK, smoking- not a clever thing to do. I have quit, and feel better for it. The government however, derive huge amounts of revenue from its taxation- in fact, they have a 'free pass' to crank taxes up disproprtionately every year on tobacco and say 'its to discourage its use through fiscal incentive to quit'. Yeah. Right.

So now they go the whole hog and ban it in the UK. No more tax revenue- the government is billions of pounds poorer per year. How's the already underfunded NHS looking now? Not so good huh.

With the crusade on cigarettes won, the health inquisition move on to alcohol. They put huge pressure on government bodies until they at first get a strength limit put on all booze sold (drink is taxed by percentage alcohol), then on the amount that can be bought in one go (keeping in line with health guidelines), then eventualy get it banned altogether. Result- government lose taxes, hundreds of thousands of people involved in the brewing, distributing and vending of alcohol go unenployed. Bye bye the great british pub.

What next? oh yeah! 'fast food' and red meat- they are no good for you right?

So now all convenience food outlets are out of business (millions more unenployed), and the fields are ablaze with all the cattle that are now killed off as they are no longer needed, nor supportable. The fragile farming economy of britain collapses.

Net result of all this. People have no freedom of choice of how what they eat, nor of where they eat it. The millions of people who enjoy a steak and a glass of red wine are instantly branded criminals.
The government has billions less in the bank, yet millions more unenployed to support as the economic face of Britain changes beyond destruction.
They also have to fund huge increases in police and customs to cope with the enourmous black market in newly banned products that springs out of nowhere.
Those who continue to want a beer and a roast beef lunch have to consult with criminals, putting themselves at risk, not to mention that there are now no quality controls or health and safety guidelines over the transportation and storage of foodstuffs. The hospitals (now crippled from underfunding) are stretched to collapse dealing with salmonella, ecoli, and other forms of food poisoning.

All this nonsense can be avoided by giving people the facts, explaining the risks, and letting them make their own damn minds up on how to live their lives

Dictate too much, and you have a dictatorship.

LONG LIVE FREEDOM OF CHOICE!!!
Posted by: crablord

Re: I Hate College - 10/26/06 06:55 AM

damn that was a good post
Posted by: billyg

Re: I Hate College - 10/26/06 07:49 AM

A percentage of cigarette sales in the UK. are through the black market with no tax paid to the government. The cigarettes in question are not manufactured in the UK so no gains in employment. That still doesn’t change the extremely high costs of treating cigarette related illness. Perhaps it has been established that the cost of treating cigarette related illness far outweighs the tax earned from the sales of cigarettes purchased legally .If a person wishes to smoke then so be it.


Alcohol in small/moderate amounts should be fine but excess causes medical problems. Again so called illegally imported brands and some legally purchased brands are not manufactured in the UK .
So in effect pubs would not disappear.

Meat.
I don’t think any direct link has been found to any illness through eating meat. Theories yes but I don’t think it has been proven. More likely the causes of any illness related to meat eating might be to obesity.
People should be allowed with in reason to do what they want. If any illness is self inflicted then why should others pay the costs?
A few beers and roast beef for lunch isn’t excessive drinking and it shouldnt lead to illness.

The diseases in hospitals is another matter and I don’t think it has anything to do with self inflicted illness. If people wish to do things that do cause self inflicted illness then that is their choice but why should people who don’t indulge pay for the ones that do?
The outrage caused by the none payment should that ever happen would be tremendous.
But that is a Government matter.
Posted by: billyg

Re: I Hate College - 10/26/06 08:03 AM

I don’t think putting a ban on things will help. Prohibition was tried in the United States and it didn’t work. In fact crime escalated. I can see your point in a lot of ways but I tend to live and let live so long as it doesn’t affect me. People attend college for a reason which is to get a degree. You are in a way the same as a lot of people. So if you do your degree and let others do as they wish? Then you get a good degree and a better understanding of other people.
Posted by: oldman

Re: I Hate College - 10/26/06 08:04 AM

Turning water into wine...that Crazy Jesus guy. What was he thinkin'
Posted by: Eric4444

Re: I Hate College - 10/26/06 12:57 PM

Obviously I'm not going to win here, so I'll cede to defeat.
My stance isn't changing however.
Posted by: Cord

Re: I Hate College - 10/26/06 05:16 PM

Quote:

Obviously I'm not going to win here, so I'll cede to defeat.
My stance isn't changing however.



