Posted by: boxing_kid
coffee before working out - 01/19/06 10:36 PM
is having a coffee on a regular basis bad before a workout? if so, why?
coffee before working out
Posted by: Borrek
Re: coffee before working out - 01/19/06 11:16 PM
coffee is just liquid stress! it causes adrenaline production and increases your heart rate. Its also a diuretic that will adversely impact your hydration.
on the list of bad things to ingest before working out its not real high up, but its not great for you either.
on the list of bad things to ingest before working out its not real high up, but its not great for you either.
Posted by: Cord
Re: coffee before working out - 01/20/06 02:27 AM
Absolutely correct. Whilst caffeine is a stimulant, it does your workout no favours at all. Why start a workout with a high resting heart rate, that then gets pushed higher with exertion? Its particularly bad if you are using heart rate monitoring to guage recovery time in HIIT or fartlek training.
Stick with water.
Stick with water.
Posted by: comptech35
Re: coffee before working out - 01/20/06 11:51 AM
Coffee before a work out is actually not bad for you(in moderation). If you have a cup or two before a workout (weight lifting primarily) it will actually give you more energy through the caffeine to keep the workout going longer. It would be like putting nos in the intake of a car. Caffeine will do the same for your body during a workout.
I'm not saying drink a pot before heading to the gym though.
Keep it in moderation and your body won't be directly effected, in a negative manner, by the stimulant.
But a cup or two about a half hour to an hour before a workout is perfectly fine, and may even help your workout go longer and maybe even stronger than usual.
I'm not saying drink a pot before heading to the gym though.
Keep it in moderation and your body won't be directly effected, in a negative manner, by the stimulant.
But a cup or two about a half hour to an hour before a workout is perfectly fine, and may even help your workout go longer and maybe even stronger than usual.
Posted by: Supremor
Re: coffee before working out - 01/20/06 03:32 PM
Quote:
Coffee before a work out is actually not bad for you(in moderation). If you have a cup or two before a workout (weight lifting primarily) it will actually give you more energy through the caffeine to keep the workout going longer. It would be like putting nos in the intake of a car. Caffeine will do the same for your body during a workout.
I'm not saying drink a pot before heading to the gym though.
Keep it in moderation and your body won't be directly effected, in a negative manner, by the stimulant.
But a cup or two about a half hour to an hour before a workout is perfectly fine, and may even help your workout go longer and maybe even stronger than usual.
I don't agree. Caffeine can give you the feeling of having more energy, but infact you are paying for that extra energy because your heart rate is increased.
Do as Cord says- stick with good ol fashion water, no sports drinks, no lager, just h20. You may feel good having just taken the coffee, but give it an hour, and you'll have one hell of a comedown.
Posted by: Cownose
Re: coffee before working out - 01/20/06 06:06 PM
I have heard of coffee being used as a pre-workout stimulant, but honestly, I don't think anyone other than advanced powerlifters or bodybuilders should even be thinking about trying things like that. The difference those sort of things make is definitely miniscule.
Posted by: MikeMartial
Re: coffee before working out - 01/20/06 07:22 PM
Cord, I'm surprised you didn't back this up, since there's a ton of research done, and being done in this area...
Central nervous system effects of caffeine and adenosine on fatigue.
Davis JM, Zhao Z, Stock HS, Mehl KA, Buggy J, Hand GA. Am J Physiol Regul Integr Comp Physiol. 2003 Feb;284(2):R399-404.
Department of Exercise Science, Schools of Public Health and Medicine, University of South Carolina, Columbia, SC.
Caffeine ingestion can delay fatigue during exercise, but the mechanisms remain elusive. This study was designed to test the hypothesis that blockade of central nervous system (CNS) adenosine receptors may explain the beneficial effect of caffeine on fatigue. Initial experiments were done to confirm an effect of CNS caffeine and/or the adenosine A(1)/A(2) receptor agonist 5'-N-ethylcarboxamidoadenosine (NECA) on spontaneous locomotor activity. Thirty minutes before measurement of spontaneous activity or treadmill running, male rats received caffeine, NECA, caffeine plus NECA, or vehicle during four sessions separated by approximately 1 wk. CNS caffeine and NECA (intracerebroventricular) were associated with increased and decreased spontaneous activity, respectively, but caffeine plus NECA did not block the reduction induced by NECA. CNS caffeine also increased run time to fatigue by 60% and NECA reduced it by 68% vs. vehicle. However, unlike the effects on spontaneous activity, pretreatment with caffeine was effective in blocking the decrease in run time by NECA. No differences were found after peripheral (intraperitoneal) drug administration. Results suggest that caffeine can delay fatigue through CNS mechanisms, at least in part by blocking adenosine receptors.
