Sparring hatred

Recently i've been reading alot of posts, and noticing that there seems to be alot of general resentment towards sparring as a device for learning. It seems that many feel that there is no place in TKD for sparring, since it has not practical purpose within the art. I beg to strongly disagree, with one exception, sparring as a sport demands that one pulls their punches so to speak, and many moves that one would use for self defense are not used, since obviously they are intended to severally injure the attacker.

All these reasons aside, sparring teaches one thing that self defense training alone will not teach. Sparring teaches to watch you to move fast, to respond to counter. I've been in a few street fighting situations (No im not a gunslinger looking for trouble, I am a medic and run into alot of situations where we find oureselves in bad parts of town, in bad situations), and i know how fast things begin and end, in just a matter of seconds, having that skill of moving fast and responding and defending, i think is very helpful. Sparring teaches skill, accuracy, and responding to an attacker.

Does this general resentment towards sparring exist all across the board?

hi
I enjoy sparing. The problem is that everytime i spar i have to spar the black belts due to my size. I find myself being countered when i do pretty much every kick. Is there anything i can do to remerdy this?

I spar with pads, full contact, Olympic rules, 2 x per week, usually 3-3-4 min rounds, with higher belts. It makes a big difference. You learn application of techniques, footwork, distancing, timing, courage, controlled aggression. It gives you a way to think about applying what you learn in regular TKD class. Sparring is similar to drilling in the military. You fight like you train. When its on--you're ready.

I think sparring is the best way to train for real world fights, so long as you do it right. My school, for instance, uses thin shin and nuckle guards and is full contact (except there's no punching to the face or kicking the groin), and that seems to work very well.

JesusTheNinja-

You have the best username I've seen thus far. I think you deserve a prize.

I'll seccond that FoolsGold.

Chris

Haha. This is the fourth fourm I've been to that's said that.

Sparring teaches us how to conduct the many techniques we've learnt on a movng opponent. From sparring we gain the nessecary range skills.

Sparring is also a very good workout, if done properly.

Unfortunately in drilling 'sport' skills such as pulling punches and kicks, they don't become the gross motor skills that we need to rely on in a real fight situation.

For instance, my fastest and prefered technique when sparring is a front leg hooking kick. In fact I've won most of my titles using that technique. However, all this technique would do on the street is make my opponent more agressive.

I know a lot of TKD'ers that think that sparring enhances peripheral vision, but anyone in a fight situation will tell you that the adrenaline dump causes tunnel vision.

Also remember that sparring is conducted by two consenting individuals sticking to the same rules. In the street it doesn't happen that way.

Sparring is good, but it's not for the 'street arena'.

You have to ask yourself why you study TKD. If it's for sport and art, then TKD's got everything. If it's for street combat, then you need to think again - you will need to change your training to include pressure tests and tweak your techniques accordingly.

Atb,

Gaffer.

[This message has been edited by Gaffer (edited 10-16-2004).]

I think Gaffer as it about right, sparring is a good training device for may skills but it is not fighting in a true sence as you are not in danger (I hope not anyway!) of being badly injured if you slip up. Also rules for safety and fair play reduce your need to be ready for good fighting techniques which are not allowed. I have seen this many times when students from different schools or styles spar and come up against new things and are generally unable to handle these due to their habits developed in training. An eye gouged out or a joint dislocation a very effective ways to end a fight but are not nice to the victim and rightfully banned from sparring.

What are you talking about? Never heard one post of the guys bad mouthing sparring, it is the best way to jump in and get your feet wet. Without it you will never know a thing except static movement. That was a wierd thing to say? Hey man sparring is cool!

Sparring is one of the best training techniques you can use. As far as I am concerned it is an indespensable tool for learning to be more effective. Throw in the roleplay element(pushing, yelling, trash talking) and it will elevate the experience.
Sparring gets my vote!