Make peace with your personal situations, and the world at large will seem much more tolerable. Good luck.
Posted by: Eric4444

Re: I Hate College - 10/26/06 06:57 PM

Don't blame my stance on personal problems, please DO NOT. That is always a common reaction, it has nothing to do with my beliefs.
It's called Straight Edge. There are a lot of people who don't drink, and it has nothing to do with family issues.
My father, has never stopped being a good father. My only concern is his deteriorating body and what alcohol has done to him physically.
Posted by: Leo_E_49

Re: I Hate College - 10/26/06 08:51 PM

Quote:

Dictate too much, and you have a dictatorship.

LONG LIVE FREEDOM OF CHOICE!!!



Been a long time since I last heard those words spoken. Good to see them again. Now if only the rest of the population weren't mostly sheep, we might see some progress.
Posted by: Cord

Re: I Hate College - 10/27/06 04:41 AM

Quote:

Don't blame my stance on personal problems, please DO NOT. That is always a common reaction, it has nothing to do with my beliefs......... My only concern is his deteriorating body and what alcohol has done to him physically.



And that makes you angry. He is a good guy, a great father, yet he is choosing to hurt himself with his life choices. If alcohol didnt exist, he couldn't make those choices.
You are angry at your dad, not alcohol. Removing the substance would not remove the core of the issue.

I am pretty much straight edge- I dont even drink coffe. I do allow myself alcohol 5 times a year- thats it. I have documented on previous similar threads the damage I did myself with irresponsible use of various substances. The substances themselves were never to blame.
You cannot put blame on something that has no will of its own. They have yet to develop a bottle of scotch that roams the streets, pouncing on unsuspecting victims and pouring its contents down their unwilling throats.

Its the people that have problems, the substance is the symptom- booze, drugs, chocolate, sex, whatever. All are an attempt to escape a problem or find happiness.

You have to come to terms with that. but looking down on people and trying to dictate what they can and can't do will not help in the slightest.

Did you ever stop and think that your strict adherence to straight edge is an addiction in itself? it gives you a sense of control and comfort, and you cant imagine life without it. Addiction comes in many forms.
Posted by: Eric4444

Re: I Hate College - 10/27/06 11:00 AM

Yes, well, I was straight edge before my father's alcohol problem.
I also have a lot of straight edge friends who come from families that have no alcohol problems at all.
My reason is simple:
People's addictions to alcohol cause death, families to break up, rape, and sufferings of many other kinds.

Nothing good comes from alcohol.
Sure, there are people like you who can control yourself and barely drink, but there are MANY people who can't.
Alcohol consumption is the third largest cause of death in the country. Around 83 thousand deaths a year, double that of car accident deaths UofM.
Posted by: Cord

Re: I Hate College - 10/28/06 04:00 AM

Quote:

People's addictions to alcohol cause death, families to break up, rape, and sufferings of many other kinds.



This is not the fault of an unmoving, unseeing, unthinking liquid. It is the people using it that have, and in turn cause problems. If alcohol caused the problems, then everyone who drank it would become rapists, a danger to public etc.ie. there would be uniformity of reaction to it. As it is, most just get the urge to sing songs loudly at 4am with their buddies- in the grand scheme of things, that is not a great crime.

Conversely, being of sober character does not insure altruism and benevolence to fellow man.

Quote:

Nothing good comes from alcohol.



i met my wife in a pub. If neither of us drank alcohol, we never would have met. She is my soul mate, and my life would be a shell without her. I disagree with your statement.

Quote:

Sure, there are people like you who can control yourself and barely drink, but there are MANY people who can't.



But their loss of inhibition does not present itself in a negative way- they get loud, tell rude jokes, dance down the street. It is the minority of the many millions of drinkers in the world who act out in a negative way, and they would do bad things when sober anyway, as that is where their nature lies.
As an ex drunkard of some commitment, I can tell you that I was the same person I am today, just not as perky in the mornings, and with a lot less cash to spend on other things.
drinking didn't make me a bad person, any more than being sober makes me a good person. I am just the person I am.

Health risks are a personal choice. It is, quite literaly, your life. You are under no obligation to put systems in place to try and prolongue it. Give people the facts, and the education, and let them, as autonomous individuals, make their own choices- even if you disagree with them. Live your life, dont try and live other's for them.