Caffeine and exercise: metabolism, endurance and performance. Graham TE. Sports Med. 2001;31(11):785-807.
Human Biology and Nutritional Sciences, University of Guelph, Ontario, Canada.
Caffeine is a common substance in the diets of most athletes and it is now appearing in many new products, including energy drinks, sport gels, alcoholic beverages and diet aids. It can be a powerful ergogenic aid at levels that are considerably lower than the acceptable limit of the International Olympic Committee and could be beneficial in training and in competition. Caffeine does not improve maximal oxygen capacity directly, but could permit the athlete to train at a greater power output and/or to train longer. It has also been shown to increase speed and/or power output in simulated race conditions. These effects have been found in activities that last as little as 60 seconds or as long as 2 hours. There is less information about the effects of caffeine on strength; however, recent work suggests no effect on maximal ability, but enhanced endurance or resistance to fatigue. There is no evidence that caffeine ingestion before exercise leads to dehydration, ion imbalance, or any other adverse effects. The ingestion of caffeine as coffee appears to be ineffective compared to doping with pure caffeine. Related compounds such as theophylline are also potent ergogenic aids. Caffeine may act synergistically with other drugs including ephedrine and anti-inflammatory agents. It appears that male and female athletes have similar caffeine pharmacokinetics, i.e., for a given dose of caffeine, the time course and absolute plasma concentrations of caffeine and its metabolites are the same. In addition, exercise or dehydration does not affect caffeine pharmacokinetics. The limited information available suggests that caffeine non-users and users respond similarly and that withdrawal from caffeine may not be important. The mechanism(s) by which caffeine elicits its ergogenic effects are unknown, but the popular theory that it enhances fat oxidation and spares muscle glycogen has very little support and is an incomplete explanation at best. Caffeine may work, in part, by creating a more favourable intracellular ionic environment in active muscle. This could facilitate force production by each motor unit.
And those are just two of the countless studies.
So brew up a pot and hit the gym, boys.
Central nervous system effects of caffeine and adenosine on fatigue.
Davis JM, Zhao Z, Stock HS, Mehl KA, Buggy J, Hand GA. Am J Physiol Regul Integr Comp Physiol. 2003 Feb;284(2):R399-404.
Department of Exercise Science, Schools of Public Health and Medicine, University of South Carolina, Columbia, SC.
Caffeine ingestion can delay fatigue during exercise, but the mechanisms remain elusive. This study was designed to test the hypothesis that blockade of central nervous system (CNS) adenosine receptors may explain the beneficial effect of caffeine on fatigue. Initial experiments were done to confirm an effect of CNS caffeine and/or the adenosine A(1)/A(2) receptor agonist 5'-N-ethylcarboxamidoadenosine (NECA) on spontaneous locomotor activity. Thirty minutes before measurement of spontaneous activity or treadmill running, male rats received caffeine, NECA, caffeine plus NECA, or vehicle during four sessions separated by approximately 1 wk. CNS caffeine and NECA (intracerebroventricular) were associated with increased and decreased spontaneous activity, respectively, but caffeine plus NECA did not block the reduction induced by NECA. CNS caffeine also increased run time to fatigue by 60% and NECA reduced it by 68% vs. vehicle. However, unlike the effects on spontaneous activity, pretreatment with caffeine was effective in blocking the decrease in run time by NECA. No differences were found after peripheral (intraperitoneal) drug administration. Results suggest that caffeine can delay fatigue through CNS mechanisms, at least in part by blocking adenosine receptors.
Caffeine and exercise: metabolism, endurance and performance. Graham TE. Sports Med. 2001;31(11):785-807.
Human Biology and Nutritional Sciences, University of Guelph, Ontario, Canada.
