Broken neck/back

Two days after Christmas I was in a car accident. The car flipped a few times and hit a few trees. Somehow everyone made it out alive and apparently with no injury. I went to the hospital that night where they simply chose to give me a pain shot for the glass in my head and send me home. They would do know more until they had insurance information. Days go by and Im training as usual. I have some degree of pain and stiffness but i attribute it to being banged aroound in the accident. A week later, yesterday to be exact, I was able to go back to the doctor after filing suit against the insurance company. Ive since come to find out that My neck and back were both fractured. As well as my shoulder requiring surgery to repair the rotator cup. One of my major goals in MA has always to compete globally one day. Do I pusue it now or play it safe and watch my dream fade away over the years?

Sorry to hear about your troubles Chen, I doubt I can ever try to fathom how you feel. Has your doctor talked to you about how much time/rest you need before you can be fully mobile/fightable, or is it a permanent injury for you?
Personally I would try to take it easy (easier) for at least a little bit as to not aggravate anything. But in no way would I try to dictate anything to you, I wish you the best in all of your pursuits and a full and fast recovery.

Joel

That was so sad, it seriously nearly made me cry.

I can't imagine watching a dream like that swirl down the toilet . . . Man, you rest and heal well, and then pursue your dream to the fullest!

First, thank God you and all involved lived.
You are very lucky the neck/back fractures were not severely fractured, otherwise you would be dead or paralyzed.

Take time, heal up, rehab. Talk to a sports medicine doctor/physical therapist about how realistic it is for you to compete. Then go from there.

Im going back to the doctor tomorrow. He said that the injuries are serious and if they cant be fixed then the damage will be permanent. He said if thats the case then Ill be drawing disability by the time Im thirty.

Hey Chen,
So sorry to hear about your accident. Remember when Bruce Lee had his back injury, he wrote a book,did research,and things of tha nature. I would suggest doing thing like that,one day you will return to your training,but first and foremost take care of yourself. Don't do anything to prolong your injuries.
By the way I'd sue the hospital for not taking care of you better! Regardless of your insurance they have a responsibility to take care of their patients not to turn them loose with broken bones!!
Take care and keep us posted.

Wow. I honestly don't know what to say here Chen. All I can do is wish you the very best.

I injured my shoulder in a car wreck 3 years ago. The damage wasn't that bad at first, i really didn't even notice anything till a year later. It ultimately ruined two years of training and working out for me. Now that the problem is "fixed", still hurts like hell at times, i'm having to work twice as hard to get back into shape and pick up my training where i left off.

My advice, listen to the doc. Do what ever it takes to heal properly, even if it means taking some time off. Otherwise you might not have a choice to quit or not.

Dayum, you're a bad-ass mofo.

Be careful. No training or dream is worth incapacitation of the kind you are now threatened with.

[QUOTE]Originally posted by Stampede:
Dayum, you're a bad-ass mofo.[/QUOTE]

I dont know about that.

However, if you only had one dream what lengths would you go through to keep it alive?

[QUOTE]Originally posted by Chen Zen:
However, if you only had one dream what lengths would you go through to keep it alive? [/QUOTE]

Good idea for a thread, but I doubt I could answer that. I don't like to play "what if" or fantasy games like that, because there are so many other variables that go along with a questoin like that.

It's like saying "what would you do if a guy came up to you and...?" Well, it all depends on who what when where how how(many) and why. Too many variables for me to just say "I'd do this..."

now that I've rambled I'm going to bed.
goodnight, heal well

Joel

[QUOTE]Originally posted by Chen Zen:
Two days after Christmas I was in a car accident. The car flipped a few times and hit a few trees. Somehow everyone made it out alive and apparently with no injury. I went to the hospital that night where they simply chose to give me a pain shot for the glass in my head and send me home. They would do know more until they had insurance information. Days go by and Im training as usual. I have some degree of pain and stiffness but i attribute it to being banged aroound in the accident. A week later, yesterday to be exact, I was able to go back to the doctor after filing suit against the insurance company. Ive since come to find out that My neck and back were both fractured. As well as my shoulder requiring surgery to repair the rotator cup. One of my major goals in MA has always to compete globally one day. Do I pusue it now or play it safe and watch my dream fade away over the years?[/QUOTE]

