Bodyweight Exercises - No Real Results
Posted by: FitnessFreak
Bodyweight Exercises - No Real Results - 06/28/05 05:41 PM
Hi, I am hoping someone here can help me.
I am 6' and 11 stone (154lb), and somewhat of a hard-gainer.
About a year ago I decided I needed to bulk up.
But due to limited time I never got around to joining a gym.
The only exercises I do are bodyweight exercises (push-ups, sit-ups, chin-ups, tricep dips etc.) and a lot of running.
Now, one year later, any muscles I hade are a lot more toned/defined but I have not put on any weight or gotten much stronger even thought I now look it.
Since I have a low body-fat it is easier for muscles to show through. But if I want to get stronger should I ditch the body-weight exercises and start using weights, or is there an alternative.
I have set routine for different parts of body on different days and running on different days.
I have not changed my diet or anything, should I do something about this aswell ?
Result: I look stronger without actually being stronger.
Where did I go wrong?
Posted by: JumpinJackFlash
Re: Bodyweight Exercises - No Real Results - 06/28/05 06:48 PM
Ok first of all don't label yourself a hardgainer when you haven't actually done anything to put on mass.
Ditch the bodyweight exercises and go with weights.
If you don't eat more you won't gain weight.
Posted by: knightcommander
Re: Bodyweight Exercises - No Real Results - 06/28/05 08:51 PM
ROFL.
Bodyweight exercises will not put any muscle on you. It may make your nervour system stronger, but it doesn nothing for muscle mass.
Why do you think Charles Atlas got Prosecuted for fraud after claiming he got as big as he was doing his crappy bodyweight exercises.
Progressive poundages in perfect form is how you get big. That and eat big.
Join a gym, and start using the weights.
Posted by: madmattg
Re: Bodyweight Exercises - No Real Results - 06/28/05 09:00 PM
Quote:
ROFL.
Bodyweight exercises will not put any muscle on you. It may make your nervour system stronger, but it doesn nothing for muscle mass.
Why do you think Charles Atlas got Prosecuted for fraud after claiming he got as big as he was doing his crappy bodyweight exercises.
Progressive poundages in perfect form is how you get big. That and eat big.
Join a gym, and start using the weights.
Well said, BW exercises are designed for muscles memory and endurance nothing to do with muscle mass. Combined with running and you say lots of running its counter productive as far as mass and strength.
Yes you can combine both, but its through weights and running.
Posted by: JumpinJackFlash
Re: Bodyweight Exercises - No Real Results - 06/29/05 12:25 AM
To be fair you can put weight on with dips, pullups, and some other exercises. The knee-jerk backlash against bodyweight exercises some people have is just as silly a position as the one of those who hold them to be the one and only form of exercise.
Posted by: Meanstreak
Re: Bodyweight Exercises - No Real Results - 06/29/05 02:38 AM
Fitnessfreak,
try making your bodyweight exercises harder (therefore requiring more strength) by altering the exercises.
pushups try doing them on one leg. Or elevate your legs, ie your legs on your bed - hands on the floor. When either of these are too easy combine the two.
Also look at these sites for ideas.
http://www.trainforstrength.com/index.shtmlhttp://www.combatfitness.co.uk/http://www.cbass.com/Pavel%27sLadders.htmhttp://bodybuildbid.com/articles/miscellan/workwoutwts.htmle
Posted by: Supremor
Re: Bodyweight Exercises - No Real Results - 06/29/05 07:01 AM
I agree with Meanstreak. The idea that bodywieght exercises cannot be used to gain muscle is wrong.
The reason few people gain size with BW is that theyn train easy exercises, e.g. push ups, for long periods of time. This in not good for strength.
However, using weights is just using large resistance, there's nothing about the weights themselves that make you gain muscle, just the resistance they cause. So it is possible to gain weight using your own body as resistance. Try for instance, one-arm, one-leg push-ups. Or maybe one leg squats. Then try elevating your legs for one-arm push-ups. There are millions of ways to increase resistance for BW exercises.
Here's the downside though: With weights you have far more control over how much weight you lift- it is more scientific and more quantifiable. BW excersises, although being pretty good, do not have the same efficiency as weight lifting, since you cannot isolate muscle groups easily.
BUT... If you want functuional strength, then I think BW exercises are the only way to go. They get your brain used to utilizing all the muscles in your body for a desired action, unlike weights, which while building muscle, do not do that much for functional strength.
Posted by: Cord
Re: Bodyweight Exercises - No Real Results - 06/29/05 09:31 AM
Quote:
Hi, I am hoping someone here can help me.
I am 6' and 11 stone (154lb), and somewhat of a hard-gainer.
