Silly but True

Posted by: Outshined

Silly but True - 06/16/05 04:39 AM

I played rugby for two years.....Also, Iīm a Judoka.... The rugby rules say that you can grab an opponentīs body (except for neck and head)..so, I thought, during my last match....to be original....and, when a rival came with the ball, instead of tackling him, I applied him a hip throw. And then , the referee came across to me and smiled saying: "Beautiful Ippon, but....I canīt let you keep on playing", and showed me the red card.....The guy Iīve thrown .....Iīve helped him to land......donīt worry.....
Posted by: Foundation

Re: Silly but True - 06/16/05 08:08 AM

Now that's original!
On what rule did he send you off the field?
Posted by: MAGr

Re: Silly but True - 06/16/05 08:14 AM

Are you serious? On what rule? On the rule that you cannot use martial arts moves on people unless you are defending yourself!
Posted by: Foundation

Re: Silly but True - 06/16/05 09:06 AM

I meant rugby rule not martial arts rule.
I suppose he didn't throw him too hard and used a decent throw (like harai goshi and not o goshi or something like that, my throw knowledge diminished greatly in the 4 years I stopped judo)
I suppose that guy didn't get hurt or else it's bad indeed.
As long as it's a low throw it's just a fancy sweep if it isn't applied with power.
Posted by: MAGr

Re: Silly but True - 06/16/05 09:20 AM

You are kidding right? You cant use a martial arts throw in rugby for very simple reasons.

First and foremost its not sportsmanship!

Secondly, in judo you get taught how to fall, that guy probably did not know how to fall nor was he used to getting flipped. He could have easily broken his arm.

Thirdly, you can use the coordination/fitness/awareness/balance and all the other passive skills that you learnt in MA, but you should not use the active skills.

Fourth. Imagine someone who knows pressure points, do you think that he should be able to use them whilst playing basketball for example? do you think that its fair? why are throws any different?
Posted by: Foundation

Re: Silly but True - 06/16/05 10:35 AM

Maybe you didn't read the part that as long as it didn't hurt the other.
Have you ever seen a rugby match? It's strange the other got that close, I know someone who plays rugby, and once every 3 weeks he comes at school injured on a rugby match, he nearly lost an eye once when he fell with his head on the opponents knee, that's really violent stuff.
And if you're not allowed to do certain moves they usually make rules against that, for example there's the no touching rule in basketball.
Rugby has it's own takedown moves and they're usually more effective on the field.
Posted by: MAGr

Re: Silly but True - 06/16/05 10:51 AM

I have watched rugby and I do play rugby, and yes it is a violent sport, but when I play I am prepared to get taken dow, not flipped over someones back. It takes a specific type of falling to get used to getting flipped.
Yes...you said as long as it didnt hurt anyone, well....it could have, just because it didnt happen doesnt make it right.
Who said you are not allowed to touch in basketball? I am not talking about netball!
Anyway, the referee took him out for a reason, think about it!
Posted by: trevek

Re: Silly but True - 06/16/05 10:57 AM

Did he still have the ball?
Posted by: Foundation

Re: Silly but True - 06/16/05 11:08 AM

In basketball it's illegal to touch the others, maybe because you play rugby you have the habit to take the others down (the guy who I know that plays rugby does that, very irritating to play basketball against him)
But look at this extract from www.fiba.com
Quote:

A foul is an illegal action that can commit a player from one team to a player from the adverse team.

Basketball is generally said a non-contact game.

If, in particular occasion this is not respected, a foul is committed.

There are two types of fouls.

The first ones are called defensive fouls. They occur when the offensive player is being fouled by the defender. Defenders should not block, push, trip, strike or hold the player in possession of the ball.

The second ones are the offensive fouls. For example a player in offense commits an offensive foul when charging into a stationary defender.


Posted by: MAGr

Re: Silly but True - 06/16/05 11:41 AM

yeah ok Mr Dictionary, have you seen a basketball game? is there no contact whatsoever between the players?

Anyway, point being you should not use active, offensive MA techniques when playing other sports.
You dont agree fine, let the ref decide.

Stop being so childish, "But..but..but.. its not in the rule book...!"
They are not going to make rules for every little circumstance are they? are you going to argue with me that there isnt a rule about using judo throws in rugby? There isnt a rule specifically about using a bat to break someone's legs either but you'de get a red card for it.
Posted by: Foundation

Re: Silly but True - 06/16/05 12:57 PM

I'm not argueing, I trust outshined didn't use anything dangerous, and I'm sure he did it without power (and I still don't get how he did that throw, that guy must've been running full speed and trying to dodge outshined, it's quite a remarkable prestation)
And with a baseball bat the guy'd be hurt, if it's done with intentions to hurt, it's a bad thing.
The only bad thing is that it's a hip throw as I notice now, that's quite a hard throw if applied well, if I'd integrate judo in rugby (which I wouldn't because it totally lacks functionality) I'd go for sweeping a leg or so or anything low to the ground.
Posted by: Outshined

Re: Silly but True - 06/16/05 03:37 PM

Please.......I have a brain and I know that the other guy is a human being.....a) You canīt apply a sweep because technically......it is some kind of strike.....(it may be a soft one, but)..... b) The guy wasnīt going full power......he just grabbed the ball..... c) Iīve helped him to fall.......donīt worry..... about that....In my school we are thought to mainly..donīt try to harm the partner... d) The referee kicked me out because of "unsportmanship"....although I knew iīve deserved it....
Posted by: BuDoc

Re: Silly but True - 06/16/05 03:44 PM

Please read my Bio. I think you acted like an a$$.

