Should Kyle Maynard be allowed to fight in the UFC

Posted by: MiSt

Should Kyle Maynard be allowed to fight in the UFC - 04/24/09 09:21 PM

Quote:

Kyle Maynard of Suwanee, Georgia, U.S. was born on March 24, 1986 with a rare disorder called congenital amputation.




Basicly, Kyle wants to fight in the UFC, but as you can read from the article officals are denying him this opportinity. Should they?

http://sports.yahoo.com/mma/news?slug=mm...e&type=lgns


Good luck to him I say, if he can train under MMA rules then he can fight under them. (I have not seen footage of Kyle fighting under MMA rules, but obviously sparring against top fighters is a must if entering the UFC at all for ANYBODY.)

Kyle fighting: http://www.youtube.com/results?search_type=&search_query=Kyle+Maynard&aq=f
Posted by: bo-ken

Re: Should Kyle Maynard be allowed to fight in the UFC - 04/25/09 09:53 AM

Well as far as UFC goes he doesn't weigh enough. There smallest weight class right now is 155. But there is WEC and I heard they might be starting a 125 weight class. This is a hard one to call. If he wants to do it he should be aloud.
Posted by: MattJ

Re: Should Kyle Maynard be allowed to fight in the UFC - 04/25/09 11:17 AM

I applaud the guy for his heart. I really don't know what to think about him competing against able-bodied competitors. It seems like such a giant disadvantage for him (MMA striking?), I can't see how to make it fair. Bo-ken also brings up a good point about weight classes.

I would hate to be the guys that have to rule on this.
Posted by: Dereck

Re: Should Kyle Maynard be allowed to fight in the UFC - 04/25/09 02:16 PM

I too applaud this guy for wanting to do this but my opinion is no; that he should not be allowed to fight in the UFC or any other MMA venues for that matter.

While many may look on this as he is at a disadvantage not having arms and legs, you also have to look at the disadvantage to the other fighters. Kicking is one of fundamental skills used especially head kicks. Clinch and knees are also fundamentals to this game. Leg locks, ankle locks, armbars and the such are all fundamentals to this game. These are things that a fighter could not use against him and are only some of the reasons why I don't think having him do MMA is a good idea.

I understand we are to be a tolerant society and we should adapt many things to accommodate those less able; and I'm all for that. However we need to understand that there are certain things we all are not capable of doing.

If Maynard wanted to be a boxer should he be allowed to fight professionally? What if he wanted to play professional football? What if Maynard wanted to be a Police Officer or a Fire Fighter, should he be allowed to? Or wanted to join the military to fight over seas on the front lines? Should Maynard be allowed to ride a motorcycle?

The list could go on and the answers are all no. While it is good to have dreams, it is good to strive for them, in reality some things are just not possible. That he has found a place to train and that he's done what he has; again I applaud him and I say continue to train and enjoy it. BUT I do not believe that rules should be changed in any sport or any faction in life that puts the other participants at a disadvantage due to his disabilities. His disabilities then disable those people and THAT I find unfair. If there was a way for him to fight within the rules without changing them and does not take away from the other participants skills they have honed and train then I would say yes; but that is not possible in this instance.

On a final note, say this wasn't the UFC or your average MMA venue. Say this was Pride where head kicks and knees to the head are allowed to a downed opponent. Should those rules be changed for him? Do you think that he would have a serious chance at defending himself properly? Or would his safety be at risk? That the fighter who fought him that beat him would be seen as a real victor or looked upon as somebody taking advantage of somebody less able? And as a fighter could you really feel good about a win against him?

He's a great guy. He has a strong will. That is an accomplishment that nobody can take away from him but fighting in the MMA world is not something I personally think he should be allowed to do.
Posted by: MattyChi

Re: Should Kyle Maynard be allowed to fight in the UFC - 04/25/09 05:46 PM

I agree 100% with Dereck
Posted by: MattJ

Re: Should Kyle Maynard be allowed to fight in the UFC - 04/26/09 09:44 AM

From this link -

http://sherdog.com/news/news/maynard-loses-leaves-cage-unscathed-17190

"AUBURN, Ala. -- Knighted by some and demonized by others, Kyle Maynard completed his almost two-year-long journey into the cage on Saturday at the Auburn Covered Arena. He left it unscathed, save for the defeat on his amateur mixed martial arts record.

The 23-year-old congenital amputee dropped a three-round decision to Bryan Fry in the main event of an Auburn Fight Night show and received five standing ovations for his efforts. Fears centered on the possibility of his being injured lingered overhead, but Maynard proved capable of defending himself. All three judges scored it 30-27 in Fry’s favor.

