Wing chung

I posted this topic in the general martial arts section, but I think you fellows may have more perspective on this art since from what ive heard bruce lee started with WC and created JKD based on some of those principles (im assuming) Im thinking of taking WC and would like to know if anyone has trained with it, fought with it or against it.

Your feedback is much appreciated.

Wing Chun or Ving Tsun, depending on who you ask, is ok. It lacks any real mobility in the feet though and relies heavily on trapping. Problem is most people cant trap well. It also utilizes finger jabs which are questionable.

However, it does provide a decent base understanding of self defense. It has a good concept of punching and low level kicking similar to what can be found in Karate. Ive trained in it, and sparred with a few "top notch" students. Personally, it isnt for me. But I have seen it work, so it is possible that it can be effective.

Finger jab techniques, while not really useful in themself, I believe can be very useful if combined with a sharp improvised weapon of some sort (eg pens, chopsticks etc.). Sparring with friends, I've always found trapping to be very useful, as well as Wing Chun Sticky Hand training, though it takes a LONG time before the training becomes useful in real combat. The scientific theory behind Wing Chun can be applied to any style, so Wing Chun, in addition to being a be all end all system (if you have the patience) is also a very good base.

My friends and I have done a modified form of chi sao for several years, and found that it really improved our hand technique a lot.

I agree with Chen about the lack of footwork in WC. Trapping is pretty difficult to pull off on a resisting opponent, but chi sao works good in the clinch range.

There's as much footwork in wing chun as an individual puts into it. You're shown basic advance, retreat, circling and sidestepping, its up to you to put it to good use. Its up to an individual to make any art work for them, sometimes you need to use your smarts but mostly I think a person needs to move naturally and instinctively, even if its not spelled out in bold letters to you by your instructors and your style.

WC has footwork, and very quick evasive footwork. The problem is that noone likes to practice footwork cause its boring therfore people learn it, but not really learn it. You should be doing as much footwork as anything alse and very few people stick to it. Boxing footwork is crap unless you train. WC also has a very good theory behind it and is flawless when it comes to handwork. It does not emphasise kicks, it is a close quarter MA and also does not have any grappling, but has takedowns, something that is missed by most people. WC is a fast effective, complete devastating, and mostly dirty system. I do not claim it is the best because it is up to the individual to make it so, but it works.
Also it has a very fast learning curve.
The 5 grandmasters in a shaolin temple got together and made this by combining the most effective moves from the other kung fu styles so that they could produce effective soldiers quickly.
A normal kung fu style takes about 15 years to complete, WC about 5-6.
Obviously depending on dedication, ability and also you never really complete a system.
A lot of people do not hold WC very highly but, you should check it out, go to a dojo to get a good feel for it.

I have been practicing wc for 4.5 months. I will give you my honest op:
Is wc for you?
It doesn't matter how you say it first. WC doesn't lack mobility. We don't heavily use trapping and finger jabs. The problem is that most schools and "sifu"s are BS. WC relies on ideas, and you must learn to use the ideas in your way. Everyone's style is going to be different.. but the same.

A good wc school is going to be very boring for many months( I know first hand). Why? Allot of stance training, and muscle memory training, ect.. For example.. first day you may learn the basic foot work and horse.. and only do that for 3 hours. WC is allot about art and basic self defense. So if this isn't what your looking for don't take WC. This type of training is hard on your body, but I enjoy it allot. I often come home with allot of cuts and sores from sparing.. but I am getting allot better.

If WC is for you ( I don't think its for most people), then find a “good” school. First figure what you want out of MA. Traditional school's will follow the path i stated, but non traditional school will do other things. What works best is go and watch a couple classes, and ask to be shown application of basic techniques. If it looks flashy, unrealistic, too hard, ect... go somewhere else. I would see if Duncan Leung has any students in your area. I know him personally, and anyone who trains with him can tell you how he fights. We train to fight in my school. We don't do a great deal of forms, chi-soa, ect... the emphasis is fighting... and thats what is most important for me.

[QUOTE]Originally posted by MAGr:

The 5 grandmasters in a shaolin temple got together and made this by combining the most effective moves from the other kung fu styles so that they could produce effective soldiers quickly.[/QUOTE]

This is a little off topic, but wasn't Ng Mui alone who developed Wing Chun? True that the five grandmasters of the Shaolin temple were the only survivors of that massacre, but I don't think they worked together to create Wing Chun.

There are a lot of versions of the story.
But I do know this.
It was created for the purpose of someone learning kung fu and mastering self defence in less than 10-15 years, like the other kung fu styles take.
I dont know that it was put together by the 5 grandmasters, but that is what i heard.

[QUOTE]Originally posted by Kung Fu Hung-Su:
but wasn't Ng Mui alone who developed Wing Chun? True that the five grandmasters of the Shaolin temple were the only survivors of that massacre, but I don't think they worked together to create Wing Chun.[/QUOTE]

Wing Chun existed before the Temple was destroyed, if you do Wing Chun you will know that it is impossible for a single person to have developed the system anyway. The Legend of Ng Mui etc is just a nice story.