Footwork

I have accomplished much through self-taught martial arts, and sparring with friends, "friends" and "not so friendly" people, but my footwork is still lacking. So, if anyone could give me some pointers on extra drills to through into the mix, I will be more than happy to try them out. (I was just whomped by a friend today)My friend fought a superb kicking style and after my 10th consecutive stop-kick I started loosing balance. This is where she, yes she, took care of me. Seriously, any pointers would help.

Humbly I thank any replyers
~Brad~

Train under an instructor.

Aye under an instructer is preferable.

If you have a good understanding of body mechanics, pysics, and some professional training. You can self teach rather well. Perfect technique should always be product number one.

Sparring like your doing is the key. I spar with plenty of different friends/martial artists in my spare room. If you spar the same person long enough you will adapt to their techniques, and vice versa. This is good for developing as a fighter. It forces you to adapt, expand and evolve. Keep it up.


As far as your footwork is concerned. Are you looking for kicks, or defensive techniques?

As far as kicks go, there is really only two I use in sparring. Push kick and Thai kick. They are simple, reliable and effective.

As far as taking hits. If they are throwing the Thai kick at you. The best thing to do is wear them. Cause the Thai kicks motions make it very difficult to dodge. And dropping your arm away from your head to block, is something I dont do. I have been taught to never sacrifice head protection to protect any other part of the body. If you just take enough of your friends kicks to the body, your body will adapt. So I wouldn't worry about it. Just after you do take a beating from your friend, you rest and replenish a day after.

"When someone first showed up they were a wad of cookie dough. After a few weeks they were carved out of wood"

Fight Club

[QUOTE]Originally posted by otobeawanker:
As far as taking hits. If they are throwing the Thai kick at you. The best thing to do is wear them.[/QUOTE]

I don't think you have been kicked hard enough.

The best counter for the Thai kick is to step inside the arc of the kick and throw a straight right. It's amazing how often that one works.


-John

ummm....
I think you will find that to be completely fair...
Technicaly the best responce to a thai kick would be move into the arc... If you think about it, it's more pheasable/practical to do this because its quick and easy... Also there will be far less force the closer into the arc you get...
It also gives you an opertunity to strike, although that could prove kinda intresting to be fair...

Jvr

What about a groin kick John? Counterkicking their kicking leg or pivoting leg?

I have a friend who was in Kyokushin tourney, and broke someone's leg with this technique [pivoting leg].

A counter kick (cut kick) is ok. But to hit the groin? You'd almost have to do this with the toe of the shoe as with a savate kick. That would have to be an extremely precise attack. Wouldn't it be better to just try and cut kick the inner thigh itself as it's usually done?

But, wouldn't it even be better than THAT to keep both feet firmly planted on the ground and fire the hands? I think so.

-John

Oh, and you don't need timing for the shin check? And trying to intercept them, at the risk of taking a shot to the thigh.

Get real.

The best counter for a thai kick is to block it with your shin and immediately kick back before his foot has landed. Watch any Muay Thai fight, a rear leg kick by fighter A is blocked by a left shin block from fighter B and as soon as the block is over fighter B counters with a hard low or mid kick.

You can come into his arc but you do not walk in straight, why? Because it doesnt take much to turn a Thai kick into a knee kick... understand? Unless of course no one knows this technique then no worries, but just for the record, its an easy technique and is used to attack when your opponent closes your kicking distance.

The best way to cut an arc is not to come in straight, example: I kick a rear leg you then move in a diagonal line to my left side, not straight... if you come in straight with your hands up to start boxing your are getting a hard knee kick to your side... it happens, study fights, and it will slow you down or stop you.

If you move in a diagonal line you will take away my ability to knee kick you and also remove the power from my kick, from there you can punch or go into clinch.

Try it on a heavy bag, stand in range of the bag, now kick it, now shorten the distance so the bag is inside your kicking range, now kick it but strike with your knee! how simple is that and watch the bag swing... get it?

*I forgot to mention this does require decent felxabilty*

If I kick you, rear leg kick, you can throw a hard rear leg "teep" (push kick) to my torso, knocks me off my feet, or you can goi for a catch... if you take the catch option remember to move with the kick, no good catching a kick only to find yourself gasping for air cos its just knocked the wind out of you....

...as I have always said, you gotta train Muay Thai to know hwo to defend agaisnt Muay Thai. There are many effective and very simple counters and evasions to kicks etc.