The only one who can kill yor dream is you. Look at all the special olympics athletes and they'll tell you the same. Imagine what the martial arts community would be like if bruce lee listened to the doctors when they said that he would never be able to do martial arts again after he severely injured his spine? he was better after the injury than he was before it. if you truely believe in your heart of hearts that this is the path for you then do it! don't let then nay sayers and others put thier insecurities on you and keep you down. be smart adn listen to the doctors advice, but get lots of opinions and make the best decision for you. i'd take this time for personal reflection as i'm sure your doing, but if it were me i'd be learnin all i could about the human body and reading alot of inspirational stories. but thats just me adn i'm not one to let anyone or anything keep me down. stay motivated, be positive and believe that one day you'll be competing on the world stage.

p.s. look how many times jackie chan broke, busted, or fractured something adn he's still going.

Everyone who tells me I can't, gives me another reason, another motivation, that I can. ~Me

Sorry to hear about your accident. I know it must be hard for you. I would listen to the doctors in the beginning, then ease back into training, taking it easy at first. Follow your dreams, without them, we are only ordinary.

As the old masters say, Get knocked down 7 times, get up 8. Hope you get well, and that your dreams become your reality.

coxne

Hey CZ

Sorry to hear about your accident.

On the other hand I saw a program the other day about a lady who was born with no arms due to the Thalidomide drug problem.

She is now a mother of two, cooks using her feet, and is a professional make up artist. (Yes, she does the girls make up using her feet.)

Who are you to give up on your dreams so easily just because you got hurt.

With Sympathy [IMG]http://www.fightingarts.com/forums/ubb/wink.gif[/IMG]

JohnL

Hope you make a speedy recovery Chen and I am glad that everyone made it out alive.

A little scary that you were sent home from the hospital without having the broken neck/back diagnosis. You could have caused more damage to yourself without even knowing it.

I hope the insurance people don't try to weasel out paying your claim though because the injury was diagnosed after you went training. These guys always seem to try to find an excuse for not paying up.

Good luck and get well.

Chen

So very sorry to hear about your injuries, thank goodness no one was killed.

You have my deepest sympathy and sincere best wishes for recovery.
Sharon

I don't mind when the world spits in my plate of foot, but when the drools on someone elses grub, someone who is obviously a better person then myself (Pretty much everyone), it really irks me.

I'm sorry to hear of your misfortune ...and to answer the question of dreams ...Nothin is more important then followin'em. One thing I have personally learned in my life, is wondering "What if" is one of the worst things. When you die, you want to be able to say "Ya, I followed my dreams. I did that. What about you?"

Variables be damned ...people make everything so complicated with variables and fine print that they forget it's really very simple. You can't have a contract without the rules, and the bulk of the writing and regulations ....but you can, without the fine print.

Follow'em bud

-Ket

Chen Zen -

Very sorry to hear about your accident.

Sounds like you are lucky to be alive.

Don't kill your dream just yet...

Work on your recovery, then decide on how "permanent" your injuries are. You are going to be a better judge than ANY doctor.

It may take a while. Be patient.

Don't give up yet.

[This message has been edited by MattJ (edited 01-07-2005).]

Chen Zen I can empathise with your situation, although my neck injury is perhaps not as serious as yours, and I am 41 already so.
I do enjoy a very active life however, and take a lot of risks sometimes. This is something I will have to face and live with from here on in, my neck will get really bad if I hurt it like this again. I have had trouble, and a fair bit of pain before, but never a numbed out arm.