About a year ago I decided I needed to bulk up.
But due to limited time I never got around to joining a gym.
The only exercises I do are bodyweight exercises (push-ups, sit-ups, chin-ups, tricep dips etc.) and a lot of running...
Where did I go wrong?
Bodyweight exercises are not the best way to increase strength or mass. Lots of running and bodyweight work on a naturaly 'skinny' frame will give you what you have, a wiry defined look ( a bit like Iggy Pop 
),
You need to join a reputable gym, get good quality instruction on basic lifts (squat, bench press, deadlifts, cleans, shrugs), moderate your cardio work so as to allow for a change in emphasis in your training, and start eating in such a way as to provide your body with the nutrition it needs to change in the way you wish.
If it is important to you, you will find/make the time to achieve your goals.
Good luck
Posted by: SkInHoUnD
Re: Bodyweight Exercises - No Real Results - 06/30/05 10:37 AM
I did pushups for a long time to work my chest, it bulked me up nicely but only so far, and it didnt give me the well roundedness in my pecs that benchpresses give. Most noteworthy though was what happened to my tricps...they exploded and became rock solid where they were very weak and invisible before. As time went on i'd do pushups with someones feat resting on my back but still no dynamic results. So it works to a degree. If your muscle is weak in a particular area i'd suggest begining with bodyweight before going onto weights.
Posted by: knightcommander
Re: Bodyweight Exercises - No Real Results - 06/30/05 10:39 AM
Quote:
I agree with Meanstreak. The idea that bodywieght exercises cannot be used to gain muscle is wrong.
The reason few people gain size with BW is that theyn train easy exercises, e.g. push ups, for long periods of time. This in not good for strength.
However, using weights is just using large resistance, there's nothing about the weights themselves that make you gain muscle, just the resistance they cause. So it is possible to gain weight using your own body as resistance. Try for instance, one-arm, one-leg push-ups. Or maybe one leg squats. Then try elevating your legs for one-arm push-ups. There are millions of ways to increase resistance for BW exercises.
Here's the downside though: With weights you have far more control over how much weight you lift- it is more scientific and more quantifiable. BW excersises, although being pretty good, do not have the same efficiency as weight lifting, since you cannot isolate muscle groups easily.
BUT... If you want functuional strength, then I think BW exercises are the only way to go. They get your brain used to utilizing all the muscles in your body for a desired action, unlike weights, which while building muscle, do not do that much for functional strength.
Thats exactly what Charles Atlas tried to say. He got prosecuted for fraud.
Training with weights is alot more practical than trying to do handstand one handed pushups.
Posted by: FitnessFreak
Re: Bodyweight Exercises - No Real Results - 07/01/05 03:12 PM
Thanks for all the info.
I'll get cracking at the weights soon nd add a bit more protein nd stuff to my diet.
But, at the same time, find a way to work in the bodyweight exercises, as they do have their benefits.
I never got a clear answer about the running thought. Should I just give it a rest while trying to gain mass, or are there ways to work it in?
Posted by: Cord
Re: Bodyweight Exercises - No Real Results - 07/01/05 06:58 PM
You will need to keep your cardio level 'ticking over'. You are not doing cardio for fat burning so that is not a problem. 30 mins cardio 3 times a week (alternate days) should be enough to maintain cardio fitness at a reasonable level, and leave plenty of time and energy to devote to your lifting.
Posted by: Gino
Re: Bodyweight Exercises - No Real Results - 07/02/05 10:03 AM
Quote:
I did pushups for a long time to work my chest, it bulked me up nicely but only so far, and it didnt give me the well roundedness in my pecs that benchpresses give. Most noteworthy though was what happened to my tricps...they exploded and became rock solid where they were very weak and invisible before.
I've had the same experience. Recently purchased a weighted vest and I now use it for my push-up routine. The increased resistance really blasts the chest, triceps and shoulder areas, and has also improved my bench press.
Posted by: BrRmBrawlr66
Re: Bodyweight Exercises - No Real Results - 07/07/05 04:53 AM
yeah you wont really see any real gains in mass or strength with bodyweight excercise alone. however, you dont necessarily have to get a gym membership to use weights. if you have a used or discout sporting goods store close to where you live, try to just buy some dumbells. thats what I did. also, just as someone else said, you wont gain any muscle mass of any kind without eating more. for one or two days, count how many calories you eat in the day. the day after that, add about 400-500 onto it. if you do this, and keep up a faithful workout program, you can gain roughly 1-2 lbs. per week. any more than 2 lbs a week though is very unhealthy, so monitor this closely. eventually you will hit a plateau, and when you do, (cant gain any more weight) kick up your calorie intake another 200-250 calories a day. its tough, but if you stay true to the diet, and the workout routine, you'll see some good results. also, make sure you're eating healthy calories. not all are created equally; ie, if i need to eat 2500 calories a day, so i sit and eat 4 bags of potato chips every day, it is really, really bad for me. but if i get my calories from good, healthy foods, (try 6 meals a day, smaller than usual ones, spaced out about 3 -3 1/2 hours a day) i will be a very happy martial artist.