[This message has been edited by MuayThai (edited 10-03-2004).]

[QUOTE]Originally posted by JKogas:
A counter kick (cut kick) is ok. But to hit the groin? You'd almost have to do this with the toe of the shoe as with a savate kick. That would have to be an extremely precise attack. Wouldn't it be better to just try and cut kick the inner thigh itself as it's usually done?

But, wouldn't it even be better than THAT to keep both feet firmly planted on the ground and fire the hands? I think so.

-John[/QUOTE]

I agreed with your above post about the right. however a kick to the groin isnt infeasible. Considering that a strike to the groin doesnt take much power, then your strike can be more precise. Also since they are commencing attack with a kick the groin area is more accessable. The distance to travel from an inside knee or thigh strike to a groin hit is minimal. Take what you can get when you get it, instead of waiting for the one blow fight stopper.

[QUOTE]Originally posted by MuayThai:
...as I have always said, you gotta train Muay Thai to know hwo to defend agaisnt Muay Thai. There are many effective and very simple counters and evasions to kicks etc.
[This message has been edited by MuayThai (edited 10-03-2004).][/QUOTE]

Garbage. Although your commentary is great. Although, you can only change the kick when and if you chamber it - tell me how to do it without chambering or halfway through it's arc?

Benny the Jet beat champion MT fighters without even knowing or previously encountering thigh kicks.....

I think you have to train against people fighting using Thai methods, but you're not limited to "Thai defenses" against Thai attacks.

I'd mentioned stepping in the straight right vs. the Thai kick and it's worked very well. I ALSO think you have to know how to shield kicks as well.

Another way to handle kickers is the pressure them. Push them against the ropes, cage, wall , car, etc. and go to work. Taking them down (ground & pound) is also a good method for dealing with kickers and continually works well.

-John

I think the cross punch is the quickest retaliation. But a skilled fighter will fire them out of the blue or within a combo.

[QUOTE]Originally posted by Mark Hill:
Garbage. Although your commentary is great. Although, you can only change the kick when and if you chamber it - tell me how to do it without chambering or halfway through it's arc?

Benny the Jet beat champion MT fighters without even knowing or previously encountering thigh kicks.....[/QUOTE]


Garbage!!! haha... get yer facts right buddy, benny the jet has a ZERO lose record, apparently, its known and figths are recorded that he got his ass handed to him by Muay Thai fighters... want me to dig up references? Benny Fought Thai fighters on restricted rules! No clinching, no elbows etc.... The man Benny was a good full contact kickboxer when it came to Thaiboxing he was CRAP! he had his ass handed to him almost every time unless he changed rules to suit his fights. research it.


dont call me dumb mate, and what arer talking about "you can only change the kick when and if you chamber it - tell me how to do it without chambering or halfway through it's arc?"

explain??? I havnt a baldy what your on about.. Are you talking about changing a Kikcin into a knee kick when someone closes teh distance... if so then you obviously havtn a f'ing clue about Muay Thai or what a knee kick is!!! A knee kick is the same as a kick only you strike using your knee, the motion is the exact same as a kick but you strike with the knee, and again, if someone moves into my arc in a straight line if I can touch his shoulders or head with my hand then I can kick him.... look bud, the only best way to show you or prove my point is have you stand in front of me and come in at me in a straight line... I guarantee you will change your closing method. Remember, if i can touch you I can kick you. Is it so hard to accept my word over someone who doesnt fully train in Muay Thai evasion and counter (not meaning to offend) Sorry mate, I run no gym, I dont even train people most of the time but I have fought, and I have trained with and around chmpions who have fought at high levels... I know my Muay Thai and I know that walking into my arc in a straight line is a mistake. Mate even doing it without a kick is a task inteself... I wish I could just show you [IMG]http://www.fightingarts.com/forums/ubb/smile.gif[/IMG] that would clear all doubts you have in your head. trust me.

The best way to counter a Thai kick is by blocking it and using the other leg to kick before the other guy has set his kickin leg back down or using the teep to push him off balance.... punching or coming in to my kicking arc in a straight line is stupid! full stop. Try it. Why would we be taught to come in at a diagonal??? are you trying to tell me how it is?


Mark Hill, have you ever tried hitting someone with a cross punch when they are kicking you? Have you ever actually felkt a kick hit your side as your hands come up to punch?? I think not. Man do what you want, I couldnt give a damn, You have angered me and shown me you have absolutely no clue to fighting.... obviously you have not been fighting anyone worth their weight in gold.