I do not have real aspireations of even winning an amature muay thai belt, I just LOVE to fight.( ok I was thinking maybe, and thinking how cool it would be to do that and be over 40) Mostly I fight just because I LOVE to fight. Sparring is fun but its like masturbation, the real thing is better. Sparring with a better fighter that has enough "dragon" to control my "tiger", is almost as good. BUT sparring is not fighting, and it is fighting that I crave, it is like food or sex to me, or both, it is part of the "essence" of life..

Having to face the fact that I will most likely never again be able to unleash my "tiger", exept in real selfdefence has been very hard....one of my "spirit helpers" is a mother cougar, it that is probably the main one, I have ALWAYS been a predator.

(you can make whatever you want of that, I am certainly not evil, its just what I am.)

This injury has helped me see why I have been fighting my whole life....what it is I am really fighting for so to speak...I have known for a few years now its NOT about my ego, as I have very little interest in that part of me.

I don`t know what your spiritual ideas are, seems some here are like me and take this stuff very seriuosly, for me MA is just a small part of a much bigger picture, there is a reason that is was the "monks" who taught this stuff.

If it helps think of it this way. Your creator just may be trying to show you something about yourself, I believe he pretty much always is....



[This message has been edited by WildBill (edited 01-07-2005).]

[QUOTE]Originally posted by WildBill:
Chen Zen I can empathise with your situation, although my neck injury is perhaps not as serious as yours, and I am 41 already so.
I do enjoy a very active life however, and take a lot of risks sometimes. This is something I will have to face and live with from here on in, my neck will get really bad if I hurt it like this again. ( it most likely will with time any way, but I would like a few more years of active life yet, there will be time later to write, I hope...) I have had trouble, and a fair bit of pain before, but never a numbed out arm.

I do not have real aspireations of even winning an amature muay thai belt, I just LOVE to fight.( ok I was thinking maybe, and thinking how cool it would be to do that and be over 40) Mostly I fight just because I LOVE to fight. Sparring is fun but its like masturbation, the real thing is better. Sparring with a better fighter that has enough "dragon" to control my "tiger", is almost as good. BUT sparring is not fighting, and it is fighting that I crave, it is like food or sex to me, or both, it is part of the "essence" of life..

Having to face the fact that I will most likely never again be able to unleash my "tiger", exept in real selfdefence has been very hard....one of my "spirit helpers" is a mother cougar, it that is probably the main one, I have ALWAYS been a predator.

(you can make whatever you want of that, I am certainly not evil, its just what I am.)

This injury has helped me see why I have been fighting my whole life....what it is I am really fighting for so to speak...I have known for a few years now its NOT about my ego, as I have very little interest in that part of me.

I don`t know what your spiritual ideas are, seems some here are like me and take this stuff very seriuosly, for me MA is just a small part of a much bigger picture, there is a reason that is was the "monks" who taught this stuff.

If it helps think of it this way. Your creator just may be trying to show you something about yourself, I believe he pretty much always is....


Oh crap..now he is telling me to pay attention to the details...so I don`t f..up and double post...sorry.
[This message has been edited by WildBill (edited 01-07-2005).][/QUOTE]



[This message has been edited by WildBill (edited 01-07-2005).]

CZ,

I know about dreams and I know about realities....the problem you face might be this: you might later be in a better position do shape up for competion, but is it really worth it to proceed right now? I believe you are fairly young, at least younger than I am.

I have had two martial arts friends, and one MA acquaintence, suffer pretty bad injuries. One had to have reconstructive surgery on a knee for letting it go too long and practicing while injured. Another, who actually learned Muay Thai in Thailand (he's back there now)who also has a blackbelt in Sambo and purple belt BJJ, got his neck cranked so badly by another BJJ stylist from Brazil, that he suffered a cracked vertabrae in his neck. Basically, the Doc told him to hold up for a long while....you take a weird punch or you land wrong on the mat...and game's over...for good.