Eric, this conversation has made me look at my views, and I have made some changes.
A few months ago, I posted at length regarding soccer, and the many social ills I felt it responsible for in Europe. My stance on it was very similar to yours on alcohol.
Realising how strongly I disagree with your thinking on here, has helped me examine the hypocricy in my attitude to soccer. Its not the games fault, it is how certain people react and choose to 'enjoy' the game that is the problem. The game itself is just 22 guys kicking a ball around a field for lots of cash. I am still not interested in it, but I no longer hate it or wish it didnt exist.

Thanks for helping me examine and change my views, even if not in the way you intended.
Posted by: TeK9

Re: I Hate College - 10/28/06 05:35 AM

hi ERIC

Reading your first post, I was going to respond to you like most people, with "suck it up" comments and basicaly tell you not to be a big baby. But I kept reading and I think i know where your comming from. Your taking your college seriously and that very wise of you. College usualy has soemthing for everyone no matter what type of crowd you run with or are into. About the drunkiness and screaming and yelling at 4am. Thats a losing battle my friend learn to ignore it, shove cotten in your ears.

Also, it is very imprtant not to look at people and judge them like "them" and "me" this will autmatically exclude yourself from having a social life. I'm not saying your doing it, but it seems like you might be heading down that path.

Remember these are the most important years of your life and it's not al just about academics. Dereck says you shouldn't change who you are to please others, wel there is nothing wrong with a bit of change to experiement. Who kjonws you might discover a different way of being. Obviously your tollerance level is going have to grow, this is rush semester after all, people will be doing crazy things to get into a fraterniy.

This is the time when you get the chance to re-invent yourself a thousand times over, do it to see peoples reaction, do it to date different types of girls, do it for fun. Ah heck man, do it just to do it.

Who knows mabe you will get a long with richie rich roomate ofyours and you can borrow his stuff. Don't forget, your going to deal with people all your life, and the workforce si defenitetly a social environment, might aswell star on your networking now.

Be positive, stay chill, and have fun. And honestly your in college now, mommy and daddy are not looking. Don't be afraid to throw one back. Try Coronas. Oh wait your on a college budget okay do what i did, drink red dog, you can get a 24 pack for 2 bucks. And most importantly never drink alone, cuz that makes you a loser. And try to make sure you have ahealty amount of femaninas around to keep you company, they always make the party worth while. Um unless you swing the other way, which there is absolutely nothing wrong with that. To each his own.

Good Luck,

P.S. I got my dregree in psychology, sucks can't do anything in that field unless you have a masters. However, I was smart and got concentration in Industrial Organizational Psychology B.S. degree. Looks more impresive on a resume. And a B.S. makes employers think you took more math courses. Which in some cases it's true unfortunetly.

-Tek
Posted by: Eric4444

Re: I Hate College - 10/30/06 10:48 PM

They're desperte for RA's for next semester, a lot of them are graduating this fall, so they're accepting freshman applicants. I have an interview on Wednesday.

I'm spending 6 weeks this summer volunteering in Tanzania, depending on my time there, I may be taking a break from school to do more volunteer work.
Posted by: mcmillintkd

Re: I Hate College - 12/15/06 01:26 PM

Quote:

Well if you ask me the United States needs another Prohibition, only it needs to be enforced much better this time around.
Smokingn needs to be made illegal as well.


I can understand that you might (as well as I) think that drinking and smoking are bad for you and should be avoided but that should not be enforced by the govertment. People should be allowed to destroy themselves as they want. Freedom means that we are not going to agree but that we have the right to disagree. Mankind has always found ways to destroy itself and that will never change. Prohibition only gave more power to criminals as does the present prohibition on drugs. The war on drugs has only made criminal empires have more power and more money. Drugs are stupid but they aren't going anywhere so perhaps we could put limited resources towards something else.

Sorry to high jack the thread.

....as for what you study. Go to grad school and get an MBA if you want to go into business. The undergrad degree can be in anything you want. Stay in academics...there is a decent living there.
Posted by: olga

Re: I Hate College - 12/15/06 03:08 PM

Quote:

I guess I'd be one of the guests labeling him a fool.
This is my stance, it's what I believe in and frankly I feel as if it's a damn good thing to believe in.
I believe that if it is a health hazard it needs to be banned. Same goes for things like fast food. I love fast food. I eat it once in a while and I enjoy it. However, people ABUSE the privledge. So, in the name of healthy living, I will give up my occasional indulgence.