A good kickiner will wind you as you try to close the distance to punch, as you punch you raise your arms, what happens... a perfect example can be found in a clip I posted a while back. Samkor, a good kicker kicked a good boxer around the ring, funnily enough the boxer tried to walk straight into samkors arc and countr by punching only to find himself beign kicked around the ring! Its not the only clip I have watched where a boxer will try to do the straight line closing and counter with a punch... do it if you want against a bad kicker but come against someone who can kick and your up s**t creek! a kick is hard and a kick will wind you unless you take the diagonal side step in thats why WE in Muay Thai train to close the arc by side stepping in on a diagonal line not straight, thats why WE in Muay Thai train to side step with a kick to catch it... obviously you havnt felt a kick.

[This message has been edited by MuayThai (edited 10-04-2004).]

[QUOTE]Originally posted by JKogas:
Another way to handle kickers is the pressure them. Push them against the ropes, cage, wall , car, etc. and go to work. Taking them down (ground & pound) is also a good method for dealing with kickers and continually works well.

-John[/QUOTE]

You make good points John, but what you really gotta do is go to a qaulity Thaiboxing gym and then test your evasive techniques there... they dont teach to walk in a straight line. As far as I know you arenot much of a kicker so I am only assuming you dont train with kicers so then dont have much experience with GOOD kickers... I dunno mate you can correct me if I am wrong.

Pressuring a kicker is a good thing if that kicker is a full contact kicboxer who doesnt know what to do UP CLOSE. I am only giving you knowledge as I havebeen given it and experienced it. I have tried walking into someones arc in a straight line (only to be corrected), it hurts, put it that way. I honestly dont know how you dont know this.

Would you like to challenge Mr Uriquidez on his record?

How do you change the kick to a knee when the lower part of the leg is extending? This would be chambered. If you do a commited kick, don't tell me you can do it as hard if you leave it open to changing it.....anyway, the knee is much worse.

Have you been hit in the head when you try and swap this? Beleive me, YOU won't want to.

"Is it so hard to accept my word over someone who doesnt fully train in Muay Thai evasion and counter"

Yeah that's the problem. John's problems stem from he doesn't train in Jun Fan Kung Fu. Whatever.

"The best way to counter a Thai kick is by blocking it and using the other leg to kick before the other guy has set his kickin leg back down or using the teep to push him off balance.... punching or coming in to my kicking arc in a straight line is stupid! full stop. Try it. Why would we be taught to come in at a diagonal??? are you trying to tell me how it is?"

Chan Cheuk Fai disagrees. He taught me some of this. He was Adam Watt's trainer at one stage. Do you know who Adam Watt is? I suppose he isn't "authentic" since he doesn't come from thr fabled Thailand.

"Mark Hill, have you ever tried hitting someone with a cross punch when they are kicking you? Have you ever actually felkt a kick hit your side as your hands come up to punch?? I think not. Man do what you want, I couldnt give a damn, You have angered me and shown me you have absolutely no clue to fighting.... obviously you have not been fighting anyone worth their weight in gold."

Yes, it often works. Yes and it hurts, a lot. Oh I have angered the great god of muai thai, please forgive me [IMG]http://www.fightingarts.com/forums/ubb/biggrin.gif[/IMG], beleive me, they have been &%#$inhg good fighters....it's not compettive, but out fighting doesn't care for age or weight divisions.

Obviously you are delusional because I have been kiced many times. Samkor is a good fighter, not a good kicker.

"We step diagonal" - wow, maybe you can show that to the Hapkido and JKD groups [IMG]http://www.fightingarts.com/forums/ubb/wink.gif[/IMG]

http://www.angelfire.com/nj/thaiboxing/pics.html

just for you! Mark Hill, your amazing fighter Benny The jet getting his ass handed to him on only ONE occasion which there were many... even videos of his defeats but funnily enough non of his defeats are on his record .... hmmm....


ok, I will make you eat your words as soon as I find a few clips of benny being hammered by a few wirey looking underweight Thaiboxers.

http://members.aol.com/Thaiboxing2000/match.html

read that.

I aint saying benny is a crap fighter, he is a great FCKickboxing fighter but when there are knees, elbows, clinching, throws, kicking without foot protection and shin protection to any part of the body he is not what one would call "Great". I dont mean to question his ability it was you who brought him into teh conversation so tis me who is stating facts about him and his record against Muay Thai fighters..... his fights are world known.