Caffeine is a common substance in the diets of most athletes and it is now appearing in many new products, including energy drinks, sport gels, alcoholic beverages and diet aids. It can be a powerful ergogenic aid at levels that are considerably lower than the acceptable limit of the International Olympic Committee and could be beneficial in training and in competition. Caffeine does not improve maximal oxygen capacity directly, but could permit the athlete to train at a greater power output and/or to train longer. It has also been shown to increase speed and/or power output in simulated race conditions. These effects have been found in activities that last as little as 60 seconds or as long as 2 hours. There is less information about the effects of caffeine on strength; however, recent work suggests no effect on maximal ability, but enhanced endurance or resistance to fatigue. There is no evidence that caffeine ingestion before exercise leads to dehydration, ion imbalance, or any other adverse effects. The ingestion of caffeine as coffee appears to be ineffective compared to doping with pure caffeine. Related compounds such as theophylline are also potent ergogenic aids. Caffeine may act synergistically with other drugs including ephedrine and anti-inflammatory agents. It appears that male and female athletes have similar caffeine pharmacokinetics, i.e., for a given dose of caffeine, the time course and absolute plasma concentrations of caffeine and its metabolites are the same. In addition, exercise or dehydration does not affect caffeine pharmacokinetics. The limited information available suggests that caffeine non-users and users respond similarly and that withdrawal from caffeine may not be important. The mechanism(s) by which caffeine elicits its ergogenic effects are unknown, but the popular theory that it enhances fat oxidation and spares muscle glycogen has very little support and is an incomplete explanation at best. Caffeine may work, in part, by creating a more favourable intracellular ionic environment in active muscle. This could facilitate force production by each motor unit.
And those are just two of the countless studies.
So brew up a pot and hit the gym, boys.
Posted by: boxing_kid
Re: coffee before working out - 01/21/06 04:22 PM
wow great answer man thanks a lot, you definately did your research, i don't always drink coffee before working out anyways, only on occassions when i'm really tired
Posted by: Cord
Re: coffee before working out - 01/22/06 04:01 AM
Quote:
Cord, I'm surprised you didn't back this up, since there's a ton of research done, and being done in this area...
I dont agree with stimulant use in conjunction with exertion
Quote:
Caffeine ingestion can delay fatigue during exercise, but the mechanisms remain elusive ........ The mechanism(s) by which caffeine elicits its ergogenic effects are unknown , but the popular theory that it enhances fat oxidation and spares muscle glycogen has very little support and is an incomplete explanation at best. Caffeine may work, in part, by creating a more favourable intracellular ionic environment in active muscle. This could facilitate force production by each motor unit.
What you have there is a very technical way of saying 'caffeine works, but we havent a clue why!'. If you dont know how something affects your physiology, then you cant conclude the risks it places on your physiology, simple as that.
That is why i dont skip along to starbucks before a workout, anymore than i pop a handfull of ephedrine capsules, snort a line of coke, or drop a speedball
My heart has enough stress to contend with from the exertion I place upon it.It is my personal opinion based on common sense that using a substance that raises resting heart rate, blood pressure, and acts as a diuretic, presents a significant risk as great as any percieved performance improvement it offers.
The field of sports performance is full of contradiction, as for top performance, one often has to sacrifice health, not improve it. If you are aiming for, and close to international fame and fortune from your sport, then its a calculated risk that you may choose to take; if you are just wanting to add 4lbs to your max bench in your garage, such a risk is absolute lunacy.
Posted by: gojuwarrior1
Re: coffee before working out - 01/22/06 09:22 AM
trash the coffee and instead down some fresh juice! Coffee actually reduces the % we use the brain (so i've read).
Posted by: MikeMartial
Re: coffee before working out - 01/23/06 12:36 AM
Quote:
I dont agree with stimulant use in conjunction with exertion
Fair enough, you are entitled to your opinion. But being an extremely knowledgable poster here, you just caught me off guard, that's all
Quote:
What you have there is a very technical way of saying 'caffeine works, but we havent a clue why!'
Very true, but that's not a reason not to use it, by any means. I'd have to say up to 75% of the prescription drugs listed in the Compendium of Pharmaceuticals and Specialties (The PDR of Canada) are in the "mechanism unknown" category. They know it's safe, they know it works, but they don't know why.
Quote:
That is why i dont skip along to starbucks before a workout, anymore than i pop a handfull of ephedrine capsules, snort a line of coke, or drop a speedball
C'mon, that's weak. You can't group coffee/caffiene with drugs like that. There's a huge difference between a safe ergogenic and a dangerous illict drug, regardless if both are classified as stimulants.
Quote:
It is my personal opinion based on common sense that using a substance that raises resting heart rate, blood pressure, and acts as a diuretic, presents a significant risk as great as any percieved performance improvement it offers.