How would you decide what is a health hazard and what is not? You cannot possibly be 100% objective and fair in these choices without being oppressive. So alcohol is banned, smoking is banned, fast food and what's next? Lots of things we use every day are so-called health hazards. For example, cars—you can get hit by a car crossing the street. Should they be banned too? Or what about balconies? You can fall off one. How about Martial Arts—someone can break his neck.

It is admirable that you don't drink and smoke. But it is not up to you to decide whether other people do the same. It's nice that you are mature enough to understand the dangers of binge drinking and smoking, but all people are different. Believe it or not, lots of people grow out of their substance abuse habits after college and still achieve a lot in their lives and contribute to society.
Posted by: Saisho

Re: I Hate College - 12/15/06 03:25 PM

Smoking is negative in every aspect. I don't think that anyone, including smokers, would say that smoking has any positive effects. Most smokers argue that it is their right to smoke and I am not saying they should be banned.

Other things, such as alcohol, can have negative effects, but also have benefits. It is understood in the health field that one drink per day for women and two for men is healthy. In fact, it was stated (I would have to look through my books to see by whom) that it is better for a man to have a couple of drinks per day than to not have any. No, you can't save them up and cash them in on the weekend

So, there is a difference between things that are bad for you and things that can be if not handled correctly. There is also a difference between something being bad for you and the right to partake in it anyway.
Posted by: MattJ

Re: I Hate College - 12/15/06 03:28 PM

Quote:

Smoking is negative in every aspect. I don't think that anyone, including smokers, would say that smoking has any positive effects. Most smokers argue that it is their right to smoke and I am not saying they should be banned.

Other things, such as alcohol, can have negative effects, but also have benefits. It is understood in the health field that one drink per day for women and two for men is healthy. In fact, it was stated (I would have to look through my books to see by whom) that it is better for a man to have a couple of drinks per day than to not have any. No, you can't save them up and cash them in on the weekend

So, there is a difference between things that are bad for you and things that can be if not handled correctly. There is also a difference between something being bad for you and the right to partake in it anyway.



Thanks for that, saved me the trouble.

*slowly steps off of anti-smoking soapbox*
Posted by: Stormdragon

Re: I Hate College - 12/15/06 04:25 PM

They ban hard drugs and mariguana yet not smoking or drinking. I sense a contradiction here.
Posted by: JoelM

Re: I Hate College - 12/15/06 06:05 PM

That's right, they should ban it all.



If alcohol was a new invention, developed yesterday as opposed to thousands of years ago, would it be legal? Would tobacco?
Posted by: MattJ

Re: I Hate College - 12/15/06 09:41 PM

Quote:

If alcohol was a new invention, developed yesterday as opposed to thousands of years ago, would it be legal? Would tobacco?



A valid point. Tobacco and hard drugs have no upside or health benefit. You can not live on them nor can they substitute nutritionally in any way. Alcohol is in a somewhat differrent class. In ancient cultures, fresh water was sometimes hard to find, and alcohol was considered "safer" to drink in those instances. Alcohol is very dense calorically, and could substitute for food if need be.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alcoholic_beverage

Quote:

In places and eras with poor public sanitation, such as Medieval Europe, consumption of alcoholic beverages (particularly weak or "small" beer) was one method of avoiding water-borne diseases such as the cholera.



In the "modern" world with access to clean water supplies, there is less rationale for the existence of alcohol.
Posted by: Saisho

Re: I Hate College - 12/15/06 09:46 PM

I have often told the college classes I taught that a (well made) pizza and a beer is the best meal they can have. A pizza with adequate vegetables and beef (not pork) is the only food to supply all of the essential amino acids that a person must consume. Beer has many health benefits as well.

Needless to say, my students liked that lecture.
Posted by: Eric4444

Re: I Hate College - 12/16/06 12:01 AM

Ugh, bumped thread.
Oh well, might as well update everyone.