Also, WKA is not a recognised Muay Thai sanctioning body, this is kickboxing. There may well be great Muay Thai fighters under WKA but it is not a recognised Muay Thai sanctioning body.



[This message has been edited by MuayThai (edited 10-04-2004).]

Who cares about a fight record or about the defensive aspects of as single attack? This thread is meant to be about footwork and how it works universally for a good fighter, not just Muay Thai way or JKd way. When will people learn that its not about you, or your sifu, its about knowledge that works regardless of the people or traditions behind it.

Also clean the language up or be booted from my otherwise peaceful forum. Thank you.

[QUOTE]Originally posted by Ryuoni:
I have accomplished much through self-taught martial arts, and sparring with friends, "friends" and "not so friendly" people, but my footwork is still lacking. So, if anyone could give me some pointers on extra drills to through into the mix, I will be more than happy to try them out. (I was just whomped by a friend today)My friend fought a superb kicking style and after my 10th consecutive stop-kick I started loosing balance. This is where she, yes she, took care of me. Seriously, any pointers would help.

Humbly I thank any replyers
~Brad~[/QUOTE]


From a fighting point of view, disregard I train in Muay Thai and look at it this way... if you want to remove the power from your attackers attack then you move WITH the attack. There are tapping drills. Two of you stand, one slaps you shoulder and you side step in teh direction of his slap, i.e. he slaps your left shoulder so you side step to teh right and also immediately slap his left shoulder as you side step. This will develop your counter evasion reflex.

With kicking its important to block using your shin or move with the kick, catching a kick require sthat you also move with the kick or risk a bruised or broken rib in the process of cacthing a hard kick. To close the distance, there seems to be different ways to do this, teh way we are taught is to close in a diagonal line also miving in the direction of the kick. Footwork is important, the first drill will help to develop your reflex and footwork timing, try to stay relaxed and dont alwasy slap in a patterned manner, i.e. when you slap your partner dont hit him 1 time left 1 time right but mix the pattern up so its never a set pattern, understand.

You want to develop footwork which will help to dispell power from yoru attackers attack, Jkogas mentions about riding punches, flowing with punches is a great way, but again, you must alwasy remember never to stick with the method as a "smart" fighter will pick up on that very quickly and then use this to his advantage.

just my cents worth.

I have a question about a technique in which we are taught. It is called a double arm block and is used when some tries to give you a roundhouse. As the kick comes up you turn towards the kick and stike the opponents shins with both of your forearms as soon as you hit his shins you lunge forward and begin to double blast.
Now in our system we condition our forearms and shins extensively to be able to take the impact. When you really whip your leg towards and hit the forearms or elbow area it really hurts the shin and creates a huge opening. I have never tested this in the street and I am curious as to how effective this would be. ANy thoughts??
I know MT will have fun with this one [IMG]http://www.fightingarts.com/forums/ubb/wink.gif[/IMG]

[QUOTE]Originally posted by Lethal Striker:
Now in our system we condition our forearms and shins extensively to be able to take the impact. When you really whip your leg towards and hit the forearms or elbow area it really hurts the shin and creates a huge opening. I have never tested this in the street and I am curious as to how effective this would be. ANy thoughts??[/QUOTE]


mate I know this. Its a difficult one to do (blocking a kick using your elbows) requires timing and a good sense of it! the technique can be seen on www.muaythai.com

I think with proper timing (which can only be developed through sparring) then why not. I dont do it, I'd rather bring my arm in close to my body, like to defend against a body punch but move with the kick and with the other hand try and lock the opponents kick into my arm but twist my torso in the same direction so he will then be side turned to me, actually a little more than side turned, he will be basicly showing me his back.... well you know what can be done from there. Or simply catch his leg and go for a takedown or knee strike.

its up to you but I am beginning to notice that with fighting there is only so many ways to do teh same thing.

Hi Guys

I'll have to agree that Thai foot work is among the most effective....there is a definite "no nonsense" approach in the foot work...

I also like the evasive nature of Arnis/Escrima/Kali foot work...the triangular movement is fantastic at long and short range......

In the system that I study (more of a "street smart" system).... we merge these types of footwork....The Stance accompanies the change...if we are at kick range...an open muay Thai stance is employed....if we are at punch range...a boxing stance is employed (slightly deeper, hands held closer to the head for cover and the back heal off the ground) and at close range...we are at a Thai grapple (sometimes on the tips of our toes with hips thrust forward).......at this range we would look for a takedown/shoot....and at ground level we extend into BJJ...