You disservice Rugby and Judo.

Just because you can do somehing, doesn't mean you should .

Perhaps a little more training in one or both of them, or something else will teach you that.

Page
Posted by: Outshined

Re: Silly but True - 06/16/05 03:47 PM

Quote:

yeah ok Mr Dictionary, have you seen a basketball game? is there no contact whatsoever between the players?

Anyway, point being you should not use active, offensive MA techniques when playing other sports.
You dont agree fine, let the ref decide.

Stop being so childish, "But..but..but.. its not in the rule book...!"
They are not going to make rules for every little circumstance are they? are you going to argue with me that there isnt a rule about using judo throws in rugby? There isnt a rule specifically about using a bat to break someone's legs either but you'de get a red card for it.





Ehmmmmm....I donīt know if there is a rule for "unorthodox contact" (Indeed, thatīs why i decided to apply the throw (and, also, very very few judo throws are useful for defense) but...... Iīm pretty sure that there is one for "no foreign objects in the field" (a.k.a. baseball bat).....
Posted by: BuDoc

Re: Silly but True - 06/16/05 03:54 PM



(and,also,very very few judo throws are useful for defense)





Did You really just say that

Would someone please page Ed Glasheen!

Page
Posted by: Outshined

Re: Silly but True - 06/16/05 04:36 PM

Do you think Iīm proud of what I did??.....It was my last match....specially for the reprehensal I got from my coach.....He was right......you are right.....I acted like an $$.... I am not here to gain enemies....so, let me apologize... And about the usefulness of throws... O soto gari, tai otoshi , even a basic hip throw are useful......but....would you use a yoko gake, or obi otoshi, or tomoenage??
Posted by: ButterflyPalm

Re: Silly but True - 06/16/05 10:59 PM



I know exactly where you were coming from.

I played rugby, football, field-hockey and did judo, amongst other MAs. Many times I too was tempted to use some of those skills on a game-sport field (especially rugby, where opportunities abound) and many times I held myself back; imagine doing an innocent looking arm-bar and pretend to fall with him and then hide it all with other players who will be piling on top; he had no chnace to tap-out and for the few moments that he was under and with the referee taking time to decide to blow for break? It just didn't feel right or fair. Everyone who has ever played rugby knows what is permitted and what is not; rule books are uesful only when it comes before the disciplinary committee.

The fact that you brought this up shows you knew it was not right or fair and you wanted to, maybe, "come clean?"

The referee obviously knew some judo for him to say "beautiful ippon" Another one without this knowledge might have missed it completely.
Posted by: MAGr

Re: Silly but True - 06/17/05 05:49 AM

Hey, I wasnt laying into you. Just the person who tried to claim that it is a perfectly legal thing to do and that it should be allowed!
Accidents happen, and we do get carried away and the lines between sports fade since everything becomes physical. I used sticky hands once to get the ball away from the player when I played basketball once, and I did it completely as instinct.

obi otoshi is the one where you grab the inside armpit with your elbow joint? I dont remeber, its been a long time since judo.
Posted by: Foundation

Re: Silly but True - 06/17/05 06:55 AM

Quote:

Just the person who tried to claim that it is a perfectly legal thing to do and that it should be allowed!



That is as far as I know nobody, please repeat one sentence on this board where anyone says it should be allowed.
Posted by: MAGr

Re: Silly but True - 06/17/05 07:29 AM

isnt that what you implied by asking on what rule did you get a red card?
Posted by: Foundation

Re: Silly but True - 06/17/05 08:01 AM

No I was just curious, I don't know a lot about rugby, so I don't know the rules.
Posted by: Outshined

Re: Silly but True - 06/17/05 08:30 PM

Obi Otoshi= Belt Drop......
Posted by: Boomer

Re: Silly but True - 07/31/05 06:08 AM

I think it was actually a brilliant idea (even though I might get flamed for saying so). In high school, I applied martial arts to my football skills, and the results were great for me. Funny how much teisho uchi to the chin resembles a stiff arm and can give you an extra few yards on the run. Ever hear of people getting "run over" in a game? I've done it a few times, by executing almost a jumping front kick and planting my foot squarely in my would -be tackler's chest. On pass protection plays, being a smaller running back and having to block bigger defensive ends, I was continually able to chop block and shoot their legs, even sweep them on occasion with a leg whip.
You do what you can to come away with a win, and if you get reprimanded, you take the heat and move on. You never know what you can get away with until you try. Of course, I don't advocate attempting to injure your opponents....who would you play with then?
Posted by: eyrie

Re: Silly but True - 08/04/05 01:50 AM

When you say "football", do you mean gridiron, rugby, soccer, Aussie Rules, or Gaelic football????

I think the rules in Rugby are quite clear - throws, head high and stiff arm tackles are illegal, and are considered "dangerous play" and said player can be sent off (sin binned).
Posted by: Boomer

Re: Silly but True - 08/05/05 03:55 AM

Footbal...American style
Posted by: baby_bwoy

Re: Silly but True - 08/10/05 05:48 PM

haha
i do rugby aswell..ive been playing for about 3 years now for my school..i also use some martial arts throws when i tackle but the best one i belive was when someone tried a hand of but i grabed his wrist with my right arms and the rest of his arm with my left and swung him over my head..i guess from doing martial arts so long some situations where some one is coming at you act out of instinct..but when we play tackles are allowed as long as the person has the ball ,no strike is made, its not over neck hight , and the person isnt in mid air...