[QUOTE]Originally posted by gangster_no1:
hi
I enjoy sparing. The problem is that everytime i spar i have to spar the black belts due to my size. I find myself being countered when i do pretty much every kick. Is there anything i can do to remerdy this?[/QUOTE]
Hi i got a few things that can help!
1. Sparring is not just physical but some what mental, so dont let the black belt status intimidate you I have to spar against black belts to (im a Blue belt) and I dont let the black belt intimidate me i dont even think or care about what rank my apponent is!
2.Belt rank doesnt really mean anything lots of times, in alot of casses black belts arent alaways what u think they are I can do kicks that that black belts do that I can do just as good as them and I can do some they cant do yet.Dont let the belt restrisct you if your master doesnt let u do some of the kicks black belts do practice them at home.
3.Read martial art books all kinds one I suggets is "the Book of Five Rings" By:Miamato Mushashi (I dont know if I spelled the first name right but the last name should be right!) thats a really good one! Just alot of books help alot but you have to put them to practice!
Well good luck and practice alot, and remember belt rank doesnt always mean everything!!!

ppl have yet to get over that sparring isnt a way of applying self defence techiniques of woteva its a god damn sport!! i dnt apply tkd sparring to real life situations just lke a rugby player prb doesnt apply rugby skills to real life situations. sparring rox. there seems to be a rival going on in the tkd community between old school traditionalist and new school conformists. the old school traditionalists seem concerned with the traditional way of things, patterns, self defence, n not much sparring, or when they do do sparring trying to inforce the other tkd stuff into it, whereas the new school reformists r concentrating on sparring, developing it, trying to find ways to be faster, stronger, game plan, and new stuff to try in the ring. they try to apply sparring to all the other stuff they do such as pad work n evn patterns. the old school traditionalists dnt seem to like this but hey, they arnt the ones trying out for the olympics, we are.

i really cant agree or disagree wit hanyone here on this topic.

i read previously in one of the previous posts that adrenaline causes tunnel vision. Yes, it can do that, but i belive that by doing frequent sparring, you get used to it, hence your adrenaline levels dont rise as high, enabling you to hit that point whereby you're fired up, but still in control.

Someone also said that sparring is no good for street fighting, and that it is "just a sport". So is every other martial arts when you pay to learn it lmao!

You can't expect to be doing taekwondo, and automatically be the best fighter on the streets (you shouldnt be lookin for fights anyway [IMG]http://www.fightingarts.com/forums/ubb/wink.gif[/IMG] ). It's how you apply the techniques that you learn through taekwondo, into instances whereby you're confronted in a dangerous environment. The techniques you learn in both Sparring, and Self defence, are equal in benefiting your ability to defend yourself against attackers.

Just a question for everyone, how many of you, since you've been doing taekwondo, have gone and actualy looked for fights?

im not having a go at anyone there, but im just curious, as the ones who seem to go looking for fights, are the ones who complain that taekwondo isn't doing for them, what they have expected.

[QUOTE]Originally posted by Taekwondobob:
Someone also said that sparring is no good for street fighting, and that it is "just a sport". So is every other martial arts when you pay to learn it lmao![/QUOTE]
When sparring in a dojang/dojo you are doing so against an opponent that is abiding by the same rules as yourself, such as the amount of contact, techniques uesd, etc, etc.

In doing so you conciously and subconciously perform combinations based on your best performed scoring techniques. As a consequence your combinations are set as muscle memory. Muscle memory is a fantastic tool when sparring. Just wait for the right 'window' and perform the combination without even thinking about it - fantastic!

On the street you don't have the luxury of rules or 'back ground' info of your opponent. When I fought (sparred) at national level I knew (studied) all of my opponents as they did me, this can't be done with an aggressor on the street.

When street fighting you need to be open minded and act to the situation accordingly in the blink of an eye. Your action is determined by your opponents action and reactions. This is where muscle memory can work against you.

I hope that makes sense.

[QUOTE]Originally posted by Taekwondobob:
Just a question for everyone, how many of you, since you've been doing taekwondo, have gone and actualy looked for fights?

im not having a go at anyone there, but im just curious, as the ones who seem to go looking for fights, are the ones who complain that taekwondo isn't doing for them, what they have expected.[/QUOTE]
Personally, I never 'looked' for street fights - never did and never will.
However, when working as a Doorman certain individuals had to be physically engaged in a pro-active or pre-emptive way, for the safety of customers, other Doormen and myself.

I learnt (nearly) everything the hard way, I had to walk the walk and adjust my TKD techniques accordingly. I teach my students TKD techniques with the hard work (fault finding/trouble shooting) already done. Therefore my students trust my judgement, as they should/would any Instructor worth his salt.

Take care,

Gaffer.