In a multiple attacker situation.....once again a combination of Arnis/Escrima/Kali and Aikido evasive footwork......(with varying techniques).....

I've had an opportunity of being exposed to different methods of footwork from many different systems......my opinion is that no system has the "correct" footwork........all of the systems together do.....

The Wolf

[QUOTE]Originally posted by MuayThai:

From a fighting point of view, disregard I train in Muay Thai and look at it this way... if you want to remove the power from your attackers attack then you move WITH the attack. There are tapping drills. Two of you stand, one slaps you shoulder and you side step in teh direction of his slap, i.e. he slaps your left shoulder so you side step to teh right and also immediately slap his left shoulder as you side step. This will develop your counter evasion reflex.

With kicking its important to block using your shin or move with the kick, catching a kick require sthat you also move with the kick or risk a bruised or broken rib in the process of cacthing a hard kick. To close the distance, there seems to be different ways to do this, teh way we are taught is to close in a diagonal line also miving in the direction of the kick. Footwork is important, the first drill will help to develop your reflex and footwork timing, try to stay relaxed and dont alwasy slap in a patterned manner, i.e. when you slap your partner dont hit him 1 time left 1 time right but mix the pattern up so its never a set pattern, understand.

You want to develop footwork which will help to dispell power from yoru attackers attack, Jkogas mentions about riding punches, flowing with punches is a great way, but again, you must alwasy remember never to stick with the method as a "smart" fighter will pick up on that very quickly and then use this to his advantage.

just my cents worth.[/QUOTE]

This has been the most helpful part of this entire thred, I thank you for your insight. I have been practicing with friends (on ein Tae Kwon Do, and one in Karate) after training with another universal fighter for the past few days, trying to mix up what you guys were saying, and still got whomped. But thats ok because, I had never thaught about traveling with the kick to lesson the blow, this will suly help in my next spar. Thank you all (who posted to help, not just to bash).

~Brad~

While most of these defences against round kicks, are work, a simple thing to do(though it requires some practice to develope the
timing necessary)is simply catch their leg then step in and sweep out their other leg and slam them down.
It takes experience but it works.

I just remembered a counter to that would be to underhook the arm they use to catch your leg, then grab their heaD WITH YOUR OTHER ARM ANDC TWIST THEM TO THE GROUND.

Mark Hill is completly correct! A proper muay thai kick is nearly impossible to dodge/block, and they are very powerful that if you took one full force, you are going to be in tremendous pain.

My muay thai master was the student of the best muay thai fighter, so famous that he was characterized in streetfighter. My master was undefeated and champion in the Oceana reigion. When he kicks, there is no way that you can effectively punch him. There is no way to get out of the way in time; it looks like a blur he is so fast. The power and force coming from one of his kicks would most likely break a bone and do some serious damage.

I would like to see you dodge, block, or counter that. Even though Jeet Kune Do is the art of the intercepting fist, Bruce Lee stressed adaptability, and you are going to have to adapt and do something other than intercept an attack in some situations.

Open your mind to other people's thoughts. Sometimes they are right as Mark Hill is right on this matter.


[This message has been edited by Zatuichi (edited 10-28-2004).]

[QUOTE]Originally posted by Zatuichi:
Mark Hill is completly correct! A proper muay thai kick is nearly impossible to dodge/block, and they are very powerful that if you took one full force, you are going to be in tremendous pain.

My muay thai master was the student of the best muay thai fighter, so famous that he was characterized in streetfighter. My master was undefeated and champion in the Oceana reigion. When he kicks, there is no way that you can effectively punch him. There is no way to get out of the way in time; it looks like a blur he is so fast. The power and force coming from one of his kicks would most likely break a bone and do some serious damage.

I would like to see you dodge, block, or counter that. Even though Jeet Kune Do is the art of the intercepting fist, Bruce Lee stressed adaptability, and you are going to have to adapt and do something other than intercept an attack in some situations.

Open your mind to other people's thoughts. Sometimes they are right as Mark Hill is right on this matter.


[This message has been edited by Zatuichi (edited 10-28-2004).][/QUOTE]


Sagat Petchyindee,

300+ fights. Pretty amazing in his time, more ferocious than Ramon Dekkers. I dont think there are many fighters in the world today that equal this mans ferocity and thats in MMA and Muay Thai!!