Now, what do you want to do? Can you moderate your MA journey for a bit or focus on other goals within MA? What about teaching and passing on what you have acquired so painstakenly?

Life is about dreams, about changes...and about sacrifices...sometimes through these events your true character is revealed and how you pursue your life afterwards shows more what a real MA is than any competition you might have one. (I have met some very good fighters, some of whom I would never invite home to have dinner with my wife and myself because they are asses. Some people are great people, just not that good at MA.)
Good people and good champions are not always the same thing.

You never know, your real understanding...and appreciation of MA might be around the corner because of the situation you are in and what you have to do to overcome it.

Here's wishing you well in this new year.

-B

I've had too many injuries so take it from me, rest and heal. You'll do more harm then good if you start back too soon back. And then like me you will be living with pains that impede your performance. Not to mention problems that may arise from the insurance company if they see you working hard and you are claiming. But don't ever give up your dreams.

Like mentioned above about Bruce Lee. And there are plenty of others such as Chris Benoit (broken neck) and Adam Copeland a.k.a. Edge (broken neck). They may be in the WWE but the stuff they do to their bodies is real. Their love and passion for what they do did not get hindered by their injuries. Don't get me wrong, they still feel pain and you may as well ... I do ... but it just makes you a different person ... sometimes for the better.

Take care of yourself and look to the future ... the future you want. Because if you don't try for your dreams you will always look back wondering, worrying and may end up hating yourself. It is better to try and if you can't then at least you can be satisfied.

I'm sorry to hear about your accident. Kind of puts the fragility of life into perspective.

"Dreams" are a pretty intense subject, and I can't presume to tell you what's best for your life. But I can encourage you that even if certain dreams have to die, life doesn't have to be over, and it can be even better than before.

As an alumnus of Hard-Knocks-University (sorry for the cheese), I have been through a lot, and have had to face the realities of certain passions and dreams becoming impossible for various reasons. At first the concept of finality was overwhelming and incredibly depressing. But after a while, I was still alive, and eventually came to realize that the world is a vast, and often painfully beautiful place; that it held innumerable possibilities, and that as long as my heart was still beating I should be appreciating it.

I began exploring a bit, and discovered so many things that moved me, intrigued me, and excited me about life, and the world. I felt like I had been cheating myself by only focusing on one aspect for so long. So eventually, from the ashes of old dreams new ones were born.

I think that while dreams are very good, sometimes they can leave you too focused on them for your own good.

I realize most people will say, "OMG never forsake your dreamz! Then u'll have nothin left!!!1 lol!" But that's the movie answer, where all you need is willpower to overcome anything, and then you are back to normal. In the real world sometimes it's really best to be rational with yourself, weigh your pros and cons, and if necessary, find another passion (or a variation on your first).

I don't mean to sound pessimistic, on the contrary, if you were able to train "as usual" with minor side-effects, I would imagine there is a high likelihood of effective recovery.

I just don't like seeing people stuck on something so much that they can't see the bigger picture. (The trillion dollar thread comes to mind) Think for yourself, challenge conventions, there is always another possible answer that's not listed on the test.

I don't know that any of this is applicable to you Chen Zen, but I just wanted to try to offer a different point of view from the traditional "never give up, never surrender"

Sometimes there's more to be gained from moving on.

[QUOTE]Originally posted by Ket:
I don't mind when the world spits in my plate of foot, but when the drools on someone elses grub, someone who is obviously a better person then myself (Pretty much everyone), it really irks me

-Ket[/QUOTE]

Im no better than anyone else. Im just a man, and at 23 Im hardly that, according to some.