Maynard’s dogged pursuit of a takedown never paid off, as Fry kept him at bay with jabs, open-handed hooks and the occasional uppercut. The Wisconsin native maintained a standing position for the duration of the bout, and though Maynard was often the aggressor, he failed to score with anything of substance.

“I think it’s a tough gameplan to prepare for,” Maynard said. “I felt like I gave 100 percent. He didn’t want to go to the ground, and I wasn’t going to win a boxing match with him.”

Piggybacked to the cage by longtime friend Ben Davis, Maynard was confronted by a cold reality soon after he entered it.

“When I walked in the cage, and when [Fry] was first able to initiate contact, I realized this was the most serious thing I’d ever gotten myself into, and I loved it,” he said. “I think my ear is still buzzing from that first shot.”

Fry -- whose mother cares for mentally and physically handicapped patients and whose son suffers from sickle cell anemia -- claimed he accepted the fight with Maynard in good faith to help the Georgian show others afflicted with disability that dreams are reachable.

“It was important for me to come down here,” said Fry, who won for the first time in three amateur appearances. “If my son sees this guy get in the ring, it lets him know.”

Bryan Fry vs. Kyle MaynardFry credited Maynard for the courage he showed.

“I was pretty damned amazed,” he said. “I didn’t expect him to be that quick. He’s got bigger balls than a lot of the guys I know.”

The setting was far from ideal. Partially enclosed by a steel skeleton, the “arena” came complete with a dirt floor peppered with straw, a wooden press box and bleachers, a hot dog stand, a row of portable toilets and a live band. Sexual enhancement fliers were passed out to the crowd before the first fist flew, and cigarette smoke choked the air, as Maynard and Fry -- the ninth and final bout on the card -- competed in a square cage of black chain-link.

Still, the venue served its purpose for Maynard, who was denied an MMA license by the Georgia Athletic and Entertainment Commission in 2007.

He tempered the disappointment of defeat with optimism and perspective.

“I wanted to win so bad, but it was still one of the best moments of my life,” Maynard said. “A lot of people didn’t think I would last 30 seconds. If you want something bad enough, you’ve got to step in there and do it. I love the sport so much. It would have been so tough to love something so much and never get the chance to taste it.”

Maynard did not compete with gloves, as perspiration -- temperatures hovered in the 80s for much of the night -- caused them to come loose during a warm-up session.

“I couldn’t keep them on,” Maynard said. “I had to tell [Fry] around the seventh or eighth fight. He’s a tough fighter. A lot of guys wouldn’t have taken the fight. A lot of guys [when confronted] at the last minute with this, would have been like, ‘Whoa, whoa, whoa. What about gloves?’”

His thirst for competition far from fully quenched, Maynard plans to compete again in amateur MMA and still holds out hope he will be allowed to do so in a regulated state, perhaps even his native Georgia.

“I want to go in [before the commission] with as much proof as I can,” he said. “I still have the opportunity to go do that. I don’t know if I’ve built my case yet. I don’t know what I have to do to fight in a commissioned state.”

Cornered by UFC veteran Paul Creighton, a Renzo Gracie black belt with whom he now trains full-time, Maynard plans to return to his Duluth, Ga., gym soon.

“I didn’t win tonight,” Maynard said. “I have to get back on the horse and perfect things. This has given me a taste. I want to get back in there and do it again. I’m only 23 years old. I’ve got a lot of time left athletically.”
Posted by: Dereck

Re: Should Kyle Maynard be allowed to fight in the UFC - 04/26/09 02:59 PM

Bravo for him but I still stand by what I said earlier.

I guarantee that Fry did not fight to his full potential. That by accepting to fight Maynard and having a mother that cares for mentally and physically handicapped persons, he took it easy and if wanted to could have ended the fight immediately.

Plus gloves were not worn by Maynard as they wouldn't stay on. These are a part of the equipment that are worn by all fighters for both of their safety. If Maynard would have been able to strike Fry with the stub of his arm; could that have put Fry at risk?

Again bravo but still no.
Posted by: MiSt

Re: Should Kyle Maynard be allowed to fight in the UFC - 04/27/09 02:56 AM

So Dereck, where do you draw the line? What about somebody with one arm? There was a well known muay thai fighter that lost his arm in a car accident, but continued to fight at a high level, is that ok but Maynard not? How can anybody draw the line?

btw I hope somone can find info on this source, for its just a memory of somthing written here years ago.
Posted by: Dereck

Re: Should Kyle Maynard be allowed to fight in the UFC - 04/27/09 03:17 AM

If a one armed fighter doesn't have to have the rules changed for them and their opponents can do what they do and train for; then so be it. And if that one armed fighter's safety is not a factor; again so be it. Pretty clear cut question.
Posted by: MiSt

Re: Should Kyle Maynard be allowed to fight in the UFC - 04/27/09 04:08 AM

Quote:

And if that one armed fighter's safety is not a factor




Thats very subjective. Nobody is safe in an MMA tournament to start with...