it is also important to keep in mind that for most people, without the use of illegal drugs (anabolics, hormones) it is near impossible to gain muscle mass and weight without additional fat gains as well. no need to worry though you can always burn that off later.
good luck with your goals
Pil Sung
Erick Shields
Posted by: ta_kuan_dao
Re: Bodyweight Exercises - No Real Results - 07/07/05 11:52 PM
i would have to disagree with the notion that bodyweight exercises will get you no real gains in strength.
some of the strongest athletes alive are gymnasts and they use primarily bodweight exercises.
The key is to add an interesting modification to a bodyweight exercise so to make the exercise harder. Weights by themselves do not make you stronger. Resistance does.
"The Naked Warrior" by Pavel Tsatouline is a great source of info for bodyweight training.
But at the same time i believe that weight training is a great add on to any workout program. But be sure to use powerlifting or olympic lifting techs if u wish to build functional strength.
Posted by: SkInHoUnD
Re: Bodyweight Exercises - No Real Results - 07/08/05 09:30 AM
Well dont they say that modern body builders are relitivly weak compared to the body builders of old? I heard that body builders in the early 1900's used alot of body weight ecercises and in turn were extremly strong.Not only that these guys bodies were actually built differently..theyre muscles were emphasised differently...I guess it comes down to ethetics VS usefullness.
Posted by: tomh777
Re: Bodyweight Exercises - No Real Results - 07/10/05 01:54 PM
Hmm...no real gains in strength from doing handstand push ups or pull ups?...Funny thing is back in my weightlifting days I had to start with easier exercises like bent over rowing and lat pull down machines before I was ever strong enough to do pull ups. I had to do lots of military presses before I was ever strong enough to do handstand pushups. If you want bulk do the typical 3 sets of ten pull ups/3 sets of 10 handstand push ups/3 sets of 10 1 armed push ups, etc. When that becomes to easy, take several baggies fill them with sand put the baggies in a knapsack. Wear the knapsack during your workout and see what happens. As far as getting a so called buff body, bodyweight exercised won't do that for you because they're compound exercises rather than isolation exercises. If you want unbeatable strength and endurance check out "The Underground Guide to Warrior Fitness by Ross Enamait. The book is geared towards boxers, wrestlers, and MMA's. The routines will turn you into an absolute brute in the ring. All that being said even though I disagree with you about the strength issue, I do agree that barbells in general are an easier and quicker way to add mass.
Posted by: JasonM
Re: Bodyweight Exercises - No Real Results - 07/10/05 02:32 PM
How does Ross' book compare to Matt Fury's? I have Matt's book and it is cool, so I was wondering the comparison.
Also,I finally joined a gym, and I think I will use bodyweight and weights together...I have been toying the just BW or just Weights, I think I will use both for best of both worlds.
Thanks..
Posted by: tomh777
Re: Bodyweight Exercises - No Real Results - 07/10/05 09:35 PM
I've got Matt Furey's book too. It's what got me started on this whole bodyweight exercise thing in the first place. I think both "Combat Conditioning" and the "Underground Guide To Warrior Fitness" are both great books, but the best way to describe it is if Furey's book is an Escort then Enamaits book is a Jaguar. Enamaits book has a ton of different types of routines, has a thorough section on stretching, on diet, on the difference between aerobic and anaerobic conditioning, etc. My own training is probably about 65% Furey and 35% Enamait (I practice Aiki jutsu so I mostly need aerobic fitness and flexibility and not as much anaerobic fitness or strength.)
I tend to feel that Fureys book focus more on muscular endurance, flexibility, and aerobic fitness, whereas Enamait's book focuses more on strength and anaerobic conditioning.
Technically speaking Enamait's book is a whole lot better written but I think that it's good to have both books, mix and match, and decide what works for you.
The Underground Guide to Warrior Fitness is available on
warriorforce.com or
rossboxing.com .
Hope this helps
Posted by: mantraman
Re: Bodyweight Exercises - No Real Results - 07/12/05 12:29 AM
I like the underground guide as well. I think its very clear and straightforward. For a visual I would add the physical body because if you do matt furey's stuff you want the visual of an actual wrestler doing it at speed with the real balance between weighted exercises and bodyweight exercises which he misses and is integral, check:
http://www.thephysicalbody.com