I am now home for Christmas, first semester it out of the way. I'm coming out with a very good GPA. My grades were never good in high school, mainly because I hate busy work. I never did it, especially when it was handed out for homework. I have no interest in wasting my time. I learn something, I practice it, I memorize it, I move on. Teachers moved at too slow of a pace, and handed out work most days to keep us occupied while they drank their coffee and read the sports section.
Now that I'm in college that has changed for the most part. I plan on transferring my junior year to a better school. I plan on spending my time at this university getting all the required classes out of the way and maintaining a 3.8-4.0 GPA. I'm also taking a variety of different classes to help me decide on what I REALLY want to major in.
My dorm room still sucks. I average only a few hours of sleep a night. I deal with it though.

I'm not getting into the smoking/alcohol/drug debate again. I've done it too many times, and I really get tired of people saying things like "well why not ban cars while you're at it they kill too."
Well that's because you HAVE to drive to function in this society, you don't HAVE to drink to function.
No more though.

I'm getting an apartment next year. Found one 3 miles from the school. 680 a night. I can swing it if I work all summer. A 6 mile run to and from school each day will probably do me some good anyways.

Well, that's all I can think of to say now. There's your update.
Posted by: Cord

Re: I Hate College - 12/17/06 12:24 AM

Quote:

UghA 6 mile run to and from school each day will probably do me some good anyways.



I thought 'you HAVE to drive to function in this society'?



Glad you are dealing. Sorry you are not enjoying. Doubtful of your ability to judge the methods of your teachers with authority.

If you are not going to drink, at least indulge in a little humility, and possibly a little happiness?
Posted by: Ed_Morris

Re: I Hate College - 12/17/06 12:40 AM

sounds like you are just dealing with it instead of adapting to it.

most can deal....few learn to adapt.

you have a choice in goals: maintain a 3.8-4.0 and count the days till you're done, cursing in your mind everything and everyone along the way. or maintain a 3.8-4.0 while finding ways to enjoy the whole college experience for what it is.

We learn something about ourselves by taking risks...until you study till 2am the night before midterms, then your friends walk in and drag you to an all-nighter party and drink till 6 - take the test the next morning at 8am with no sleep in a fog of alcohol....and land an A-

now THAT is getting the FULL college experience. lol
Posted by: crablord

Re: I Hate College - 12/17/06 12:41 AM

Quote:


In the "modern" world with access to clean water supplies, there is less rationale for the existence of alcohol.

Alcohol is not good for you, its just something that people enjoy. and if in the correct amount it does no harm. Thats why its legal. If we banned everything with all negative effects we wouldnt have coke..junk food etc. Its just because people enjoy it that its still around, no other reason
Posted by: Saisho

Re: I Hate College - 12/17/06 01:19 AM

Quote:

Alcohol is not good for you, its just something that people enjoy



I would have to disagree. Too much is not good for you, but 1 to 2 drinks per day are actually beneficial.
Posted by: crablord

Re: I Hate College - 12/17/06 05:42 AM

well..point remains the same either way
Posted by: Eric4444

Re: I Hate College - 12/17/06 12:19 PM

Well, I guess I will never be getting the full college experience Ed.
I'm honestly flabbergasted that adults are trying to convince me to participate in such things.

And I never said in the update that I was not enjoying school. I am enjoying it very much now. I've become involved in numerous organizations that keep me entertained.
I'm a member of:

The College Republicans
The Bill O'Reilly Fan Club
The Chess Team
The American History Club
The Physics Club

Seems like a lot but there are only 1-2 meetings per month for each.
Trust me these groups keep me very well entertained.

Besides, risking my grades by drinking all night is a foolish risk.
If I'm going to take a risk it's going to be skydiving, or rock climbing, or some form of a physical risk. At least if something goes wrong with my skydiving I won't KNOW I messed up my future.
Posted by: Saisho

Re: I Hate College - 12/17/06 04:23 PM

Fair enough
Posted by: Ed_Morris

Re: I Hate College - 12/17/06 06:40 PM

Skydiving, yep...did that during college years too. and prior to even going to college, I was in the military...which wasn't a party, but we still tried and sought out fun whenever we could.

"work hard - play hard" was a popular slogan when I was in school. some of the most interesting, sucessful and intelligent people I've met in my life are the people that have partied at one time, then grew out of it. The worst and most miserable, frustrated and grumpy people to be around are the ones that never got laid or ever aced a test with a hangover.

different times now, I guess...now you have people "looking out for you":
"The Bill O'Reilly Fan Club"

have "fun".
Posted by: Eric4444

Re: I Hate College - 12/17/06 06:46 PM

Well, we're all different. I don't see why people can't accept that.