Did Maynard have the rules changed for him?

Also the bit about the fighters being able to do what they train for, pretend for example a fighter had a wierd kind of double jointed arms/legs which did not negativly effect him, only meaning he would not submit, should he not be allowed to fight? I have a feeling he would be praised a natural grappler...(Obviously just a guess)
Posted by: Dereck

Re: Should Kyle Maynard be allowed to fight in the UFC - 04/27/09 09:22 AM

Mist, you are now nit picking and grasping at straws.

Nobody is safe in MMA? Are you kidding me? Sure anything can happen but people have the skills to make the difference; not to mention the tools which include limbs.

In MMA arms are used for many things but let's talk about for defense only. A one arm fighter would only be able to cover up with one arm. Maynard can cover up with no arms. If I'm in a ground 'n pound position over Maynard I WILL get strikes through as he will be unable to protect himself properly. Perhaps a one armed fighter may have a chance in MMA if he can prove he can protect himself enough however Maynard without a doubt cannot. That is only another reason why he shouldn't be able to fight MMA.

Face it, there are just things people cannot do in life regardless if they have a disability or not; those are things we all have to face. Whether we don't have the drive, the capability, the know how ... that is life. Nothing says we cannot strive for them but just because you like something doesn't mean you will get to do it or should be allowed to do it.
Posted by: MiSt

Re: Should Kyle Maynard be allowed to fight in the UFC - 04/27/09 10:10 AM

I dont mean to 'nit pick' mate, thats always the danger of forums I guess

I agree with a lot of what your saying, but you talk as if its black and white, when its just not, as proven with the 'one armed fighter' example. You also make asumptions, how do you know Maynard can't defend himself? Obviously he thinks otherwise or he wouldn't be fighting lol.
Posted by: Dereck

Re: Should Kyle Maynard be allowed to fight in the UFC - 04/27/09 01:37 PM

When reading this post I did some homework. I didn't just look at the link given but also looked at other links. I looked at videos of Maynard and found him to be an extraordinary individual so when I say I applaud him I do; I have much respect for him.

Now one thing I notice when as a child playing football as a nose tackle, the other kinds did not play the same way with him. In his wrestling I seen the same thing. While he got older and coaches and others tried to make others treat him the same; he wasn't and they didn't always. With this recent MMA bought, Fry did not treat him like other fighters. Not trying to take anything away from Maynard; god knows he is trying and has heart, but he is not the same and cannot be treated the same.

Without the use of legs/feet and arms/hands he is at a HUGE disadvantage and his skills are all ground related. No fighter can kick him as he is a downed opponent. No fighter can knee him from a standing position; only if they mount him. To strike him they would need to come to his level. Can't clinch him and follow up with knees. Can't do a lot of things. You can grapple with him however armbars, leg locks and ankle locks are not there.

To me that is not the sport and that takes away from it. It takes away the things I want to see in a MMA fight and it takes away from the skill sets of the individuals training this.

Let's say that for some remote chance he is allowed to fight. He is set to fight an individual that has to fight him and this is one mean guy. In the fight he easily man handles Maynard, picks him up and slams him to the ground. Maynard without the extra limbs cannot slap down like a normal fighter to transfer the energy so he hits hard. Before things can be stopped this fighter comes in mounts and drops elbows like no tomorrow and because he has no limbs to properly protect himself he is left in a pool of his own blood. Is that what people want to see? Does this fighter get incorrectly labeled because he did this; something he would do to any other fighter he was up against? Do we feel sorry for Maynard because he does not have the physical attributes of other fighters? Should the rules be changed for him because of his physical handicaps? Should fighters take it easy on him?

When you step in the ring you accept your fate. You hope your skills are good enough to protect you and to win. Maynard does not have this and based solely on this alone he should not be able to fight. Many fighters are deemed unworthy to fight for one reason or another. They may not be able to fight due to previous injuries such as head trauma, broken limbs, etc. The gaming commission and the venues are made responsible for these individuals and their safety and Maynard cannot bypass this solely on he has the will to fight.