[QUOTE]Originally posted by MuayThai:

Sagat Petchyindee,

300+ fights. Pretty amazing in his time, more ferocious than Ramon Dekkers. I dont think there are many fighters in the world today that equal this mans ferocity and thats in MMA and Muay Thai!![/QUOTE]


Thats the man, i forgot his name. Thanks for reminding me! You got to be a mad man to do that shizite. Mabey bruce lee could have matched his accomplishments if he did not follow his movie career and stuck to fighting.

Fight Well My Friends

The roundhouse is actually very easy to counter and defend against. This new group of boxing influenced martial artists seem to be hiding behind their arms, instead of using actual focused blocking techniques to set up an opening for counterattack. Everyone is just too used to the round kick sneaking up behind their left-lead stance. My forearms are plenty tough enough to stop a round kick, but for all you that haven't heard of dit da jow, just use a rushing right-lead straight line attack and you can usually close enough distance to null the kick and get the stop-hit, plus you can still keep your left up to shield from the kick. Personally, I usually just break into the arc of the kick and lock an eagle's claw onto their larnyx while sweeping the other leg. Either that, or I simply sidekick their shin on the way up, stopping it all together. It takes some practice, but works consistantly once mastered.

Put your feet shoulder width apart, take a small step forward with your left foot, stand on the balls of your feet and bend your knees abit. Now walk around your house this way. When you're going left move the left foot first, going right use the right foot first, moving forward use left, going back use right.

my only advice I can give is do the mirror drill; as boring as it may sound, it's a good way to develop a feel for your fighting measure as well as your opponent's. also when you move don't put the breaks on.

Actually, I never said a Muai Thai kick is impossible to block, or you shouldn't check, the "best" way to avoid is to move circular/45 degrees (bhind them) and nail another (turning) kick into their knee, calves, thigh, back or head, whatever suits.....

Blocking a turning kick to the THIGH with your hands......? I have broken people's hands who do this. To the body, use your arms, but we discourage blocking this way when the kick is targeting below the hip.

Thigh kicks are no magic bullet. But I know how much damage they can do, and if they strike the correct nerve points, you go down. I saw this happen at the last black belt grading I was at. It didn't "hurt" (too much, that is), but the guy, a 3rd Dan and former boxer simply couldn't move his legs.

MT, the sites you provide are not objective. "Benny the Jet getting smoked".....and one kick of a final round of a six round fight as the "tell all" expose?

Why didn't he fight more MT?

Why don't "Lumpinnee" Champions fight in the UFC then? It's a stupid bloody question, they've got more valuable thigns to do, you know, like having a life.

[QUOTE]Originally posted by Mark Hill:
Thigh kicks are no magic bullet. But I know how much damage they can do, and if they strike the correct nerve points, you go down. I saw this happen at the last black belt grading I was at. It didn't "hurt" (too much, that is), but the guy, a 3rd Dan and former boxer simply couldn't move his legs.

MT, the sites you provide are not objective. "Benny the Jet getting smoked".....and one kick of a final round of a six round fight as the "tell all" expose?

Why didn't he fight more MT?

Why don't "Lumpinnee" Champions fight in the UFC then? It's a stupid bloody question, they've got more valuable thigns to do, you know, like having a life.[/QUOTE]


They dont fight in UFC as there is more glory in Muay Thai for them, when they reach Lumpinee fight level usually they are a couple of years from retirement, also they are almost always 60-67kg weight.

I have no doubt in my mind that if these guys were to train a little in ground fighting, as they do have standup wrestling, (dont be mislead into believeing they are weak at standup wrestling, its very similar to Greco Roman only with striking) they do well in UFC... the reality is they dont want to fight in UFC. One Thai named Buakaw, I dont know if you have ever witnessed this "Machine" ever fight, he is the first to ever start fighting in K-1, he cleaned up easily, he even danced between rounds!!

I think through time we may see more Thais coming to the west to compete in western sanctioned events, maybe even UFC, who knows but I know for sure when they do they will rattle a few cages. You gotta respect them, they start training from as early as 4 then start fighting professional FULL Muay Thai by the age of 14 and by 16 maybe 17years old these guys have nothced up 30+ fights! It's in their blood and I'm sure any UFC champion has the most highest respect for Thai boxers coming from Thailand, you gotta have, you simply cannot appreciate the skill level and determination shown by these guys. They are strong and if you have never fought one then you can only assume, they are like trains, you hit them but they keep moving forward, the harder you attack the harder they come back, very tough fighters.