I thank you all for your thoughtful concerns and replies. I have not done any training since. The doctors have informed me that the pain will be permanent. Im now scheduled for rehab 3 days a week. My spirits are high, however. Late last night i sat and thought deeply on what I wish to do, need to do, and how badly I wanted each of those things.
What I do has become my life. My training has become reason to get up and get out. But also I still seek to do new things. Learn new things and to show them to people. Thats one of the reasons Ive been a daily contributor here for two years. I also visit 3 other sites one of which I help moderate other than this one.
Having friends like I have here; this place is my favorite. I have decided that I will give in despite my urges.Instead I will investigate small circle jujitsu and teach what I already know. I am going to use the settlement money to fund a dojo. But until then much reading and resting.

JohnL, Thanx.

God keep you buddy, may your dreams and sucesses never die.

Good luck and best of wishes.

All the best Chen. Let yourself heal.

Regds
Mr V

[QUOTE]Originally posted by Chen Zen:
I dont know about that.

However, if you only had one dream what lengths would you go through to keep it alive? [/QUOTE]

Hi, bud. Sorry (I mean it!!!) to hear what happened.
Reading your question above, the answer that came to me was in two parts:

1. Don't lose hope. For one, you're what, 23- 24 now? And obviously in great shape, from the way you describe your training regimen. It's often amazing how rapidly and well a strong, young bod heals. For another, docs are notorious pessimists. When my nephew was barely months old a doc "detected" a "symptom" that he said could lead to a condition that would've caused blindness, mental problems, on and on and on. After putting the fear of God into my poor brother and sister- in- law, you should see the kid today. He's 19, and almost as athletic as you. Add to that the present climate of lawsuits for malpractice, and these guys have turned into even greater prophets of gloom & doom. Hey, guy, you're still in the testing stage. Wait and see. Worse comes to worse, deal and heal, then see how realistic it would STILL be to pursue your dream. As one of the guys posted earlier, everybody knows of Bruce Lee's back problems, plus the fact that he had a leg an inch or two shorter than the other. In spite of that, he overcame and became what he was.
It's cause for hope that you were able to train as usual after the accident.

2. Now, say the worst happens and you can't fulfill your dream. Chen, buddy, that's ONE dream. At 23 you have a UNIVERSE of other dreams to choose from. You love the MA, and that's been your focus to date. But reading your posts it's also obvious that there's a HECK of a good brain under that skull you insist on banging against other folks' fists and feet. God knows what might happen if you put that will and intensity of yours that you reserve for JKD into an intellectual field, for example. Dr. Cory Tutor, Nobel Prize winner in astrophysics?

Good luck, bud, and let's hope for the best. As you can see, there's a bunch of us pulling for you. Let us know what's what.

Your dreams are not necessarily over. Lots of sport guys got injured one way or the other and were able to recover.

Hold your health, well being and existence over self-fulfilment.

Take it easy.


Lok

Life is strange this way.

You sound like the kind of person who will become stronger as a result of such an experience.

I'll keep you in my thoughts.

--Dallas

The year 1996
I have trained hard for years,and have achieved many things. In the martial arts I was competing in Karate under the Ottawa Wado Kai Banner.
I weight in at 225 lbs cut,a solid tank, at the prime height of 5,6 feet. My techniques exellent,as I prepared for the Nationals.

At this point in my life fighting in these competitions was my fire/spirit/passion.

In Jan of that year I was diagnosed with TC. Cancer at the age of 26 years old. Radical surgery and a few long months of chemotherapy later,I weight in a t 168 lbs. Furthermore my strength had lapsed,it was a godly effort to go up three flights of stairs. My bokken,which burned my time with passion,as I would practice many times during the day layed at the end of my bed. I was unable to hold it.

My dreams broken...

No,the true path was laid out for me. Find strength Chen,friends,family always count in these times. Heal... & take up something new.The path will be shown to you in time. New dreams will become reality,old ones may still be attainable. There is a reason why this has happened,and like you said a miracle everyone survived.

Be strong,accept your new limitations.
Don't dwell on what if's.
You will be stronger after your time of healing.

I was...

Cliche: What does not kill you,makes you stronger...

2005: The Kobun is healthy,wealthy & wise.