There are many war veterans that have this heart; they have the will and drive to continue fighting. But for many they are injured, disabled physically or mentally which makes them ineligible to continue fighting. What makes Maynard any different?

There are many athletes who are unable to be a part of the Olympics and venues such as this due to physical or mental handicaps. They are thus given the Special Olympics. Are you telling me that none of these people work hard and have the drive and the want to be great at what they do? What makes Maynard any different? Should they not have the same rights? But then also ask, are they capable of performing at the levels of those individuals without the handicaps?

Drive, determination, the want, the desire, the fire ... all commendable, but that still doesn't change the fact that he cannot meet the standards required physically, he cannot fight at the levels required and he cannot safely defend himself as other fighters can. And his handicaps become other fighters handicaps which takes away from the sport. For those reason alone should be good enough reasons without dragging anything else into this.

Again I don't want to take anything away from Maynard and others like him who work hard and do what they love; but while this is not something they or others want to hear, this is just not something that can be allowed. This is not something simple like educating people; having tolerance and accepting. This is not like making things accessible like buildings and such. This is much more complex and the standards in place should not be changed to accommodate.
Posted by: Cord

Re: Should Kyle Maynard be allowed to fight in the UFC - 04/27/09 02:01 PM

you cant expect a man with no legs to kick someone's a$$.

on the other side of things, he has unfair ground advantages- how the heck are you supposed to arm or knee bar him? Kimura? Ankle lock?

Nope, you just got to sit on top of him and pound his defenceless face into the canvas. What fighter in their right mind would want to take that gig?

Good for him for having a go- he should tick it off his 'personal empowerment to-do list' and move on. Like Dirty harry said, 'A man's got to know his limitations'.
Posted by: MiSt

Re: Should Kyle Maynard be allowed to fight in the UFC - 04/28/09 06:05 AM

Ok, I watched the fight; http://mixedmartialartvideos.com/2009/04/26/kyle-maynard-vs-bryan-fry-video/

I gota admit that Fry did appear to be very limited.

This fight I beleive was never about winning or losing....

Kyle's drive to fight was IMO to make a statement, and just by fighting he's made it. Thanks to Kyle the MMA world will now be that little bit less prejudice towards people with a handicap, so in that respect it was a success.

I do however on the whole agree with you Dereck, the top sections of any sport are for the elite and the elite only. There are a million reasons why people can't fight at this level outside of having a disability (not enough natural talent in some form or another for example) its just the case however that people with a disability may feel more cheated than those who simply just arnt good enough.

Edit: In other words not cutting it is not cutting it, you can either play at that level or you can't. However not being fast enough is going to [censored] you off less than an impairment which makes you wonder WHAT IF.

Sorry if this makes no sense I feel like I' m getting worse at expressing my ideas by the day, which isnt [censored] good for a uni student.

Thanks for your posts guys anyway.
Posted by: MattJ

Re: Should Kyle Maynard be allowed to fight in the UFC - 04/28/09 07:24 AM

Very good posts, guys. Tough thing to debate.
Posted by: JMWcorwin

Re: Should Kyle Maynard be allowed to fight in the UFC - 04/28/09 03:19 PM

I had a kid who fought one year in a tourney in an under 12 black belt division. (sorry for those of you who want to debate that statement in it's entirety, that's another debate) Unfortunately the only other person in that divisinon was a girl. A very tough girl, no doubt, but a girl. They faced off and when the ref said go he unleashed a beautiful 360 spinning heel kick that all but broke this girls jaw. They broke em up and walked her off the matt to check her boo boo and calm her down and see if she was good to continue. (mind you, had this been male/male it would have been one quick question by the judge on the mat and a 30 second break, then back to it)

Long story short, when she came back he basically let her win from that point on. There was no real way for him to come out of that fight a winner. Either he's the guy who got beat up by the only girl in the competition, or he's the guy who only had to beat a girl to get his trophy. I have nothing against women fighters, more power to them. But, this is an example of a no win situation. I think the topic of this thread falls in the same category.

Either you're the one who beat up the guy with no arms or legs or you're the guy who, in Cord's elegant wording, got his a$$ kicked by a guy with no legs. It's just plain lose/lose all the way around in the ring. The story itself is inspiring and will probably make a great movie someday... but will never make a good or realistic MMA fight. Really, how do you get around that thing where you can't knee the head when the opponent has all 4's on the mat? What does that leave? Jump high in the air, land on top of him in the manner of your choice, and start the G & P. Is this really even a topic worthy of actual consideration? Props to the guys dreams. But, save what dignity you have and find some other thing to break into. I know a swimmer with no arms that kicks a$$.

Just trying to be real here.