Risk? All the studies I've ever seen prove its one of the safest ergogenics around. It causes no electrolyte imbalance secondary to its MILD diuretics properties (which is easily nullified by proper hydration in the first place), and while having beta-1 and beta-2 receptor action, it's NO where near the same effect as ephedrine. Cocaine induced cardiac arrest? Sure. Ephedrine-related stroke? Very possible.
Coffee-related death? Um, no, sorry. Maybe coffee-induced jitters, lol, but then you've known you've had too much anyways.
Is there potential for harm? Of course, as with anything. But drinking too much water or eating too much whey will kill you also.
Know anyone with asthma, and they hit on a salbutamol MDI prior to going to the gym? Well, it's got more cardiovascular side effects than a cup of coffee, yet it's perfectly safe for an athlete with exercise-induced asthma to use.
Like I said, if it's your personal opinion, fine. But don't call it "significantly risky" in any way, because it isn't.
It's safe. It works. Period.
Posted by: Cord
Re: coffee before working out - 01/23/06 04:41 AM
Prior to a medical, a fitness test, or a elecrostat bodyfat test, it is standard protocol to ensure the avoidance of caffeinated drinks as it renders all readings/tests about as accurate as fairground fortune teller.
'Red Bull' and equivalent high caffeine/taurine drinks have been cited as contributory factors to several fatalities worldwide, and are illegal in Chille!
As for the caffeine/illegal stimulant connection being 'weak', well essentialy the stresses placed on the body are very similar- much less intense I grant you, but still similar.
The reliance on coffe as a staple part of the daily diet is an obsession that was until fairly recently peculiar to the north americas and their sacred 'pot of joe', now the whole western world seems to believe its incapable of surviving an hour without a cup of coffe
I dont think a cup of coffe is the greatest evil in the world, but it is a stimulant legal/illegal they are what they are. Alcohol is a legal and almost encouraged part of british culture, but its still harmful if abused. Same with coffe. How many times do you hear someone say 'i just cant start my day without a coffe?' or 'I have a lot on, its gonna be a 3 pot day'? A dependance, physical or psychological on a stimulant, legal or illegal, is not a good thing. Especialy if that dependance and continual intake results in continual artificial elavation of heart rate and blood pressure at rest.
People suffering heart conditions/desease are strongly advised to abstain from caffeine due to this additional stress.
As for the scientific research and its validity, you presented an article as conclusive research of caffeine's harmless benefits. I simply pointed out that behind the jargon lay nothing but hypothesis and conjecture.
Having clarified this allows people to make an informed choice, rather than taking something as gospel truth due to the use of scientific vocabulary.
'Red Bull' and equivalent high caffeine/taurine drinks have been cited as contributory factors to several fatalities worldwide, and are illegal in Chille!
As for the caffeine/illegal stimulant connection being 'weak', well essentialy the stresses placed on the body are very similar- much less intense I grant you, but still similar.
The reliance on coffe as a staple part of the daily diet is an obsession that was until fairly recently peculiar to the north americas and their sacred 'pot of joe', now the whole western world seems to believe its incapable of surviving an hour without a cup of coffe
I dont think a cup of coffe is the greatest evil in the world, but it is a stimulant legal/illegal they are what they are. Alcohol is a legal and almost encouraged part of british culture, but its still harmful if abused. Same with coffe. How many times do you hear someone say 'i just cant start my day without a coffe?' or 'I have a lot on, its gonna be a 3 pot day'? A dependance, physical or psychological on a stimulant, legal or illegal, is not a good thing. Especialy if that dependance and continual intake results in continual artificial elavation of heart rate and blood pressure at rest.
People suffering heart conditions/desease are strongly advised to abstain from caffeine due to this additional stress.
As for the scientific research and its validity, you presented an article as conclusive research of caffeine's harmless benefits. I simply pointed out that behind the jargon lay nothing but hypothesis and conjecture.
Having clarified this allows people to make an informed choice, rather than taking something as gospel truth due to the use of scientific vocabulary.
Posted by: MikeMartial
Re: coffee before working out - 01/23/06 02:07 PM
Points well taken, Cord. Just wanted to clarify our side, not butt heads.
Here an excellent article on Caffeine
It gets into more mechanisms of action in greater detail, as well as precautions and side effects. A great read.
Here an excellent article on Caffeine
It gets into more mechanisms of action in greater detail, as well as precautions and side effects. A great read.