The only time I get mad at partiers or drinkers, or drug addicts is when they invade my personal space or put others in danger. If they keep to themselves they can do whatever they want.

I have fun doing what I do, others don't.
Trying to convince me to do the kind of stuff you, others, or most people find fun, when I don't enjoy it, isn't fair.

You like going to a keg party, I like sitting in bed and reading A Brief History of Time.
Different strokes.
Posted by: Chen Zen

Re: I Hate College - 12/17/06 07:32 PM

I avoided this topic, because I knew what my reponse would be. Out of sheer boredom I offer it to you now.

I dont intend to offend, but honestly it seems to me like you need to get some thick skin bud. The truth is, your best years are behind you. Life sucks. Those imbeciles you plan on avoiding- when you find a place on this planet free from stupidity please let me be the first one you tell. They're everywhere. If you dont like your classes, change them. If you dont like your roomies, move. If school isnt that important to you then quit, get a job, and move on.

Otherwise, you just gotta suck it up and take it. Thats manhood. Thats Life in general. Everyday I wake up when I dont want to, to go to a job that I hate, to do work that makes me hurt, to pay bills and taxes that I dont want. All day long i deal with ignorant people and ignorant situations. Thats all before I come here. Sink or swim time. What happens is purely up to you.
Posted by: Eric4444

Re: I Hate College - 12/17/06 07:58 PM

Well I definitely sure that school is for me now.
I'm determined to get into a better school now. I know stupidity is everywhere and will follow me to Harvard or MIT or anywhere I chose to go, but I hope to at least find other students who are working towards the same goals as I am. To many students went to my school play hard and not work at all.
Posted by: Chen Zen

Re: I Hate College - 12/17/06 08:03 PM

Well sure, some people never grow up. But if your schooling is important as you imply, then you must realize that its their life. What they do to themselves shouldnt affect you. If they dont study, do you fail? Of course not. Focus, relax, and take a deep breathe and bunker down.
Posted by: Ed_Morris

Re: I Hate College - 12/17/06 08:36 PM

stupidity and idiocy take on all kids of forms...and it's hardest to see our own when we're right in the middle of our definitions of it.

others have differing views of what they see as moronic...like being part of an O'reily fan club, for instance. someone learning an aspect about the world via a keg party or a fan club only differs in perspective, not intellegence. I was a grad student at Harvard for a year - believe me, intellegence comes in all personalities and temperments. The fact you don't realize this yet, tells me you need to get out more. GPA's don't enter into it. it's not a black and white equation. someone who drinks socially and perhaps sometimes does risky or moronic things CAN have a GPA comperable to a book worm.

whos the foolish? the person who is all work and no play - getting an A- average ...or the person who studies hard and plays hard and gets an A- average?

my first job out of college I was hired by referral...guess who referred me? a college friend who I helped in diffy-Q's, and he helped me in comp sci....I first met and talked with him at a keg party. -go figure.

for every college experience you say is dumb, I could probably give you a live account of how it was of benefit to myself or someone I knew. like people have said, it's life...roll with it.

you'll do ah'ight though...I have faith in ya.
Posted by: Cord

Re: I Hate College - 12/17/06 11:10 PM

Quote:

my first job out of college I was hired by referral...guess who referred me? a college friend who I helped in diffy-Q's, and he helped me in comp sci....I first met and talked with him at a keg party. -go figure.




My move to Cambridge only came about because my best friends lived here, and spotted a job opertunity well suited to me. The combination of a better job, and being closer to my buds was too good to miss. From there i went on and met my wife, landed an even better job etc. etc.

I only managed to survive one crazy year of Uni before being kicked out, and during this booze and drug filled car crash of a year is where I formed the friendships that created Cambridge as an option, and all good things that have happened since.
Those friendhips would not have been so strong if not forged through many an all night party, and sticking by each other through all the crazy things that go with such a lifestyle.

If i had not been kicked out of Uni, I would never have met my wife, and thus would not be as happy in life.

Eric, you may think success is all about grades and early nights, and if thats what makes you happy, you must follow your gut, but be under no delusion that you are giving yourself an advantage over your more rowdy collegiate aquaintances in the long run.
Posted by: JoelM

Re: I Hate College - 12/17/06 11:24 PM

Eric has left the site. Until he comes back this thread will remain closed.