I can hardly think of a man so fortunate as myself, to be amongst such company. Ive been rather shaken by the event and the ensuing swirl of events and discussions afterwards.
For me now, it has become a message. As hard as things have been for me in the past year, its been hard to look at what I do have. Ive been reminded all too much of everything I could have lost. I can open my eyes without being reminded of the things and ones I cherish. And that a whole world can change in an instant. Nothing is trivial.
Its also become my strongest opponent. While it is tiring, it also renews faith as it becomes my purpose instead of my burden.
Lastly, this message has told me that I have something to do. And that Im not made of glass. I have strong faith that I will be back. I know me better than anyone. Theres a quote for the quotation thread.

Anyways, had I not had those among you then perhaps I would not have found my path. Thank you all.

Btw Chen Zen, are you by any chance from Jin Wu?? Lol, if you have seen fist of legend then you will get the joke... if not then you probably think I'm a weirdo.
Regardless of what you think I just want to let you know that I'm praying that you get a full recovery and that maybe we can compete against each other in the future when we both have to face each other to decide who is the undisputed master of the universe. :P

Chen/Cory, I You're headstrong,But the sooner you rest the faster you'll heal,& Right now I'm just too upset for words,But i hope you get well soon

Yours truly, Your bro in the MA.

[This message has been edited by Isshinryukid4life (edited 01-08-2005).]

[QUOTE]Originally posted by monkii:
Btw Chen Zen, are you by any chance from Jin Wu?? Lol, if you have seen fist of legend then you will get the joke... if not then you probably think I'm a weirdo.
Regardless of what you think I just want to let you know that I'm praying that you get a full recovery and that maybe we can compete against each other in the future when we both have to face each other to decide who is the undisputed master of the universe. :P[/QUOTE]

From Jing Wu, The best. LOL.

Today was good. I got out and got some air, then sat around a little and did wrist excercises and such. Im not gonna stay down. Just because I cant fly doesnt mean I cant drive. Its just gonna take a little longer to get there.

i think you will find small circle jujutsu very interesting chen.
i had a bad wreck a few years ago as well, hell i drove into the side of a moving freight train. youre doctor is right, it never stops hurting. which is kind of deceptive, my back hurts constantly, but it is just as strong as it was before, so ive found that coping with the pain to be the hardest part...it REALLY REALLY gets old! but hey, is that any reason to quit doing something i love doing? nope.

perhaps a better example would be a friend of mine who is miraculously still the same ol dude he always was. he was driving along and hit a cement wall and flipped the car over, he came half way out the window and the car was trapped on top of him, and drug him under the car for...SOME WAY, we thought we were going to lose him for sure, he almost died right there, he almost tore his ear off, and by the time the paramedics arrived part of the skin around it was already dead so they had to cut it off and sew him back up, he has two huge lacerations on the side of his head, a bigger one on his chest, they had to reconstruct his nose and cheek because they were smashed, both of his wrists were broken, several ribs were broken, his back was broken, and his lungs were full of rocks from eating the pavement. and he still walks around with a smile on his face drinking a beer and smoking a cigarette.

if worst comes to worst maybe youll just have to set NEW goals
i wish you the best.


[This message has been edited by kempo_jujitsu (edited 01-09-2005).]

Chen
I'm so sorry to hear about your accident. Please take the time to rest and heal and do not worry or be bitter and resentful as you heal. Something positive will come up for you

Dear Chen,
I really hope that the healing process is a quick one for you. I have learned many things about injuries and I know that other than you wanting to heal, the people around you will affect you greatly.
The people who you train with, how do they affect you?
Your family and people you are around everyday will also have an affect on you and how quickly you heal.
are the people in your everyday environment supportive of your goals and dreams?
You need a few who are, so keep that in mind.

Goodluck don't let it stop you I will check up on you to see how you are.

Dragonfighter known as by friends ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~Monkeegirl~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~